Article: Zen in Japan is dead

[kieranperez]

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/wildfoxzen/2021/11/the-end-of-zen-in-japan.html?fbclid=IwAR1y0dXjeF-qFCAC9-EazzXRLyUp9IV40ONrWDfD9qOyD3x5iEXq-MXCZ_A

[Space Lizard]

Every spiritual tradition is dead. It's the Kali Yuga, imo.

[kieranperez]

5 minutes ago, Space Lizard said:

Every spiritual tradition is dead. It's the Kali Yuga, imo.

Merely and only an opinion. 

There are plenty of lineages that are still alive and running well. The status of even what Yuga we're in, according to that cosmology, isn't even fully agreed upon on among serious practitioners of yoga and even what the Yuga's even mean. 

Certainly Zen as a spiritual culture is dying in Japan. I've heard similar things of yoga in India as it becomes more and more modernized (however that's just hear-tell and I won't stand on that). That said, there are still plenty of powerful teachers. Most people just don't know them because you wouldn't notice them otherwise. They're just living their life.  Finding serious teachers that are truly deeply awake has always been tough to find. I would also say though it's never been easier with the help of things like the internet. I'm always kind of stunned how many I've actually encountered. Then again, that might just be my karma, luck, and a touch of God's humor at work.

[silene]

In the article, Japanese Zen is characterised as an institutional religion with monasteries,  a priesthood, temples and lineages etc, and it's that aspect is which is undergoing decline, perhaps in tandem with Japan's transition from SD blue to orange. It says less about how the numbers of lay members is trending. 

For most young people today in industrialised countries, becoming a monk or priest is a pretty remote idea. At this time the need for keeping up with cultural change is important. But when I was involved in Zen, one thing that struck me was a rigid and inflexible approach, and an attachment to Japanese culture and language, even when transported to entirely different contexts such as Western Europe. Despite Zen's spiritual purity, it was still basically conservative. Maybe in California it's more flexible and adaptable, I dunno. Signs are it's not moving with the generations.  

But ultimately, the word Zen derives from dhyana, meditation, so no doubt it has plenty of life left. 

Edited November 28, 2021 by silene

[Leo Gura]

Because Zen is just not effective for most people in the modern world.

Take some 5-MeO-DMT. There is your Zen. Spiritual technology must evolve with the times, just like everything else.

People cling to the outdated technologies as if they have value in and of themselves. 

[Thought Art]

I am sure there are aspects of Zen that can be incorporated into a high quality systems for living and philosophy.

5meodmt has been like like taking spiritual steroids for me I think.  (Stares at hand for next 2 hours only seeing utter perfection) So I recommend it to someone who can take it with care, and proper research and protocols and is willing to bare the consequences of what it reveals and their reactions to the substance.

It does require a lot of care, protocols, and respect where meditation is more relaxed (obviously)

Still learning about it tbh. Honoured to be here on this frontier in this part of history, learning about it, making mistakes, improving and loving! Tip: Just let go.. don't move around (: 

I personally still think daily meditation and contemplation is a pillar for psychedelic use...

Edited November 28, 2021 by Thought Art

[Space Lizard]

That's the Kali Yugan mentality: change with the times, keep up with the culture; nothing is eternally true or worth preserving. That's why every spiritual tradition is dead; because Progress has become God, and having any fixed tradition is heretical. 

[Thought Art]

@Space Lizard Interesting.

The idea of a religion staying the same is sort of trying to go against God which is constant change. 

[Space Lizard]

Your god maybe, not everyone's.

[Thought Art]

@Space Lizard Lol, there is a difference between God and religion ideas of God.

Reality, the one we are in... is constantly changing.

[Space Lizard]

@Thought Art Changing, yet it has constant laws or principles or gods.

[kieranperez]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Take some 5-MeO-DMT. There is your Zen. Spiritual technology must evolve with the times, just like everything else.

Lol

[Bojan V]

@Space Lizard Tradition and progress are only two notions which belong to traditional and modern worldview.

Satya Yuga is beyond both.

[Thought Art]

10 hours ago, Space Lizard said:

@Thought Art Changing, yet it has constant laws or principles or gods.

Maybe.. It depends on the 'laws'

There are certainly structural aspects of the human experience that remain. But, most human systems are changing all the time. Notice how every second of your life there is a change from one moment to the next.