How To Solve Organized Crime?

[Rilles]

With stage Yellow thinking? Its becoming a huge problem in my country of Sweden, the police are basically helpless and my family and friends have both been close to incidents, one time a smaller bomb exploded in a doorway 2 minutes from my friends house, it was a scare tactic used to scare a lawyer. How do you solve this Wicked Problem at the root? 
 

Ps. Please dont blame immigration or race as obviously not all immigrants are criminals, this problem is causing alot of suffering for them too as they live in the neighbourhoods where these gangs operate. Lets keep this civil. If the thread goes uncivil I will close it.

 

[AdroseAkise]

I guess you guys have to go back and reinforce the BLUE law and order.

[Loba]

I agree, you need some blue to keep red under control.  Red doesn't listen to reason, and most red can't progress farther than where they are at.
Honestly, the best yellow tactic will be to focus on integrating the children of immigrants.  So, proper education and access to resources.  The second generation will have an easier time and are less likely to get radicalized if they have a fair chance.

[PurpleTree]

56 minutes ago, Rilles said:

 

Ps. Please dont blame immigration or race as obviously not all immigrants are criminals, this problem is causing alot of suffering for them too as they live in the neighbourhoods where these gangs operate. Lets keep this civil. If the thread goes uncivil I will close it.

 

I'm sorry but i do think it's partly because of immigration.

Sweden even though once being wikings and tough mother f'ers and stuff became soft-ish and comfortable when they became developed.

Many of those criminals come from war torn countries and have lots of trauma and have seen more violence, get hit by their fathers and are more violent. Swedes probably often don't want to fight till their death, they don't even have it in them, but some of those people from those regions do want that.

It's often just not a great mix imo. I've seen it in my country as many kids from my soft-ish, developed country were bullied by immigrants or kids from immigrants from "harder" environments like the balkans, turkey, middle east and so on. And the teachers never really helped because they were so soft.

 

 

how do you solve it? We (western european soft-ish countries) probably have to become tougher, which sucks

because i want us, europe, the world to move into the direction of love and oneness not of becoming tougher

Edited November 19, 2021 by PurpleTree

[Rilles]

1 hour ago, Loba said:

I agree, you need some blue to keep red under control.  Red doesn't listen to reason, and most red can't progress farther than where they are at.
Honestly, the best yellow tactic will be to focus on integrating the children of immigrants.  So, proper education and access to resources.  The second generation will have an easier time and are less likely to get radicalized if they have a fair chance.

Thats a really good one but quite difficult and takes a long time, but its obviously important.

@PurpleTree I meant as in blaming immigrants as if there is something inherently wrong with them rather than a circumstantial issue. Of course the trauma that comes with fleeing from war torn countries has to be taken into account.

 

[Raze]

4 hours ago, Rilles said:

With stage Yellow thinking? Its becoming a huge problem in my country of Sweden, the police are basically helpless and my family and friends have both been close to incidents, one time a smaller bomb exploded in a doorway 2 minutes from my friends house, it was a scare tactic used to scare a lawyer. How do you solve this Wicked Problem at the root? 
 

Ps. Please dont blame immigration or race as obviously not all immigrants are criminals, this problem is causing alot of suffering for them too as they live in the neighbourhoods where these gangs operate. Lets keep this civil. If the thread goes uncivil I will close it.

Conduct a large study of captured gang members and find the things in their life which are common among them but less common among non gang members, and find things that correlate with a life of crime.

in the USA some of these things are childhood lead poisoning, fatherlessness, etc.

Whatever is found, create programs or restructure society to reduce them and compensate for them when they do happen.

Find out the motivations for the creation of gangs and create alternatives to sap away whatever demand they have. If the gang makes money from selling drugs, create a legal alternative for addicts, if the gang creates a sense of community among wayward young men, create alternative communities that can be joined instead that do not rely on crime.

Edited November 19, 2021 by Raze

[Loba]

@Rilles Yeah, it does take a long time, but to me, it feels the most humane, by the second or third generation they will be mixed in with the culture - but if they are partitioned off too much then the newer generations will not integrate as well; that's what happened in America when we partitioned off certain cultures, they developed subcultures and some of them stayed red/blue because of limited resources.

If your country can provide good schooling and housing for immigrants, then by the third generation, they should be pretty much integrated.

@Raze Awesome suggestions for the current problems.

[Rilles]

Using the Leverage Points by Donella Meadows from weak change to strongest change.

 

 

7. Create harsher sentencing but this doesnt solve the problem at the root, it merely puts a bandaid on it.

 

6. Seizing illegal weapons and drugs especially coming over Öresunds bridge and from Balkan. Doesnt solve the problem at the root it only creates a minor change.

 

5. Make gang communication more difficult. Use wiretapping and create strong neighbour watches. Quite difficult because information flows are usually very hidden.

 

4. Decriminalize all drugs. This one is huge but the Swedish government zero tolerance policy makes none of the politicians even want to bring up the issue for fear of becoming a black sheep.
 

3. Improve integration and improve neighbours, give inhabitants a feeling of having an economic future and not feel like outsiders. Very important but takes a long time and requires a big structural change, violence will continue for a while until the system is restructured.

 

2. Incentivize gang members to make money legally instead of illegally. Very difficult.

 

1. Make gang members realize crime doesnt pay by changing the paradigm, get them from RED to BLUE, almost impossible.

 

Edited November 19, 2021 by Rilles

[Preety_India]

 

By rounding up people who act like hooligans and placing them in cages forever. That's how you keep the streets safe. 

If the police is acting passive, you can't do much about it. 

This has everything to do with how strong the law enforcement is when it comes to dealing with gangs. Yes its tough obviously. 

But once you get a few gang members in prison they can snitch on other members and you get the whole gang in prison. 

Any youth that shows even little signs of radicalization needs to be quarantined in remand homes or rehabs designed for potential criminals and terrorists. 

You need an intelligence unit or task force especially designed to target radicalized groups and arrest them immediately if they have been seen storing guns, weapons, bombs, ammunition. 

That's the best that can be done. Also public ostracism of radicalized teenagers or adults can help discourage others from joining such outfits. 

Control immigration and carry strict background checks and verifications on immigrants to avoid potential criminals. 

Although this might sound like racial Profiling, public security is more important than any racial bias claims. 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2021 by Preety_India

[Rilles]

7 hours ago, Preety_India said:

 

By rounding up people who act like hooligans and placing them in cages forever. That's how you keep the streets safe. 

How do you stop it at the root? Throwing people in cages wont stop recruiting.

If the police is acting passive, you can't do much about it. 

Its not so much that they are passive, the problem is that the criminals are one step ahead because the spread of gangs is massive. 

This has everything to do with how strong the law enforcement is when it comes to dealing with gangs. Yes its tough obviously. 

But once you get a few gang members in prison they can snitch on other members and you get the whole gang in prison. 

Thats actually a good point, I would see that as increasing the information flow in the system. 

Any youth that shows even little signs of radicalization needs to be quarantined in remand homes or rehabs designed for potential criminals and terrorists. 

That could lead to alot of racial profiling which would exacerbate the problem, everyone is innocent until proven guilty.

You need an intelligence unit or task force especially designed to target radicalized groups and arrest them immediately if they have been seen storing guns, weapons, bombs, ammunition. 

That's the best that can be done. Also public ostracism of radicalized teenagers or adults can help discourage others from joining such outfits. 

Control immigration and carry strict background checks and verifications on immigrants to avoid potential criminals. 

Although this might sound like racial Profiling, public security is more important than any racial bias claims. 

 

 

 

[Preety_India]

 

@Rilles

I mean there will be pros and cons to every solution. You won't have a perfect  system that is foolproof without collateral damage. 

 

[Woke456]

If you want to solve organized crime, the hate speech toward stage blue needs to stop.  Blue solves it, no one else.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Woke456

[PurpleTree]

19 hours ago, Loba said:

@RillesIf your country can provide good schooling and housing for immigrants, then by the third generation, they should be pretty much integrated.

 

actually not necessarily

funny enough in some european countries sometimes the younger generation of immigrants are more criminal, more religious and less integrated than the older generation. the first generation or the second might have tried hard to integrate and did fairly well. and then some younger generations are more disillusioned and might become religious fanatics etc. isis showed that too

[Carl-Richard]

Construct a society where crime is not an attractive survival strategy for anyone, heal intergenerational trauma and enjoy. It's kinda "duh", but there is literally no other way if you want to fix the root problems.

[Rilles]

12 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Construct a society where crime is not an attractive survival strategy for anyone, heal intergenerational trauma and enjoy. It's kinda "duh", but there is literally no other way if you want to fix the root problems.

I mostly do these threads to exercise my holistic thinking but yeah I agree. 

[Baum]

remove internet access,  play only children cartoons on tv and classical music.

[Arcangelo]

Universal Legalization of ALL drugs

[Baum]

14 minutes ago, Arcangelo said:

Universal Legalization of ALL drugs

not a good idea to legalize cocaine and opioids.

[Arcangelo]

meth, everything.

My body my choice.

What you resist persists

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Baum said:

not a good idea to legalize cocaine and opioids.

Why?