Pickup feels fake and low conscious

[Loba]

@mandyjw I don't want to attract men, I've grown out of that quite a long time ago; that isn't my intent. 
My point is, I really dislike how the majority of men view women; if you haven't lived in a city, or dealt with certain types of guys you just won't understand.  It is a problem, for sure.  This generation has ruined women, and then they wonder why there's feminism, to counter it.  Also, I believe in reincarnation and I don't want to get karmically stuck dealing with someone for lifetimes from 'this' generation.  It would be the equivalent of letting a tick suck on my blood.

I already jumped over the wave, it came at me like in ... 2020? I was suppose to self-love into following it, but I think the whole idea is really tacky.
The masculine is already a part of the feminine if you're integrated enough you just end up not really needing it/being able to do things for yourself/live for yourself, and seeing this stuff for what it is becomes easier.

[Nahm]

55 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

You see, this is something I wish I was emotionally mature enough and self actualized to feel and see. I feel slight resentment towards my gf that we didn't have sex the night we met but 6 days later  Cause I'm sure she has had sex with other guys the night she met them. I've had ONS with other women so I get it. It still doesn't sit right with me she held it from me for a few days cause she liked me so much when I'm sure a guy who just wanted a fuck and was forward about it got it sooner. A lot of men today feel they have to sort of live up to a certain seductive standard and life style or else they are seen as "weak" or undesirable as a man. I've had my head filled with plenty of this garbage as well and can't help but feel it tug at me sometimes. I do feel this force that I need X number of sexual partners before finding a wife, have to be player statue or else I'm "beta", etc. None of this shit really feels good to think about and is kinda toxic. There is some helpful stuff in it for sure cause a lot of guys that get into pick up are huge push overs and they probably needed something to toughen them up and motivate them a bit but it becomes a huge trap after a certain point. Male dating advice can be helpful but it needs to be balanced with consciousness. 

Appreciated, but I gotta say, I was like twenty. It wasn’t a matter of being emotionally mature at all, it was a matter of no internet yet, no pick up yet, and just being, non-influenced. All the alpha beta, body count, etc, etc, ime is a recent thing, and also imo it’s all rooted in as you say, toxicity, or more specifically an averted manipulative mindset. The real head scratcher for me that really leaves me feeling lucky I’m old, is that females actually like & appreciate the psychology behind pick up. That might be a very nuanced generational thing or something.  

[Etherial Cat]

2 minutes ago, Nahm said:

The real head scratcher for me that really leaves me feeling lucky I’m old, is that females actually like & appreciate the psychology behind pick up. That might be a very nuanced generational thing or something.  

Yo. Are we invisible to you?  

[Nahm]

@Etherial Cat

lol! I see ya! You’re exceptional. 

[hyruga]

1 hour ago, Lyubov said:

You see, this is something I wish I was emotionally mature enough and self actualized to feel and see. I feel slight resentment towards my gf that we didn't have sex the night we met but 6 days later  Cause I'm sure she has had sex with other guys the night she met them. I've had ONS with other women so I get it. It still doesn't sit right with me she held it from me for a few days cause she liked me so much when I'm sure a guy who just wanted a fuck and was forward about it got it sooner. A lot of men today feel they have to sort of live up to a certain seductive standard and life style or else they are seen as "weak" or undesirable as a man. I've had my head filled with plenty of this garbage as well and can't help but feel it tug at me sometimes. I do feel this force that I need X number of sexual partners before finding a wife, have to be player statue or else I'm "beta", etc. None of this shit really feels good to think about and is kinda toxic. There is some helpful stuff in it for sure cause a lot of guys that get into pick up are huge push overs and they probably needed something to toughen them up and motivate them a bit but it becomes a huge trap after a certain point. Male dating advice can be helpful but it needs to be balanced with consciousness. 

Nah your girl did well. Playing hard to get (sex) is one of the best strategies for a girl to build a lifelong relationship. 

[Lyubov]

35 minutes ago, Etherial Cat said:

It's not so much about your girlfriend than the wound you've got in your relationship with other men and the masculine hierarchy, then. You compare yourself to other men in relation to her. She's the proxy to that feeling and you project the resentment on that poor girl.  

Maybe try to do some shadow work in that area. How much of an emotional reaction do you have when hearing the word beta? What is behind it? These sounds like great questions for some private introspection.  

Fair enough, I would say it's more than that though. I feel I'm missing out sometimes on other exciting sexual experiences by choosing to be in a monogamous relationship. I know her past isn't related and has nothing to do with spiting me in any way or anything. We got together by just going with the flow and having fun. I don't really like manipulating stuff and trying to control it when it comes to dating. I get amazing results just being a chill and fun guy. I feel justified in having desires for something more beyond the relationship though and can see how it leads to wanting more new experiences myself. I don't like this word beta though. It's just a cover up for basically "bad." Basically all that toxic pick up BS is just dressing up core beliefs a lot of the guys that get into it have. "I'm bad", a vow they maybe made when they were bullied in school, is just dressed up again as "I"m beta." And so it just pulls all those strings on stuff bellow the surface and tries to change it through overly practical overly manipulative approaches. It's good for building some initial discipline and getting a guy off his ass from playing video games all day but it is very limiting in the long run when it comes to dating and leads to marginal internal changes. 

[Etherial Cat]

4 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Etherial Cat

lol! I see ya! You’re exceptional. 

?

That's it,  @Nahm must be starting Game too!  

[Lyubov]

9 minutes ago, hyruga said:

Nah your girl did well. Playing hard to get (sex) is one of the best strategies for a girl to build a lifelong relationship. 

I'm not sure about that. It may seem like a good way to avoid having a ONS (maybe, some girls won't hook up on the first date with a guy they like cause they are afraid it will be a ONS) but I'm not sure about lifelong relationship. All the same I could of made her a FWB, which I almost originally did. I don't follow your claim.

Edited November 15, 2021 by Lyubov

[Karmadhi]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You can say whatever you want but most women are attracted to low consciousness behavior. Which is why the most low consciousness guys get laid the most and the most conscious guys get laid the least.

It is quite messed up that a female can be high consciouss and very attractive to guys while for guys they need to make a compromise between being very attractive to girls and a high consciouss person.

I almost fucked a girl recently (shit logistics)  and i noticed how easier it was to actually make her get into me and fuck her if i gave 0 shits about her or her agenda. Scary stuff.

 

Edited November 15, 2021 by Karmadhi

[Preety_India]

7 hours ago, unborn_chicken said:

All I conclude from this thread is that endless debate leads nowhere.

In the end everyone will do what they will.

Wisest words lol. 

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Preety_India

[Flowerfaeiry]

2 hours ago, Loba said:

I have a feminine essence, too, it's going to be there no matter what.  I would hate to waste such a treasured thing on someone who was using me as a means to an end.

You can cultivate your femininity. Yes it will always be there, but it does get hidden and pushed down in today’s way of life. 

It’s interesting to see how men respond to that as well. When you are in touch with your heart and how you feel, you’re basically unfuckwithable.

[Nahm]

@Etherial Cat

ooooh boy 

[Leo Gura]

11 hours ago, Ineedanswers said:

@Leo Gura Leo is there any difference between intimate human relationships and the courting process monkeys and other animals go through? I like to think that there is more to human relationships than my reptilian brain/biology provoking me and incentivizing me to reproduce.(similar to the relationships you see onDisney movies and titanic etc).i like to think that human intimitate relationships are highconsiouse and different from the relationships other animals have(which are mainly just to reproduce). But is this actually true? Or is the complexity of our mating strategy blinding me? Similarly to how the complexity of my basic survival(having a job etc) makes me forget that what I’m doing is no different than a bird building a nest.do I just like to think I’m smarter/more special than I am?

Most people underestimate how much their relationships are driven by survival.

Before you can transcend survival you must first face it truthfully.

11 hours ago, Etherial Cat said:

Hum yes, they do. They are link to my emotional system, and I don't get wet for low consciousness guys as they only trigger in me indifference or annoyance.

I am as attracted to low conscious guys holistically as I am let's say intellectually drawn by Donald Trump.

Well, if you're so conscious you should understand that the world does not revolve around you.

You are talking about you. I am giving advice to thousands of men who will be interacting with women who are not you.

I am not going to cater my videos around you. I was targeting men who suck so bad with women you have no idea how much work they have to do to turn that around. I targeted such men because that's what I have massive experience with and it is a serious social problem.

Quote

Most customers in the self-help business in general are attracted to low consciousness behavior, yet you're focusing on attracting a specific audience who can stomach your actual development. But you're using a smart combo of consciousness and survival, which works well for you.

You could do the same with girls.

Imagine if you had spent your whole career on actualized.org making clickbait self-help video on stage Orange subject, because "this is were most people are at".

What's the difference?

Cold approach and getting laid is just an entry point for deep relationships, intimacy, and love -- which I will teach in the future.

You are taking cold approach as mutually exclusive with relationships, which is silly.

The skills a man needs to attract a wife are identical to that of attracting a drunk club slut who's looking to snort coke off a dude's dick.

[Etherial Cat]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Well, if you're so conscious you should understand that the world does not revolve around you.

You are talking about you. I am giving advice to thousands of men who will be interacting with women who are not you.

I am not going to cater my videos around you.

Why make this suddenly about me? I don't think I have been talking about my experience in a significantly different way than the other girls on this forum.

If you are stating assumptions about female sexuality and then directly address mine, I think it's only fair that I give you my own experience as a woman.

I am also not that special. If anything, I have just spent more time introspecting and learning about self-help than the average woman, which makes me also more attuned to what is truly attractive or not to female.

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I was targeting men who suck so bad with women you have no idea how much work they have to do to turn that around. I targeted such men because that's what I have massive experience with and it is a serious social problem.

I get the place you are coming from, and I think this aspect is great.

I'm just concerned about a few particular points, as such as what I see as an excessive focus on survival, and a few misconceptions about female attraction, which ends up being actually disempowering to both genders.

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You are taking cold approach as mutually exclusive with relationships, which is silly.

I see pros and cons in it, and I don't believe it is per se mutually exclusive with relationships.

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

The skills a man needs to attract a wife are identical to that of attracting a drunk club slut who's looking to snort coke off a dude's dick.

...

I've been attempting to give a reply to this, but I'm just gonna give up and not drag it further .

[Etherial Cat]

12 hours ago, Lyubov said:

I don't like this word beta though. It's just a cover up for basically "bad." Basically all that toxic pick up BS is just dressing up core beliefs a lot of the guys that get into it have. "I'm bad", a vow they maybe made when they were bullied in school, is just dressed up again as "I"m beta." And so it just pulls all those strings on stuff bellow the surface and tries to change it through overly practical overly manipulative approaches. It's good for building some initial discipline and getting a guy off his ass from playing video games all day but it is very limiting in the long run when it comes to dating and leads to marginal internal changes. 

I see what you see there. Being beta is associated with danger and a low quality life, as it means being at the bottom of the hierarchy.

For this reason most men overcapitalize on masculinity and reject some parts of themselves because they are afraid it will make them less competitive, which begets an infernal vicious circle.

I think men also wants acceptance and safety from one another as much as they want it from females. A lot of the masculinity need to overcompensate for their lack is found in their relationship with the masculine itself.

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Etherial Cat said:

Why make this suddenly about me? I don't think I have been talking about my experience in a significantly different way than the other girls on this forum.

Because you're looking at this whole dating situation from your POV.

Girls on this forum do not accurately represent the general population of girls that guys will be approaching.

Quote

If you are stating assumptions about female sexuality and then directly address mine, I think it's only fair that I give you my own experience as a woman.

I understand your experience, but your experience does not change what it takes for a guy to attract women.

Quote

I'm just concerned about a few particular points, as such as what I see as an excessive focus on survival, and a few misconceptions about female attraction, which ends up being actually disempowering to both genders.

Yes, for guys, getting laid is a very practical survival issue. That's the guy's agenda.

The getting laid videos were not designed for women, and I don't expect women to like them or to understand how attraction works. Because that is not your agenda and you do not care about the guy's agenda.

If I was making a video series for women, it would be totally different, honoring your agenda.

It's like you walk into a guy's restroom and complain about the urinals. Yes, I get it that you don't care for urinals.

The fundamental issue here is that men and women have different reproductive agendas. Which is why these videos have a very specific and clear target audience. Women should not be watching videos about how to get laid. It's just going to rile you up.

When you take the position that "getting laid doesn't matter", that is your agenda. That's not the guy's agenda. But you want guys to adopt your agenda as the one true agenda. And therein lies the problem because our agendas are different and there is no one true agenda. Which is why I don't bother explaining game to girls. It is not in your agenda to understand it.

[something_else]

13 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

It is quite messed up that a female can be high consciouss and very attractive to guys while for guys they need to make a compromise between being very attractive to girls and a high consciouss person.

Meh. It's also fucked up that a girl could be incredibly high conscious yet not be that attractive to many guys if she isn't physically appealing. At least you have a more control over your attractiveness as a guy

[Leo Gura]

The hottest girls are usually the lowest consciousness simply because their life is so easy that developing consciousness wasn't necessary.

People whose lives are too easy or privileged end up spoiled.

Even good looking guys will often have shit game because they are too spoiled to actually do the hard work necessary to develop game. I would never have developed game if I had girls throwing themselves at me.

And this is why women don't need game. Because it's so easy to get laid as a woman that getting laid isn't even a thing women think about. That's how easy it is. To a woman the idea that getting laid could be a problem hardly even makes sense.

[Gesundheit2]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

The hottest girls are usually the lowest consciousness simply because their life is so easy that developing consciousness wasn't necessary.

Correlation does not equal causation. Homeless people are not necessarily the most conscious, even though they have the hardest lives. Nor does an easy life automatically lower consciousness or handicap its development.

But I don't even agree on the original observation. I think it's mostly genetic and a matter of luck.

Edited November 16, 2021 by Gesundheit2

[zazen]

12 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Correlation does not equal causation. Homeless people are not necessarily the most conscious, even though they have the hardest lives. Nor does an easy life automatically lower consciousness or handicap its development.

But I don't even agree on the original observation. I think it's mostly genetic and a matter of luck.

Leo has to speak in generalisations otherwise to talk about every nuance wouldn't get us anywhere. Of course there are exceptions. We need a certain model or framework to simplify and look at reality within. Hot women get by on their looks and treated like princesses surrounded by yes men that their personalities become entitled and unpleasant in general, then when their looks start to fade and they don't have anything more to offer (ie their femininity intelligence etc) and mens attention goes towards younger hotter women they have an identity crisis. 

 

Sex is easy for women to get, so when women see men struggling to get sex and logically studying it ie pick up, it doesn't automatically compute due to their projection and can automatically see you as a loser for not being able to get sex.  Men and women are different (equal but different) so their mating strategy is different, in the end the men should focus on their agenda and women on theirs, and they come together to a middle ground and settle with each other in a healthy relationship. The compromise is the man stops pursuing unlimited sex, and the women puts other options off to be in the relationship with her best suitor. Men pursue, women subdue. Men take the initiative to go after the women, and women learn to use this initiate in a judo manner to their own end of being good enough to commit to beyond just sex. 

 

When the top shelf men go through sleeping with lots of women, these women get the sense that they are on that level as that guy not realising that these guys just wanted sex and not a relationship. Then these women perceive their value on that level and keep holding out for guys on that level to commit to them, putting off the guys on or near their own level who would love to commit to them. The average guy has no choice but to increase his value in todays dating environment, first to get sex but even more so to maintain a relationship. We can look at modern dating as a problem or puzzle to be solved, pick up and mens advice is attempting to solve the issue but a lot of the information isn't going to make sense to the opposite genders agenda and psychology.