Pickup feels fake and low conscious

[something_else]

26 minutes ago, diamondpenguin said:

But that's the way girls are wired, they want to be totally demolished physically and emotionally. They actually enjoy it, they'd rather get thrown and onto the bed and choked like a rag doll, then have some cute guy sing her a cute poem

Can't blame girls, I'd rather do that than sing a poem as well 

Edited November 14, 2021 by something_else

[Harlen Kelly]

50 minutes ago, SQAAD said:

This pickup business is not about being truly authentic and genuine to who you are. Its all a facade. Changing yourself to fit the criteria of other egoic minds so you are not perceived as ''creepy''. Changing how you truly are because you are afraid of getting rejected. Its just jumping throught hoops to achieve a certain result. It has nothing to do with authenticity.  Pickup is all about doing whatever will work on the mind of a woman. Changing yourself to fit her needs and desires.

Leo is basically telling us that we shouldn't be the way we are. Otherwise we won't attract girls from the social matrix. That is the bottom line. Maybe my authentic self is the shy nerdy type.

Question, do you think ''who you truly are'' (whatever that means) or the self is a behavioral pattern such as shyness or confidence or do you think behavioral patterns are characteristics of the self? 

I ask the question because you allude to behavioral patterns as if they were immutable characteristics or ''who you truly are'' when we already know that a person can manifest a very wide range of behavioral patterns depending upon the environment they find themselves in, they person they are interacting with, etc. 

Edited November 14, 2021 by Harlen Kelly

[Shin]

40 minutes ago, diamondpenguin said:

@Leo Gura How is that repulsive? I think that's cute. It's only repulsive to people who overthink everything and try to turn dating into a computer program. But that's the way girls are wired, they want to be totally demolished physically and emotionally. They actually enjoy it, they'd rather get thrown and onto the bed and choked like a rag doll, then have some cute guy sing her a cute poem. Nature is pretty fucked up if you think about it. 

What would be fucked up is if they weren't attracted to confident, resilient, detached and purposeful men.

None of us would be here today, cause humanity would have never reproduced lol.

Edited November 14, 2021 by Shin

[Harlen Kelly]

1 minute ago, Knowledge Hoarder said:

Shit, maybe I should revert back to my old mindset then. I guess that was true authenticity!

An incel type of guy should never think about changing his behavioral patterns because that would be against ''who he truly is'' (whatever that means). 

I can't find a proper descriptor for such a spurious line of reasoning. 

[Gesundheit2]

17 minutes ago, Knowledge Hoarder said:

I just love this argument. What is being "authentic" according to you? What is authenticity or who we are at this point, if not just a summary of our past behavours and choices?

I know for example, that I changed drastically in the past 5 years. Like, me 5 years ago, and me now, are not even in the same universe in terms of outlook on life, and how I view things. Does that mean I'm no longer authentic??

Shit, maybe I should revert back to my old mindset then. I guess that was true authenticity!

Agreed.

But also, technically speaking, authenticity is an objective thing. But it's in the opposite direction of just staying lazy and not doing anything when your needs aren't being met. Being lazy is objectively inauthentic and unnatural, and it leads to disease and poor functionality in general. Authenticity is constant self-improvement and self-maintenance.

When I see someone saying that X thing is inauthentic, I immediately assume that they're unconscious and just parroting something they heard someone else saying. Ironically, somehow that makes them the least authentic of all, haha.

[unborn_chicken]

You guys are mistaking being "authentic" with resignation or giving up on things you desire because you lack skill or whatever.

The simple truth is WE ARE ALL DIFFERENT.

We all have different personalities. We all want different things from life.

Our emotions, motives and desires are all different.

We are NOT all meant to be casanovas.

We are NOT all meant to be millionaires.

We are NOT all meant to be buddhas.

We are NOT all meant to be good in every single area of life.

SUCCESS means different things for all of us.

The whole point of life is DIVERSITY.

It's not about not developing confidence. It's not about "giving up" and being unhappy forever.

It's about embracing who you are and being successful in your own way, rather than trying to follow somebody else's way of doing things.

Do you really think Doestoevsky would've written all the great literature he wrote if he had been too preoccupied with being flirty and picking up chicks?

Do you really think Bach would've composed all the great music he did?

Do you really think buddha would've realized what he realized?

 

 

Why should the process of becoming confident have to take place in a club or a bar with loud obnoxious music?

Why should it have to take place stopping random chicks in a mall to ask for their number?

Why not just live your life, do the things you want to do and develop confidence in your OWN WAY OF BEING along the way?

If we all tried to be rockstars the world simply wouldn't work.

We NEED people to cook the bread.

We NEED people to farm the wheat that eventually becomes bread.

We NEED people to drive a truck and come pickup your thrash at night.

We need everyone to be exactly what they are, and nothing else.

 

No wonder pickup doesn't work on most girls. Why might that be?

 

Do things your own way. Follow no one.

[Byun Sean]

Pick up is not creepy.

In fact women want sex and intimacy just as much as guys do. 

 

It's much healthier for men and women if men pursue sex consciously rather than unconsciously.

 

Thats what pick up is. It's just a set of ways people have taken note of over the years to make a girl wet and sleep with her which is what she wants 

in the end anyways.

 

Pick up can be done in toxic unhealthy ways for sure where the guy manipulates the girl, uses her for sex, and then ghosts her etc. But it can also be done in healthy ways.

 

It all depends on the guy doing the pick up and his level of consciousness. Not the pick up itself. 

 

 

Edited November 14, 2021 by Byun Sean

[Jacob Morres]

We have to get crystal clear of the traps with PuA. We can't throw pua out the window but there are incomplete philosophies that we must be conscious of 

I think to an extent pickup might diminish authenticity. But at the same time, I think you could pursue pickup with authenticity in mind 

Leo autocorrects part of this in how to be a man part 2

 

Edited November 14, 2021 by Jacob Morres

[Preety_India]

2 hours ago, SQAAD said:

 

This pickup business is not about being truly authentic and genuine to who you are. Its all a facade. Changing yourself to fit the criteria of other egoic minds so you are not perceived as ''creepy''. Changing how you truly are because you are afraid of getting rejected. Its just jumping throught hoops to achieve a certain result. It has nothing to do with authenticity.  Pickup is all about doing whatever will work on the mind of a woman. Changing yourself to fit her needs and desires.

Leo is basically telling us that we shouldn't be the way we are. Otherwise we won't attract girls from the social matrix. That is the bottom line. Maybe my authentic self is the shy nerdy type.

But no, this is not acceptable. You have to fake it to someone else. And act all macho and confident even if you really don't want to. Imagine if  you had to be shy to get laid, then you would just jump through hoops by doing the exact opposite. You would hide your machoness so you could get laid. lol.

You are doing whatever neccesary to manipulate the other person. Its manipulation and acting to get the desired result. You do what works. Not what is authentic. If you are authentic people don't like you. 

Pickup is similar to Robert Greenes Laws of Power where you use techniques to manipulate the other people around you by acting. But i am not blaming pickup. It just doesn't sit well to many higher consciousness people to play all these egoic animalistic survival games. You have to play all these manipulations otherwise women don't respond well. Fake it until you make it. Truth & honesty won't get you laid.

 

Thank you for saying this. 

 

[Javfly33]

6 hours ago, Electron said:

 

Edit: My point is that if, ultimately, "truth" is what is making you attractive and if at the end, self-awareness is going to give you the kind of relationship filled with deep love and intimacy, why not prioritize truth directly (if you can), rather than spending 5-10 years jumping from one 5/10 relationship to another?  Makes sense? 

The question is, can you?
 

No, you can't.

Most guys if put close to a really hot girl, can't be themselves (truth) even if they want.

 

[zazen]

Society / environment nurtures a certain nature out of us, hopefully a healthy sociable one, thats lacking today. If a baby was just to be him/her self and not emulate society / parents it would stay a baby. Manipulation has a bad connotation but everything is being manipulated, I'm manipulating my hands to type this rite now, usually the word is used in a negative way to trick someone, its the place its coming from. If a child is learning how to speak another language and they go practice with someone, do we say their manipulating the other to speak to them back in that language? 

 

What is our authentic self?  There is a greater self in everyone thats waiting to come out. The potential yet to be made potent, action is what sprouts that seed of potential. People when trying new habits are bound to make mistakes but eventually the BEhaviour starts changing the Being and it becomes them, thus no longer an act. Being can change behaviour as can behaviour change being. 

 

When in the past only 40% of males got to reproduce, then agriculture / monogamy came around and every one got partnered up finally men could be themselves even if they were effeminate, soppy romantics, average earners they'd still get a mate. Now that women don't depend on men and can choose the strongest genes, telling men to just be authentic is a disservice and the past patterns of history may repeat where a large cohort of society don't ever get to partner up and reproduce. This is now the wild west. 

 

Women are bound to have a natural instinctive repulsiveness to pick up because evolutionarily, if they mated with weak genes thinking they were strong due to a front or act that would mean death. Men are made valuable, women and children are naturally valued by society for their life giving ability, with out them there is no society. Men build their value, women preserve it. 

Edited November 14, 2021 by zazen

[knakoo]

4 hours ago, SQAAD said:

 

This pickup business is not about being truly authentic and genuine to who you are. Its all a facade. Changing yourself to fit the criteria of other egoic minds so you are not perceived as ''creepy''. Changing how you truly are because you are afraid of getting rejected. Its just jumping throught hoops to achieve a certain result. It has nothing to do with authenticity.  Pickup is all about doing whatever will work on the mind of a woman. Changing yourself to fit her needs and desires.

Leo is basically telling us that we shouldn't be the way we are. Otherwise we won't attract girls from the social matrix. That is the bottom line. Maybe my authentic self is the shy nerdy type.

But no, this is not acceptable. You have to fake it to someone else. And act all macho and confident even if you really don't want to. Imagine if  you had to be shy to get laid, then you would just jump through hoops by doing the exact opposite. You would hide your machoness so you could get laid. lol.

You are doing whatever neccesary to manipulate the other person. Its manipulation and acting to get the desired result. You do what works. Not what is authentic. If you are authentic people don't like you. 

Pickup is similar to Robert Greenes Laws of Power where you use techniques to manipulate the other people around you by acting. But i am not blaming pickup. It just doesn't sit well to many higher consciousness people to play all these egoic animalistic survival games. You have to play all these manipulations otherwise women don't respond well. Fake it until you make it. Truth & honesty won't get you laid.

 

You make some good points, but trust me your authentic self is not shy whatsoever.

Pick up can help to become more authentic in the sense that taking a lot of rejection consciously is a great way to drop parts of your ego.

[Etherial Cat]

The points made by some of the guys are exactly spot on and show some common issues I see from Game. 

What gets girls interested is a man who gets as close as possible to his true nature and then project his authentic signature outwards. Under the unhealthy aspects of your ego, you've got the holly grail you seek: your authentic self and it's truth. The authentic self is what has been usually buried under layers and layers of ego and self-deception. This needs to be progressively rediscovered, and actualized by taking actions and then by letting it unfold progressively, throughout various relevant development lines. I think this is perhaps what @Electron was talking about.

Game is a melting pot of several things. It looks for patterns, mindset, attitude, energy, physiological knowledge, psychological bias exploitation, logistics, tactics, etc, in order to get results. There are really tons of things being tapped on and put together.

Typically, from what I see, Game cross many elements which are part of a healthy development line (or rather many) and maps it on your behalf. This is why it strikes as so correct and obviously a lot of guy gets significantly empowered and manage to pin point where they've been so far off until then...  A lot of guys have a mix of big development line holes and a lack of experiences. It's therefore very useful to hear about concepts like kino escalation to get how to touch a girl, be reminded to go approach girls and get rid of common misconceptions.

The main problem I notice, in guys who are getting into Game is that there is a lag between the pattern they try to emulate and themselves. Because so many of them come from a bereft place in the first place and haven't tapped deep enough in their authentic self, and focus on adding more stuff to themselves on an ego level. It's all just a facade.  Their embodiment will be too superficial as not rooted in the real thing and similar as acting a role. And there is a form of duplicity occurring on the subjective level caused by an inner split between the two realities. If you want to have the real thing you'll got to work on many other life areas and get to the place where the split is unified... and that will not look like Game as talked by Leo.

Another thing that I see is that there will be the case of some men who will take it way too far, and only swear by pick up techniques. All actions they will take with a girl will be monitored through this lens. And to me, there is something off there, like playing a video game with a cheat code. And there first of all this duplicity and that strong impression that if the girl would know what he's up too (and thus his real experience behind the actions, words etc) she'd feel betrayed. And that's something which means real intimacy (intellectual, emotional, etc) between the two individuals is actually made harder. And this is the real reason why guys never dare to talk about pick up with girls. 

If you want to be happy within a relationship, real intimacy is what you want, and that is also what the girl will want ultimately. Game is serious challenge to intimacy and vulnerability. I see a lot of guy chasing mirages and holding fake conceptions about male/female dynamics as true, and then try to embody that inauthentic crap.

Edited November 15, 2021 by Etherial Cat

[Shin]

3 minutes ago, lxlichael said:

@Electron your problem is not "game" just inner dissonance.

You need a first principles approach when you're dealing with beings and humans rather than "game", starting with self observation and learning to align all the important aspects of yourself and more specifically when it comes to other people, improving your observational abilities and empathic abilities, especially cognitive.

Leo is an example of someone who because they failed to properly integrate themselves instead opted for creating a persona based on "game" et al. that they try to perfect on its implementation from moment to moment even on their own website.

Right now he's trying to give you a "rollercoaster of emotions" so you fall in love with him, so you become addicted to his incessant narcissistic button pushing because he struggles to separate his reward centre from his awareness, fantasy from reality to the point where he's able to make mindful growth decisions for himself. 

He wants to trauma bond you so you never leave the relationship, his fantasy forum connection with all of his users here.

If you want to criticize Leo, do it directly by opening a thread, don't pretend you want to help someone and then rumble about Leo for 99% of the post.

[Etherial Cat]

5 hours ago, SQAAD said:

 

This pickup business is not about being truly authentic and genuine to who you are. Its all a facade. Changing yourself to fit the criteria of other egoic minds so you are not perceived as ''creepy''. Changing how you truly are because you are afraid of getting rejected. Its just jumping throught hoops to achieve a certain result. It has nothing to do with authenticity.  Pickup is all about doing whatever will work on the mind of a woman. Changing yourself to fit her needs and desires.

Leo is basically telling us that we shouldn't be the way we are. Otherwise we won't attract girls from the social matrix. That is the bottom line. Maybe my authentic self is the shy nerdy type.

But no, this is not acceptable. You have to fake it to someone else. And act all macho and confident even if you really don't want to. Imagine if  you had to be shy to get laid, then you would just jump through hoops by doing the exact opposite. You would hide your machoness so you could get laid. lol.

You are doing whatever neccesary to manipulate the other person. Its manipulation and acting to get the desired result. You do what works. Not what is authentic. If you are authentic people don't like you. 

Pickup is similar to Robert Greenes Laws of Power where you use techniques to manipulate the other people around you by acting. But i am not blaming pickup. It just doesn't sit well to many higher consciousness people to play all these egoic animalistic survival games. You have to play all these manipulations otherwise women don't respond well. Fake it until you make it. Truth & honesty won't get you laid.

 

Trying to attract girls through your persona is also how you'll get a high sample of incompatible ones. I agree that it's a waste of time.

If you manage to reconnect with your authentic self + develop all the lines that make people attractive (for both objective qualities and subjectives qualities) you should be able to attract women who corresponds you best, without having to go through faking anything to get into her mind.

 

[Arcangelo]

8 hours ago, Knowledge Hoarder said:

"Pua is low consciousness" my ass

+1

@Tangerinedream

You don't get it. And never will because you are a woman.

7 hours ago, gettoefl said:

it's manipulative it's deceptive it's thinking with your dick

hahaha

No.

7 hours ago, something_else said:

Most of the guys who get into pickup can't attract one girl, let alone hundreds. Most guys that get into it are socially awkward or shy, they get into pickup so they can explore their sexuality with various different girls and eventually develop themselves enough to meet, attract and bond long-term with a girl they're also attracted to. That's the healthy mindset of pickup, it's more about learning to socialise and become a stronger man and a stronger human being

+1000

 

6 hours ago, Knowledge Hoarder said:

@Electron @gettoefl Approaching a girl you are interested in, and making your intention clear, is not manipulation. Trying to get better at attracting, is also not manipulating.

You may not be interested in sleeping with 100s of women, which is fine, noone says you should. But you still expect to get a gf, don't you. And you probably expect her to fall into your lap. Well, good luck with that strategy?

+1

[Arcangelo]

5 hours ago, SQAAD said:

 

This pickup business is not about being truly authentic and genuine to who you are. Its all a facade. Changing yourself to fit the criteria of other egoic minds so you are not perceived as ''creepy''. Changing how you truly are because you are afraid of getting rejected. Its just jumping throught hoops to achieve a certain result. It has nothing to do with authenticity.  Pickup is all about doing whatever will work on the mind of a woman. Changing yourself to fit her needs and desires.

Leo is basically telling us that we shouldn't be the way we are. Otherwise we won't attract girls from the social matrix. That is the bottom line. Maybe my authentic self is the shy nerdy type.

But no, this is not acceptable. You have to fake it to someone else. And act all macho and confident even if you really don't want to. Imagine if  you had to be shy to get laid, then you would just jump through hoops by doing the exact opposite. You would hide your machoness so you could get laid. lol.

You are doing whatever neccesary to manipulate the other person. Its manipulation and acting to get the desired result. You do what works. Not what is authentic. If you are authentic people don't like you. 

Pickup is similar to Robert Greenes Laws of Power where you use techniques to manipulate the other people around you by acting. But i am not blaming pickup. It just doesn't sit well to many higher consciousness people to play all these egoic animalistic survival games. You have to play all these manipulations otherwise women don't respond well. Fake it until you make it. Truth & honesty won't get you laid.

 

HEHE!

No.

[Preety_India]

4 hours ago, unborn_chicken said:

You guys are mistaking being "authentic" with resignation or giving up on things you desire because you lack skill or whatever.

The simple truth is WE ARE ALL DIFFERENT.

We all have different personalities. We all want different things from life.

Our emotions, motives and desires are all different.

We are NOT all meant to be casanovas.

We are NOT all meant to be millionaires.

We are NOT all meant to be buddhas.

We are NOT all meant to be good in every single area of life.

SUCCESS means different things for all of us.

The whole point of life is DIVERSITY.

It's not about not developing confidence. It's not about "giving up" and being unhappy forever.

It's about embracing who you are and being successful in your own way, rather than trying to follow somebody else's way of doing things.

Do you really think Doestoevsky would've written all the great literature he wrote if he had been too preoccupied with being flirty and picking up chicks?

Do you really think Bach would've composed all the great music he did?

Do you really think buddha would've realized what he realized?

 

 

Why should the process of becoming confident have to take place in a club or a bar with loud obnoxious music?

Why should it have to take place stopping random chicks in a mall to ask for their number?

Why not just live your life, do the things you want to do and develop confidence in your OWN WAY OF BEING along the way?

If we all tried to be rockstars the world simply wouldn't work.

We NEED people to cook the bread.

We NEED people to farm the wheat that eventually becomes bread.

We NEED people to drive a truck and come pickup your thrash at night.

We need everyone to be exactly what they are, and nothing else.

 

No wonder pickup doesn't work on most girls. Why might that be?

 

Do things your own way. Follow no one.

Exactly. Agree with this. A man can be confident on his own without having to do that extra stuff. There are plenty of men who are naturally confident. Even going to a gym and maintaining a fit body does wonders in terms of confidence. 

And if that doesn't give him confidence, then he got serious insecurities. 

 

Edited November 15, 2021 by Preety_India

[Nos7algiK]

@SQAAD @Etherial Cat Well said both of you.

[unborn_chicken]

1 hour ago, lxlichael said:

@Electron your problem is not "game" just inner dissonance.

You need a first principles approach when you're dealing with beings and humans rather than "game", starting with self observation and learning to align all the important aspects of yourself and more specifically when it comes to other people, improving your observational abilities and empathic abilities, especially cognitive.

Leo is an example of someone who because they failed to properly integrate themselves instead opted for creating a persona based on "game" et al. that they try to perfect on its implementation from moment to moment even on their own website.

Right now he's trying to give you a "rollercoaster of emotions" so you fall in love with him, so you become addicted to his incessant narcissistic button pushing because he struggles to separate his reward centre from his awareness, fantasy from reality to the point where he's able to make mindful growth decisions for himself. 

He wants to trauma bond you so you never leave the relationship, his fantasy forum connection with all of his users here.

Nicely put.