How to Help “Paradigm Locked” Stage Orange Dad

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

So, I’m currently on a vigorous detox and my tongue is green from toxicity, yet he bombarded me with all his ideological positions of how my “woo-woo crack science” lifestyle isn’t producing “tangible” results. I’m not losing enough fat, lmao. 

It’s been 5 weeks, going from suicidal, to thriving. Yet, his mind can’t conceive of the soft inner results built through the process/long term trajectory of the plan.

Lol, I mean I can’t even believe the myopic and narrow minded view of the world. 
 

I know what his mind wants to see, what it wants to hear, etc. but I couldn’t bring myself to “stoop” down to his paradigm lock. I feel like he needed to be challenged and expand his way of thinking. It definitely worked, but I mean he’s 62 and he is an engineer, who views the entire world through the lens of his career most of the time. 
 

I know he was just tryna stick it to the libs, and was taking out resentment for me not working, spending money on healthy groceries that he deems “nonsense”. So, I know it’s all love at the end of the day, but I mean how do you talk to people at this level of spiral dynamics without dumbing your insights down to pure falsehood? 

[Carl-Richard]

You can say that your woo-woo detox is an experiment and that you don't believe that it works before you've empirically verified it for yourself.

[PepperBlossoms]

Ask him to explain why it is a bad idea to buy healthy groceries.

[Leo Gura]

It's best not to waste time trying to explain yourself to closeminded people.

Just focus on doing the work you know you need to do, and move away from people who are closedminded and bring you down as soon as you can. Surround yourself with positive people who are into personal development and spirituality. People who appreciate the work you're doing.

Your family can be one of the biggest things to hold you back. You must move out and become independent as soon as possible so that you are not beholden to then and don't have to obey their limited notions of life.

In the meantime, just focus as much as you can on growing yourself. Much of the work is internal so no one has to know you're doing it.

[Preety_India]

A bit like my stage orange mom. She doesn't believe in healthy food. 

Just quit and don't waste time old brains. 

They are not ever going to accept that things can get better. They're stuck and self righteous. 

Save your own time in the meanwhile and direct your focus to bigger goals. 

 

[DocWatts]

I'll second what been said so far that your time and energy would be better spent on your own development, rather than trying to break others out of thier own paradigms.

You'd be better off finding ways to make peace with the other paradigms, rather than trying to 'pull' others up to your own level and getting vexed when it doesn't work out.

Edited October 31, 2021 by DocWatts

[Willie]

Breaking free from a particular paradigm is something a person should want for themselves, not something forced on them. 

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

6 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

You can say that your woo-woo detox is an experiment and that you don't believe that it works before you've empirically verified it for yourself.

@Carl-Richard Genius!! 

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It's best not to waste time trying to explain yourself to closeminded people.

Just focus on doing the work you know you need to do, and move away from people who are closedminded and bring you down as soon as you can. Surround yourself with positive people who are into personal development and spirituality. People who appreciate the work you're doing.

Your family can be one of the biggest things to hold you back. You must move out and become independent as soon as possible so that you are not beholden to then and don't have to obey their limited notions of life.

In the meantime, just focus as much as you can on growing yourself. Much of the work is internal so no one has to know you're doing it.

@Leo Gura this is gold nugget advice, Holy shit, thank you so much! 
 

Yeah, I honestly believe because I decided to do this ground-breaking work before I left the house, it has caused me to have rage, mania, anger, suicidal, because everything I wanted to achieve was instantly faced with tremendous pushback from parents/family, so any momentum would be destroyed as soon as I started entering stage yellow/Turquoise. They would demonize me, constantly, belittle any progress or realizations with criticisms from below, rarely from above. 
 

I’m NEVER supported by anything I authentically want to do, unless I’m suicidal, and even then, they do it out of spite because their main Mode of Operation is risk-averse, safety, comfort, etc. it’s honestly sickening how my family lives their life, lol! 
 

My ADHD, thyroid, bipolar, and other issues made me unable to work consistently, early on, but now that I’ve fixed 80% of it, I’m so ready to dip. 

[Rilles]

Maybe he is a good counterbalance for you so you dont go too far down the Green rabbit hole. 

[mamad]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

 

Your family can be one of the biggest things to hold you back. You must move out and become independent as soon as possible so that you are not beholden to then and don't have to obey their limited notions of life.

no amount of distance can ever silent the voice of inner parent in our mind. moving oneself physically is not a primary advice. 

as a person who suffers a lot from parental issues I would say accepting your parents limited attitude towards life and love those attitude and transcend them is the one and only way.  after that If you want to move away from them do it.

Edited October 31, 2021 by mamad

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

2 hours ago, Rilles said:

Maybe he is a good counterbalance for you so you dont go too far down the Green rabbit hole. 

@RillesLol agreed. It’s love in a sense. He’s trying to keep my within boundaries and not too obsessive, as parents always do. 

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

@mamad this is excellent advice, brother. I’m going to make it work as long as possible, but it’s pretty toxic, stage red toxic. So, moving out is #1, no amount of inner work will fix the fact that the family homeostasis and ego, has a HUGE impact on my ego/development, what I’m able to do in my life. I can’t do a fucking 1/4 of what I know I love to do, or capable of doing, due to them thinking it’s “dangerous” “spiritual BS” “waste of time”. 
 

Fundamentally, life fucking sucks when you’re emerging stage yellow/Turquoise in a fucking red/blue/orange house that demonizes green like it’s nobody’s business. 
 

I have to leave before I start growing more, or it’s going to stir up some shit, and they may want to send me to a hospital if I end up taking about enlightenment/philosophy again. Yeah, it’s that bad. Literally, just talking about this stuff gets them invigorated with hate, fear, and yelling. This usually escalates to the point of me screaming or breaking shit, so, yeah. It’s non-negotiable to leave and not be fluffy idealistic about any of this. 

[Kshantivadin]

@EntheogenTruthSeeker I lived alone for a year and now I'm able to live with my family again. Consider this. The factors of personal growth, the distance, time off, them being happy to just have you back again, etcetc all add up to a pretty decent cohabitation atm

Battling your family is mostly battling yourself. But, a change of place is non-negotiable . Just know that it doesn't have to be permanent unless the family is super toxic. The downside is that you can't have naked girls walking around your house when you come back

[Nahm]

@EntheogenTruthSeeker

To me it sounds like conditioning is coming up and out, but unfortunately being packaged through a lens of condescension, arrogance & judgement, with similarly learned justifications & rationalizations to perpetuate it. As if you’re somehow ‘against’ someone else, and using an arsenal of spiritual conjecture & conceptualization to bring discord, damage & harm to your household & relationships, and not basic understanding, respect, empathy, love & compassion. You could be doing, developing, realizing, actualizing and experiencing that instead. Life doesn’t “fucking suck” when you aren’t bringing the “hate, fear, yelling, screaming & yelling” to it, but you might not be connecting the dots quite yet. Life is the only actual teacher. Appreciation is healing. Equanimity is the way, understanding the emotions you’re experiencing, like blame, is the simple, humbling means.  

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

@EntheogenTruthSeeker

To me it sounds like conditioning is coming up and out, but unfortunately being packaged through a lens of condescension, arrogance & judgement, with similarly learned justifications & rationalizations to perpetuate it. As if you’re somehow ‘against’ someone else, and using an arsenal of spiritual conjecture & conceptualization to bring discord, damage & harm to your household & relationships, and not basic understanding, respect, empathy, love & compassion. You could be doing, developing, realizing, actualizing and experiencing that instead. Life doesn’t “fucking suck” when you aren’t bringing the “hate, fear, yelling, screaming & yelling” to it, but you might not be connecting the dots quite yet. Life is the only actual teacher. Appreciation is healing. Equanimity is the way, understanding the emotions you’re experiencing, like blame, is the simple, humbling means.  

@Nahm Holy shit I am floored by the profundity of this advice. I will mull over this, contemplate, and apply as soon as possible. 
 

I agree with every thing you are saying. I definitely have shadow work to continue, and to balance myself out with new ways of understanding, compassion. I am very judgmental sometimes, as it’s been how I’ve been conditioned/willed into existence. 
 

Thank you so much! Stage Turquoise shit right here??

[Nahm]

@EntheogenTruthSeeker

?  Try to notice if you’re about to get in his business, and give yourself the kindness instead. Let him see that. He probably never has. 

 

 

[EntheogenTruthSeeker]

@Nahm wait what do you mean by this? I had a hard time understanding. I’m also having brain fog right now, lol, so just a little elaboration please??

[Nahm]

@EntheogenTruthSeeker

Discordant perspectives and behaviors are reaction, instead stop, focus on yourself instead of dad or anyone else, and give yourself the gift of kindness. If that seems to intangible, think of kindness as other than reactive.  

[Snader]

If something will change you fathers mind, it's the power of you not caring (in a positive way) about what he says and trusting your own process and keeping your eye on the ball no matter how much he argues against what you do.

He will be baffled if you can gladly accept his view with no resentment and get back to your own thing with full trust and integrity.