There's no way out of suffering.

[Breakingthewall]

@Endangered-EGO everything except psychedelics. have you ever completely deactivated your ego? there are substances that do it for you. Magic! you have to disable it at least once. It is very scary at first but maybe later it becomes a habit, for me it has been a revolution. Many could say that it's a shortcut, doesn't really works, etc. The traditional path is working for you? This other path really kill your ego.

[Endangered-EGO]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

@Endangered-EGO everything except psychedelics. have you ever completely deactivated your ego? there are substances that do it for you. Magic! you have to disable it at least once. It is very scary at first but maybe later it becomes a habit, for me it has been a revolution. Many could say that it's a shortcut, doesn't really works, etc. The traditional path is working for you? This other path really kill your ego.

@Breakingthewall Depends on what you mean by deactivation, if it's non-doership or nothingness/emptiness.

 

I did both, but in day to day life it's impossible for me to maintain any state, non doership or emptiness.

[Flyboy]

@Endangered-EGO I think you should keep going!  You sound like you're making real progress, though you're probably in one of the hardest parts right now.

Ingram says in MCTB that fundamental suffering gets worse as the path progresses due to increased sensitivity to it (as you're saying).  Hence "Once started, better to finish!"

Frank Yang noted that upon flipping to 4th path, suffering decreased by 99%.  Ingram and others voice similar thoughts.  Keep going, I believe it's possible. 

I can't fully comprehend it yet, but at the 4th path shift there's a kind of collapsing of the house of cards.  Perception stops doing the automatic mirroring of subject out of object, and the "just this" is inescapable in every moment regardless of state or effort.  I think that's as good as you're going to get in this life!

[Endangered-EGO]

17 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

@Endangered-EGO I think you should keep going!  You sound like you're making real progress, though you're probably in one of the hardest parts right now.

Ingram says in MCTB that fundamental suffering gets worse as the path progresses due to increased sensitivity to it (as you're saying).  Hence "Once started, better to finish!"

Frank Yang noted that upon flipping to 4th path, suffering decreased by 99%.  Ingram and others voice similar thoughts.  Keep going, I believe it's possible. 

I can't fully comprehend it yet, but at the 4th path shift there's a kind of collapsing of the house of cards.  Perception stops doing the automatic mirroring of subject out of object, and the "just this" is inescapable in every moment regardless of state or effort.  I think that's as good as you're going to get in this life!

@Flyboy Where does it say that exactly in MCTB? I've read it and some parts multiple times.

Damn, if I'm not about to reach 4th path, I might chose a bullet instead! I'm all in, I'm sure there's no way back, which doesn't make it easier. I guess everyone needs tl go through a similar phase.

[Gili Trawangan]

1 hour ago, Endangered-EGO said:

it's impossible for me to maintain any state

It's impossible period, not just for you.

All you have to do is see that this is the case, enlightenment is NOT a state. It's recognizing that all states are it.

It sounds like you're still searching for a particular experience, but letting go of the need for any particular kind of experience is the end of suffering. It doesn't mean you get to live without pain

 

Edited October 27, 2021 by Gili Trawangan

[Zeroguy]

Everything is you and by knowing that there can be no suffering even if you expereince worst(relative sense) stuff.High level of Counciousness.Even if you die .Jesus was fully enlightened ,my mistake.

[sara373]

On 10/25/2021 at 8:41 PM, Terell Kirby said:

How could you love something that you wish didn't exist? The ego's game is to prefer one thing over another...which doesn't allow you to transcend suffering by becoming Infinite.

Becoming whole will free you. It's also a choice you have to make, no one will do it for you.

how do you become whole? 

[sara373]

11 hours ago, Endangered-EGO said:

@Breakingthewall That reminds me of a zen phrase: "the seeker is the sought".

As soon as there's the intention to look for something; either "escape from suffering", "finding the permanent subject" or "the self", the ego-self (as effort) is itself in the way of true presence.

 

Is this (paraphrased) what you mean?

 

Damn I've spent at least 5000 hours meditating, contemplating, reading, listening to podcast, watching videos. I certainly hope thay I'm not a "beginner".

maybe it's often like that..

we will remain a beginner even after putting in the hours and effort.

maybe that's the fear too. arriving at a point like where we started, I have heard of spiritual stages where person returns back to square one and starts again (i am paraphrasing). Often, it feels like that and I look for words to connect what I mean. Finding the seashore and then returning to the middle of the ocean where I'm wondering what sails, what has become of my ship and my sails. The winds of change. etc.

Edited October 27, 2021 by sara373

[BipolarGrowth]

9 hours ago, Endangered-EGO said:

@Flyboy Where does it say that exactly in MCTB? I've read it and some parts multiple times.

Damn, if I'm not about to reach 4th path, I might chose a bullet instead! I'm all in, I'm sure there's no way back, which doesn't make it easier. I guess everyone needs tl go through a similar phase.

Keep moving forward man. If you haven’t felt discouraged or like things aren’t working as they were advertised, it’s a sign of progress. Becoming disenchanted with the idea of moving on has a way of just moving you forward anyway. Lean into it. I’m in a really similar territory where I’m most likely 2nd or 3rd path if I had to guess. Less than a month ago I had a huge awakening which was more Love/Divinity than anything before which quickly lead me into three days of depersonalization and a huge dark night which lasted a little over two weeks. The stormy waters have passed though and lead to some pretty nice views and skillful reduction in suffering. 

[sara373]

MCTB?

[Fearless_Bum]

Correct, for you there is no way out because you actually feed on suffering. 

But for the living being who typed those words he/she is already free.

[Zeroguy]

1 hour ago, sara373 said:

how do you become whole? 

Just be.Not a rocket science.

[Flyboy]

15 hours ago, Endangered-EGO said:

@Flyboy Where does it say that exactly in MCTB? I've read it and some parts multiple times.

Damn, if I'm not about to reach 4th path, I might chose a bullet instead! I'm all in, I'm sure there's no way back, which doesn't make it easier. I guess everyone needs tl go through a similar phase.

Actually, he might have said that in one of his podcast interviews.  But he definitely does say that somewhere.  

One suggestion... I'd focus on deep concentration work and use the Jhanas to cultivate bliss and very subtle insight.  Could be a major source of relief, and also probably necessary to take insight further from where you're at.  Jhanas can be really useful to reduce symptoms of the dark night and help integrate.

[lmfao]

@Endangered-EGO Bingo you've got something there, I don't describe it as getting enlightened either. You know, with lack of suffering people have comfortable dreamstate, it's probably only because that crumbles that anything happens tbh.

I went meditating with the intention to transcend the physical plane of reality, instead I'll be flooded with "animal impulses". So that happened, spiralling down and down, lower and lower. Burning hot with fire, but I see the horizon 

Edited October 27, 2021 by lmfao

[Flyboy]

@Endangered-EGO Read more here:

https://danielpostscompilation.blogspot.com/p/blog-page.html#jump-to-157