is the sex you are born with, immutable?

[Rilles]

14 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

so you are saying correct me if i am wrong that you can change the sex you are born with

Sex is a category of multiple parts. Can you change your genitals doing surgery? Yes. Many people do. Is it legit? Well it depends on what you mean by legit,

Is there a pure essence that makes someone a woman or man... What is that essence?

If you could change every part of a woman to become a man even the chromosomes then would she still be a woman? Lets say in 100 years were able to biologically/surgically create men that can bear children... what then?

Edited October 18, 2021 by Rilles

[gettoefl]

4 minutes ago, decentralized said:

Why do you need me to say if it's possible or not? You can do the research on your own.

it is opinion not fact

therefore i seek the opinion of others

[gettoefl]

4 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Sex is a category of multiple parts. Can you change your genitals doing surgery? Yes. Many people do. Is it legit? Well it depends on what you mean by legit,

Is there a pure essence that makes someone a woman or man... What is that essence?

If you could change every part of a woman to become a man even the chromosomes then would she still be a woman? Lets say in 100 years were able to biologically/surgically create men that can bear children... what then?

the way i defined sex is being born with either a penis or a vagina which as you pointed is true for 99.98% of people

can a trans person change from one sex to another and therefore use their restroom of choice

yes or no

[Shin]

19 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

so you are saying correct me if i am wrong that you can change the sex you are born with

Yes but maybe not now, I don't know much about genitalia and hormones surgery/treatment.

[Rilles]

1 minute ago, gettoefl said:

can a trans person change from one sex to another and therefore use their restroom of choice

Transgender people change their gender not their sex. Gender is how you express yourself in the world. Sex is what is between your legs.

The restroom thing I havent done enough research on to have an opinion, I will hold back from saying anything there. 

[gettoefl]

2 minutes ago, Shin said:

Yes but maybe not now, I don't know much about genitalia and hormones surgery/treatment.

it is a choice not a surgery

yes means trans are allowed to change from the sex they were born with and so now they can use their restroom of choice

[gettoefl]

8 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Transgender people change their gender not their sex. Gender is how you express yourself in the world. Sex is what is between your legs.

The restroom thing I havent done enough research on to have an opinion, I will hold back from saying anything there. 

no i believe transgender want to be able to change their sex from one to another ... gender is some continuum that is more fluid and subjective while sex is identifying as a man or a woman

Edited October 18, 2021 by gettoefl

[Rilles]

3 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

no i believe transgender want to be able to change their sex from one to another ... gender is some continuum that is more fluid and subjective while sex is identifying as a man or a woman

Its literally in the name my dude. TransGENDER. 

[gettoefl]

1 minute ago, Rilles said:

Its literally in the name my dude. TransGENDER. 

how about transsexual then

[Rilles]

5 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

how about transsexual then

Dont know.

Speaking of bathrooms, I think a gender neutral bathroom without urinals would be fine. That way it doesnt matter who is in there. 

[gettoefl]

6 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

I am not convinced it's 100% a social construct.

But, people just don't fit into the social matrix A or B category.

People will express themselves however they want...

I think there are really two main biological human sexes as of right now.

But, gender identity is fluid... But, you can't fully escape some things you are born with. Which is paradoxical and trivial.

so you are on the side of, keep trans people prohibited from their preferred restroom if i am not mistaken

[gettoefl]

7 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Dont know.

Speaking of bathrooms, I think a gender neutral bathroom without urinals would be fine. That way it doesnt matter who is in there. 

true except 50% increase in space and costs and less space more time required for non-trans people who will be footing the lion's share of the cost

[Rilles]

1 minute ago, gettoefl said:

true except 50% increase in space and costs and less space more time required for non-trans people who will be footing the lion's share of the cost

Its the best we can do.

Honestly to me I dont give a shit. Im not that sensitive who is in my public bathroom, I try not to stay there for too long anyway. Take a shit and leave quick.

[gettoefl]

4 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Its the best we can do.

Honestly to me I dont give a shit. Im not that sensitive who is in my public bathroom, I try not to stay there for too long anyway. Take a shit and leave quick.

same but it seems that many women don't want trans people in their restrooms and i can sympathize there

[Kensho]

2 hours ago, Opo said:

 

@gettoefl

What do you think? 

In the current situation, with the majority of toilets appointed as women/men, one can use the restroom that makes the others feel OK too. If someone looks like a man, women don't feel ok with him being in their toilet. So, if someone looks like a man but feels like a woman inside, he has to respect the other women that will may feel uncomfortable, and go to the men's toilet. Using the women's toilet and explaining them the situation is not an option because things will go off track very soon (men going to the women's toilet telling lies just to enjoy and take a peek etc.)

A couple of times I ve seen unisex toilets where the sink area is common for both sexes and the toilet-seat cabinets are appointed as men/women for obvious hygiene reasons (standing up or sitting down). That's ok too, if most people aggree with it.

[gettoefl]

1 minute ago, Kensho said:

In the current situation, with the majority of toilets appointed as women/men, one can use the restroom that makes the others feel OK too. If someone looks like a man, women don't feel ok with him being in their toilet. So, if someone looks like a man but feels like a woman inside, he has to respect the other women that will may feel uncomfortable, and go to the men's toilet. Using the women's toilet and explaining them the situation is not an option because things will go off track very soon (men going to the women's toilet telling lies just to enjoy and take a peek etc.)

A couple of times I ve seen unisex toilets where the sink area is common for both sexes and the toilet-seat cabinets are appointed as men/women for obvious hygiene reasons (standing up or sitting down). That's ok too, if most people aggree with it.

and what if the trans person looks just like a woman ... has the woman the right to prohibit him

[Kensho]

2 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

and what if the trans person looks just like a woman ... has the woman the right to prohibit him

what is their reasoning for wanting to prohibit him/her?

[gettoefl]

2 minutes ago, Kensho said:

what is their reasoning for wanting to prohibit him/her?

she knows the trans person was born male and she believes it is impossible to change even though the person looks just like a woman

[PurpleTree]

imo women have to say if they want trans people in their bathrooms or not

 

personally i don't really care nor do i know enough about the subject to have an real opinion

[gettoefl]

1 minute ago, Thought Art said:

Lol that is something for others to decide. 

it is the only matter this thread is contemplating lol