Is it "easier' to reach non-dual states as a male?

[Proserpina]

4 minutes ago, OBEler said:

@OneHandClap ah really no proof? 

Then why always men give their life up for saving someone elses life? 

In a life threatening Situation a woman always think about herself and her children(which She See as a Part of herself).not ONE thought of any men. Well studied. But no one wants to hear this truth

Men could be thought of as stronger physically, higher assertiveness and typically more intellectually capable (Higher intellect trait in big 5). When I made a sacrifice when the divine called you have no idea how difficult it was and how much I stumbled.  I have no doubt a part of the reason was because my femininity just isn't tailored that way. I don't blame women for taking the path of least resistance,  I recieved so much trauma. I don't think the feminine is inherently more selfish,  men just have an easier time. 

[Salvijus]

It's because men have semen. 

Lol, I'm just joking,  but it could be true since semen is a a powerful source of energy that can be used for enlightenment ?

[mandyjw]

It must be because since they don't have xy chromosomes, they just don't have axis. 

 

[mandyjw]

Ok, actual answer. Nondual means not two, not separate. So you can see the impossibility of reaching a nondual state as a male, or as a female. The pride/ insecurity identity of gender must be dropped. It can look like there are more people of a certain gender interested in some teaching, or outwardly displaying their knowledge, but that teaching is dualistic and how they appear to you is based on your own identifications and projections. So rather than asking what females are missing, look for what you're missing. 

Also if what you believe is what is reflected to you, then women and minorities would be more likely to buy into the belief that they are inferior. That's kind of sad. But also holy fuck, empowering and funny once you realize what you did. 

 

 

Edited October 14, 2021 by mandyjw

[Proserpina]

I don't think it helps to ignore the question or dismiss gender.  There are differences as to how the divine is channeled.  There are different difficulties and strengths.  To ignore it would be to miss the opportunity to embrace that difference. And instead remain in the patriarchial. 

[Salvijus]

I actually have another theory on this. I think male body is energetically better suited to do transmitting. Female body is much more better for receptivity. You can see that principle of life in the sexual organs even. Females can simply receive knowledge without any sadhana unlike men who have to grind all the time. That's why so many great teachers usually take male body because male body allows them to do powerful transmitions that you need if you want to transmit knowledge and grace. Of course a guru is beyond body, but body is an instrument that can be used for different purposes.

You don't see a woman carrying a man on her shoulders, don't  you? Because that's not the women's role. It is a man's role to be underneath and carry people through the river of samsara. For what it's worth, I think being on top is way more enjoyable than carrying people.  To play the role of a carrieer is really hard work, not that woman cannot do it, it's just that female body is less suited by nature for the job.

Female body is better at other things like supportive role(gaming terminology), I heard that the the way energy is functioning in a woman is different, it moves in a spherical manner(AoE), male body energy behaves in a more concentrated way (Single target dmg)  so woman tend to be more intuitive becauce this energy picks up a lot of information from the outside and gets filtered through her system. They are more sensitive and better at doing some psychic or healing type of work. 

These are just my ideas mixed with what I heard from other teachers, don't take this seriously, it could be totally wrong

Regards ?

 

Edited October 14, 2021 by Salvijus

[Endangered-EGO]

@Sunmaster14 I don't have real data on this. However there are multiple dimensions to what leads to Awakening.

Risk-taking: Men are more prone to taking big risks, including fucking up their psyche with psychedelics.

Intuition: women are more Intuitive than men. Men who are ultra-rational are not gonna take too much time doing spirituality.

Absolute Hopelessness:(needed for the first level of enlightenment):

Women attempt suicide more often but don't succeed at it. So it's hard to say what gender goes through more extreme-hopelessness.

Pursue crazy dreams is accepted:

Men pursuing crazy stuff, including going to mongolia in a monastery is socially more acceptable than when women do it.

Also society want to protect women, in whatever way their culture sees fit. So "No, woman, you're not gonna leave your life behind. Stay here and stay safe"

The spectrum:

I feel like, similar to the IQ distribution. The distribution of men's traits is way broader than the distribution of women's. I could be wrong though.

 

Bias:

We are biased to feel an old enlightened sage is a man. In stories the sage is always a man. That is what's attracting people to enlightenment. And no women really seems like what's told in the stories.

[Gregory1]

Just wanted to drop an interesting observation here. I find this debate really fascinating and would be happy about more (constructive) comments.

The observation: Yes, 90% of the spiritual leaders / gurus are male. But now think about their followers: 90% female. What's going on here?

Edited October 14, 2021 by Gregory1

[Nos7algiK]

No, we only see what we choose to see. There are no real differences once it's accepted this way and unseen. It is a disservice to ourselves to create these boxes we put men and women into. 

Reality will always reflect your own belief system. Some people will see men as those that can reach non-dual states easier, because this is what they belief and they will look for aspects of reality to confirm this biases. Just as the same would apply for those that belief this of women but also those that belief they are equal. If reality is then a reflection of yourself, why not see it as equal if that is what will now manifest.

We need to stop making excuses, either physical, mental, or biological, as to why something can, can't, or struggles to happen. These are once again a projection of yourself. People see reality in certain ways because it is most "comfortable" for their ego to see it this way.

If you believe men are more non-dual then I implore you to talk to more women. If you believe more women are non-dual then I implore you to talk to more men.

More important why you can not see the other side as equal is because the part you are viewing is not fully illuminated inside yourself. Because of this it creates a shadow.

Looking at someone's occupation in life such as a spiritual leader/teacher/guru is not, nor should it ever be seen this way, a reflection of their own inner workings as to how non-dual they actually are. Specially using this as an example to make claims about a certain group of people.

Edited October 14, 2021 by Nos7algiK

[Gregory1]

1 hour ago, Jakuchu said:

Yes

In most parts of the world women are still quite suppressed. They are busy fighting for basic women rights, like not getting raped

And there is definitely more social pressure on women to be a certain way than there is on men

Generally I would say most women tend to be a people pleaser type which makes one dependent on other people. But spirituality at times requires you to be bold and not give a fuck about other people. They lack that freed up attitude 

 

 

This explanation is what makes the most sense to me so far...

[Salvijus]

18 minutes ago, Gregory1 said:

The observation: Yes, 90% of the spiritual leaders / gurus are male. But now think about their followers: 90% female. What's going on here?

Yes because often to follow you need receptivity and devotion, it comes easy for a woman. Man are too arrogant usually to follow anything or bow down to anyone. So they have to grind it by themselves.

Either you generate energy from within by yourself, or you're open enough to receive the grace in cascades from above. Those are the two ways I think.

Sorry, I know that question was not directed at me ?

Edited October 14, 2021 by Salvijus

[Gregory1]

11 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Yes because often to follow you need receptivity and devotion, it comes easy for a woman. Man are too arrogant usually to follow anything or bow down to anyone. So they have to grind it by themselves.

Either you generate energy from within by yourself, or you're open enough to receive the grace in cascades from above. Those are the two ways I think.

Sorry, I know that question was not directed at me ?

PLEASE, OF COURSE it was directed at you. Nice explanation. I want everybodys perspective as long as they are genuinely interested in getting a better understanding of that topic.

[OBEler]

@Proserpina It makes biological sense that females are more selfish. Men are replaceable, women not. she is the one who give birth to life. A woman need to take care of herself first and only so there is higher chance of surviving her children. 

a woman is physical weak compared to a man and also lacks on other deep connections. she never experience real companionship, it is total shallow how friendships are between women. If a girl gets too beautiful she will be bullied from other girls. if a girl gets fat and ugly, other females will support her to stay in her ugliness (because less competition for men). Look at facebook, when a bad looking girl posts her ugly body only women will compliment her how "beautiful" she is. They are all lying to her, so she can think everything is ok with her. No improvement welcomed 

[Sunmaster14]

9 hours ago, OneHandClap said:

There's no conspiracy here; I'm merely pointing out that there's a whole cultural history you need to examine before asking a question like this. It's a bit like asking why there aren't as many female scientists. When you have entire institutions that have been built for hundreds/thousands of years to exclude an entire gender/sex, it makes sense that the leading experts in that field would be the gender/sex that hasn't been barred from participation. 

Sorry, I didn't mean you personally, I was speaking generally. I think a site such as this will attract mainly second tier thinkers, and thus should be pretty immune to baseless conspiracies and "green stage" gender social warriors. That's why I registered and why I felt save in asking my question.

 

 

[Sunmaster14]

8 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Sunmaster14

Why do you have nipples?

Because I would look silly without them. 

[Sunmaster14]

8 hours ago, gettoefl said:

everyone is 50% male 50% female

Where did you get this notion from?

It's not like that on a biological level, nor on a psychological level.

Do you mean strictly on a spiritual level?

[Sunmaster14]

7 hours ago, Proserpina said:

I don't think it helps to ignore the question or dismiss gender.  There are differences as to how the divine is channeled.  There are different difficulties and strengths.  To ignore it would be to miss the opportunity to embrace that difference. And instead remain in the patriarchial. 

Agree.
 

[Sunmaster14]

7 hours ago, Salvijus said:

I actually have another theory on this. I think male body is energetically better suited to do transmitting. Female body is much more better for receptivity. You can see that principle of life in the sexual organs even. Females can simply receive knowledge without any sadhana unlike men who have to grind all the time. That's why so many great teachers usually take male body because male body allows them to do powerful transmitions that you need if you want to transmit knowledge and grace. Of course a guru is beyond body, but body is an instrument that can be used for different purposes.

You don't see a woman carrying a man on her shoulders, don't  you? Because that's not the women's role. It is a man's role to be underneath and carry people through the river of samsara. For what it's worth, I think being on top is way more enjoyable than carrying people.  To play the role of a carrieer is really hard work, not that woman cannot do it, it's just that female body is less suited by nature for the job.

Female body is better at other things like supportive role(gaming terminology), I heard that the the way energy is functioning in a woman is different, it moves in a spherical manner(AoE), male body energy behaves in a more concentrated way (Single target dmg)  so woman tend to be more intuitive becauce this energy picks up a lot of information from the outside and gets filtered through her system. They are more sensitive and better at doing some psychic or healing type of work. 

These are just my ideas mixed with what I heard from other teachers, don't take this seriously, it could be totally wrong

Regards ?

 

Yes, this makes a lot of sense to me. Thanks

[Sunmaster14]

7 hours ago, Gregory1 said:

Just wanted to drop an interesting observation here. I find this debate really fascinating and would be happy about more (constructive) comments.

The observation: Yes, 90% of the spiritual leaders / gurus are male. But now think about their followers: 90% female. What's going on here?

That is true. The workshops or retreats I went to in the past were always prevalently more female than male, and out of my friends and acquaintances interested in spirituality, most are female.

The historical issue as put forward by a poster here (women being ostracized by patriarchal societies) certainly played a role in all of this, but has so less and less in the past 50 years and in my opinion doesn't explain the male/female distribution in spiritual leading positions today.

Not that I think there's anything wrong with it, or wish it could be any different than it is.  
 

[OneHandClap]

3 minutes ago, Sunmaster14 said:

That is true. The workshops or retreats I went to in the past were always prevalently more female than male, and out of my friends and acquaintances interested in spirituality, most are female.

The historical issue as put forward by a poster here (women being ostracized by patriarchal societies) certainly played a role in all of this, but has so less and less in the past 50 years and in my opinion doesn't explain the male/female distribution in spiritual leading positions today.

Not that I think there's anything wrong with it, or wish it could be any different than it is.  
 

The historical issue is one of continuing consequence. On a broad level, women were excluded from monastic circles in most areas of the world for thousands of years. It's not a stretch to believe that culturally, globally, humans may have assumed men to have a more prevalent place in "spiritual seeking." It takes time to "mend the gaps" in areas like this. Already, we are seeing more and more female spiritual leaders emerging, as you said. But since the entire lineage of most religious orders has been male (and in many religions, still is), the teachings are often passed down by men, through men.