There is Past and Future

[RedLine]

past = desire -to escape from present-

future = desire -to escape from present-

 

Reality is define by that which IS independently of your desire. So if you are manipulating (imagining/thinking about present and past), it is not real.

Edited October 12, 2021 by RedLine

[WokeBloke]

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Ofcourse.  But Consciousness is mystical you cannot pin it down with language so I'm not sure what that has to do with the thread.  If your trying to claim that the past happened, I mean..your imagining it or dreaming it up RIGHT NOW.   So we are back to that.  If you want to say it happened you could say that it was dreamed up but that is not quite right because it implies it was dreamed up in the past.  You are dreaming a past right now.

So you are claiming that you are not experiencing?

[Moksha]

28 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

I didn't say time was not relative. 

Do you accept that there is change?

If there is change then there is a past.

To say that people have no past is like saying what is happening right now is not happening.

If time is relative, then there can be no absolute past or future, only the subjective perception of it. What happened to the "past" for the atomic clocks that showed an earlier time than the clocks left on the ground? If time is bound by perspective, what does that tell you about its ultimate reality?

I accept that there is change, but only within relative reality. Space, time, and change are bound to the dream that Consciousness creates. They are only apparently, but not absolutely, real.

Lord of the gods, you are the abode of the universe. Changeless, you are what is and what is not, and beyond the duality of existence and nonexistence. You are the first among the gods, the timeless spirit, the resting place of all beings. You are the knower and the thing which is known. You are the final home; with your infinite form you pervade the cosmos.

- Bhagavad Gita 11:37-38

What does it mean to be the abode of the universe? Ultimate reality is beyond the cosmos, which it creates, but which does not define it. When individual perspectives dissolve, the appearance of the cosmos dissolves with them.

[Inliytened1]

3 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

So you are claiming that you are not experiencing?

Yes.  There is just Being or Actuality. (You could say pure experience).  There is no you or experiencer.   All of that is imaginary or conceptual.  Thus there  cannot be one who has a past.

[WokeBloke]

2 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yes.  There is just Being or Actuality. (You could say pure experience).  There is no you or experiencer.  

So essentially you are just lying. Pease understand everything you type comes right back to you. In your future of course.

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, WokeBloke said:

So essentially you are just lying. Pease understand everything you type comes right back to you. In your future of course.

Not lying just imagining...I'm pointing you towards waking up from the dream.   If you wanna stay in the dream stay in it

 

[WokeBloke]

Just now, Inliytened1 said:

Not lying just imagining...I'm pointing you towards waking up from the dream.   If you wanna stay in the dream stay in it

 

You can't stop imagining. And your imagination has manifested therefore it is no longer imagination.

[Inliytened1]

21 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

You can't stop imagining. And your imagination has manifested therefore it is no longer imagination.

Your imagining that!

But yes imagining is reality.  So I'm not saying I don't have compassion for the millions of jews who died during the Holacaust.  I do.  I'm just conscious that I am imagining the entire thing as God.  It doesn't mean within the context of the dream you don't imagine it's real - thus collapsing rhe duality between real and imaginary.  No, you do because otherwise the dream would end!

[WokeBloke]

1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

Your imagining that!

But yes imagining is reality.  So I'm not saying I don't have compassion for the millions of jews who died during the Holacaust.  I do.  I'm just conscious that I am imagining the entire thing as God.  It doesn't mean within the context of the dream you don't imagine it's real - thus collapsing rhe duality between real and imaginary.  No, you do because otherwise the dream would end!

But you were those Jews. You actually went through it. just like you are actually going through this experience. You experienced your past. Your past is how you became you.

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, WokeBloke said:

But you were those Jews. You actually went through it. just like you are actually going through this experience. You experienced your past. Your past is how you became you.

You mean the you who is a concept, not God.  I was pointing you towards the Absolute and you are speaking in the relative.  Relatively yes there is a past.  You see?  Within the dream there is a you who has a past. 

[Tyler Durden]

@Inliytened1 Interesting posts. Is anything ever happening at all? Even the present moment experience seems to be almost non existent, it immediately passes and turns into "past" which is imagined.

[WokeBloke]

Just now, Tyler Durden said:

@Inliytened1 Interesting posts. Is anything ever happening at all? Even the present moment experience seems to be almost non existent, it immediately passes and turns into "past" which is imagined.

This experience is actually happening in the subjective realm of experiencing. 

[Inliytened1]

15 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

@Inliytened1 Interesting posts. Is anything ever happening at all? Even the present moment experience seems to be almost non existent, it immediately passes and turns into "past" which is imagined.

That's the point.   You cannot grasp reality with the ego mind because you ARE it.  Which is why all the spiritual teachings tell you to meditate by quieting the mind from all thought and to stop using the mind to capture reality.  Your trying to point back at yourself and you can't do it.  It's the self reference problem.

[BlackMaze]

You don't exist.

This is what this means. 

 

[RMQualtrough]

Set up a movie projector. Run a reel through it. The projected movie seems to have a past, present and future, but the thing actually experiencing things is the projector lens which has never moved from its static singular position. That is why time isn't considered real because you're trying to recognize the projector behind the reel.

[kamwalker]

There is only a past or future because you are using thought in the now to create it. Try it for yourself and see what happens.  

[The0Self]

There’s the appearance of them; they aren’t real. Past and future are the same no-thing; not separate. In the story, when self identifies as now (or consciousness), it serves as the attempted connection between past and future (and between every other apparent object), thus illusorily confirming that they were separate in the first place in order for the illusion of possible connection to appear to take place.

Edited October 13, 2021 by The0Self

[Osaid]

How are you experiencing a past and future from within the present moment? You cannot escape the present moment, but you say that you perceive a past and future which are outside of this moment. The perception of a past and future must always take place in the present moment. So, in reality, the past and future are always happening now and don't actually exist in any other moment of time.

If the present moment is all you can experience, and the past and future are being perceived from within that present moment, then that means that the past and future only happen from within the present moment, and therefore the past and future can only ever take place in the present moment.

[GoobyBooby]

There have only ever been "now" moments.  

You're simply shifting to different "now" moments

There is only 1 moment, as if you were frozen in time, with many different "now" moments. 

What you perceive as a 'before' and 'after' were simply different "now" moments. You simply move from one "now" moment to the other.