Maybe not all people can awaken, no Matter how hard they try.

[nistake]

Putting people on a pedestal can be a huge trap. The fact that somebody has a fancy green user name on a forum and "seems enlightened" shouldn't make you feel discouraged. They're not better or worse than you. They're not ahead of you. This is not a race.

Realize that everybody has a unique path. If you want to awaken with all your heart, you will. Don't give in to your limiting beliefs and stories about genetics and talent.

[Javfly33]

10 hours ago, Juliano Zn said:

@Javfly33 You've been in this forum for only 3 years. How long have you been taking psychs and doing spiritual work?

Remember that even for Leo it took more than a decade maybe?!

And also, why be so obsessed about this, if you're God you WILL awaken eventually.

I entered this forum when I have already meditated for maybe 4,5 months and have done 2 psychedelic trips.

[Dazgwny]

I’m not convinced. Genetics likely do play a roll to a certain degree. But through my experiences I find it much more to do with the power the ego. I find it reasonably easy to have awakenings on psychedelics. Some so deep I’ve thought well that’s that, there’s nothing left to do, it seemed absolutely complete, then I’d find myself next time round in an even deeper place. So what I thought was absolutely total, was not. Even though it seems that way. The nature of infinity I guess. Then sometimes I trip and wouldn’t class as awakening, just very deep insights but not totally surrendered.

Anyway, point being, on one particular occasion which I’ll never forget, is when I’d totally surrendered, complete loss of ego, then observed my ego reconstruct itself. This was impossible to stop, I observed in sheer disbelief as my mind was reconstructing all its dualities, at mega speed, building upon one another, creating this ridiculously tightly nit construction that encased me. And there I was, back, completely absorbed as this character I see myself to be. Totally seeing and understanding how it had done it, but in no way able to deconstruct it once back in it as the trip wore down. Back, lost in it, but with a great inner understanding and respect for the ego construct. It’s so powerful. And in a sense that’s right, because the devil is extremely powerful, and that’s essentially what the ego is, that’s what the devil represents, but has been ludicrously misinterpreted. But the power of God can overcome it. Which when this happens is literally an awakening. Even though it’s all God but just for the purpose of this subject matter. 
Never at any point have I felt genetics will hold me back, or even help me prosper with awakening as such in ordinary everyday life, I personally feel it is power of the ego, it’s mesmerising construction to hold you in place within it, to deceive and delude, which is its purpose. A wonderful wonderful construct. Breaking that down, on a permanent basis is what holds people back in my opinion, something I feel nowhere near, but working on, much more than any genetic trait.  Although I don’t disregard that some people’s genetics may be just set to make this much easier, but I can’t confirm
 

[gettoefl]

2 hours ago, Proserpina said:

I understand the feeling.  I feel similarly.  

But a part of me is like, who cares? 

If I can awaken enough to where pain and suffering no longer have me hostage and everything is beautiful then who cares if I can't be up to these people's level. 

I know I have limitations (my Dad has a very low IQ) but at the end of the day I'm not here to have some fancy understanding I can never reach due to poor genetics

damn straight ... every moment of the journey gives a teenie peek at the ravishing beloved ... each step is incremental compounding gain

to wake up, you have to to step up

[Mason Riggle]

14 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

I'm not suggesting solipsism, that would mean your ego is real which is not the case. Ultimately, awakening should include God realisation and then you'll come to the conclusion that all those enlightened persons were actually dreamed/imagined by You.

If the ego is not real, who do you suppose it is who awakens?  Enlightened persons are dreamed/imagined by who?

The 'ego' is imaginary separation.. ego arises when it's imagined that there is a 'you' separate from 'that which is not you'.  

Awakening is when this imaginary separation ceases to be.  

[Proserpina]

27 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

damn straight ... every moment of the journey gives a teenie peek at the ravishing beloved ... each step is incremental compounding gain

to wake up, you have to to step up

Exactly.

And maybe one day I can have that fancy realization and I'll be with the beloved all along the way. 

Edited October 4, 2021 by Proserpina

[Nahm]

@Javfly33

Zen slap?

[Jakuchu]

3 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Javfly33

Zen slap?

He basically is asking for it 

[Proserpina]

@Jakuchu @Nahm

[Javfly33]

6 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Javfly33

Zen slap?

Why you say that?

[Salvijus]

I woudnt worry about the final goal of enlightenment. I would just focus on rising my awareness little by little and that's it. How far you go is not important. Important thing is today you've raised your consciouness little bit and that's all one can do. That's the only thing in our hands. If you do that today, then it will amount to a successful day. If you do that every day, then it will be a successful life. 

It's a lifelong journey of endless refinement, not a sprint. Sprinter's mentality is not going to work well in a marathon

Regards ❤️

Edited October 4, 2021 by Salvijus

[Nahm]

41 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

Why you say that?

Cause sometimes people wanna believe silly stuff which enables their complaining & venting. 

[Shin]

3 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

I entered this forum when I have already meditated for maybe 4,5 months and have done 2 psychedelic trips.

That's still only 4 years top, most of which is most likely not serious work since you think there is a dna limitation or something.

Ditch the limiting belief and work on it for 5 years straight.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Shin

[Proserpina]

25 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Cause sometimes people wanna believe silly stuff which enables their complaining & venting. 

It's not necessarily silly.  There are people who are on different places on the path and it can impact their capacity.  To acknowledge that and the larger picture in which you sit can be fruitful as you stop beating yourself up. 

[Inliytened1]

@Javfly33 your answer is in the title of your post.  "No matter how hard they try"

Stop "trying" trying comes from ego.  And awakening is God realizing itself.  Also take a listen to Leo's latest video on paradox.  Consider you might be coming at this trying to "know" enlightenment.  Notice I said "trying to know".

Just live and let things flow.  Continue the practices but stop putting pressure on yourself.  It is not yourself that will have the realization.   Stop "thinking or obsessing" about it.  It is not found via thought.  

[Mason Riggle]

Just now, Inliytened1 said:

@Javfly33 

Stop "trying" trying comes from ego.

Do I have to 'try' to stop trying?   Do you see the paradox here? 

This is why people say 'you are already enlightened'. 

It can be recognized that there is no 'trying'.. nothing to 'do', other than 'just be', which you are already always doing effortlessly. 

[Nahm]

23 minutes ago, Proserpina said:

It's not necessarily silly.  There are people who are on different places on the path and it can impact their capacity.  To acknowledge that and the larger picture in which you sit can be fruitful as you stop beating yourself up. 

When you say “it’s”, you are talking about the belief, yes?

 

[Proserpina]

@Nahm

I guess so.  Also just the knowledge of your capacity. 

Intellect has an impact on realization. Animals can't self realize. 

 

[Nahm]

@Proserpina

That’s a silly belief. That’s actually three silly beliefs. All unnecessary justification & rationalization. 

[Proserpina]

@Nahm Hm. Maybe. 

But you won't see an animal or someone with a 'developmental disorder' that involves intellect (who are animal like) sitting like the Buddha answering questions on reality with perfect sense.  

There are limits.  A kangaroo can't stop being a kangaroo.