Distinguishing illusion from reality

[Someone here]

7 minutes ago, Vibroverse said:

Everything is illusion, therefore everything is reality. 

How so? Aren't these opposites? 

[Tim R]

19 minutes ago, Someone here said:

How so? Aren't these opposites? 

@Someone here I think you know the answer to that.

[tsuki]

16 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Interesting. So are you sayin I should let go of that distinction between illusion and reality? 

I am telling you to listen to your feelings, to your body, about the matter.
Your body is telling you that you are in conflict and I'm telling you that you will most definitely not get out of it by picking sides.

Look into this matter, investigate what you promise to yourself that you will get out of "knowing reality".
Then, investigate illusion and ask yourself whether or not "the prize" it is present there.

[Someone here]

@Tim R I really don't. Trust me lol. 

[WelcometoReality]

@Someone here Illusion is simply something appearing to be something that it is not. 

A mirage appears to be an oasis in the desert but it's only a mirage of an oasis. 

There seems to be a separate self called @Someone here but it was only identification to the sense perceptions.

There seems to be a car but it just is without any definitions. 

These mirages appears within reality as reality and when reality wakes up they are seen for what they are, mirages.

 

[Tim R]

No? Okay then let me make this very easy for you:

Let me simply ask you: Would the difference between illusion and reality be real or illusory? 

If it is real, then illusion would not be part of reality. But there can't be anything but reality because it's everything there is. You can't have anything outside of reality (I don't mean this in a spacial sense). 

So the difference must be illusory. And if the difference between illusion and reality is itself just and illusion - then of course, illusion and reality are identical. 

[Someone here]

@Tim R so is your position that it's not possible to distinguish between illusion and reality?  Therefore we can't know if we are dreaming or awake at any given moment?  

[Shin]

 

48 minutes ago, Someone here said:

How so? Aren't these opposites? 

There are only opposites in a duality framework.
A duality is something you're making up to experience yourself as God, mainly by believing you're an individual self separated from other selves.

So an illusion can only be an illusion, when you believe something is an illusion, in contrast to something that is real.
The thing is, when you're believing something is real and some other thing is an illusion, this is also an illusion.

Words break down here, you have to see that directly, it's funny as hell lol

[SriSriJustinBieber]

Illusion is simply how reality appears within time and space, or through the senses, therefore one who desires to come to reality can investigate and detach from those. Self inquiry as popularized by ramana maharshi works too

Ultimately there is no distinction but you must consider that there is one to come to a first vision of unity

[Tim R]

15 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Tim R so is your position that it's not possible to distinguish between illusion and reality?  Therefore we can't know if we are dreaming or awake at any given moment?  

@Someone here You literally can't "distinguish between illusion and reality" because even to assume that there is "reality" as opposed to "illusion" between which you could distinguish is already setting up a distinction!! 

17 minutes ago, Shin said:

So an illusion can only be an illusion, when you believe something is an illusion, in contrast to something that is real.
The thing is, when you're believing something is real and some other thing is an illusion, this is also an illusion.

EXACTLY. 

In a sense, the distinction between illusion and reality is the most unreal thing you could come up with??

[Shin]

3 minutes ago, Tim R said:

@Someone here You literally can't "distinguish between illusion and reality" because even to assume that there is "reality" as opposed to "illusion" between which you could distinguish is already setting up a distinction!! 

EXACTLY. 

In a sense, the distinction between illusion and reality is the most unreal thing you could come up with??

Yes

And the funniest thing is, is that to explain this I had to remember it, which is also an illusion  

[Gesundheit2]

To say that there is an illusion implies that there is a truth behind the illusion. And to say that there is a truth implies that there is an illusion happening elsewhere aside from the truth.

But who is saying?

Just sayin'.

[Someone here]

5 hours ago, Tim R said:

You literally can't "distinguish between illusion and reality" because even to assume that there is "reality" as opposed to "illusion" between which you could distinguish is already setting up a distinction!! 

So reality is an illusion in the ultimate analysis? 

[Tim R]

@Someone here No. 

In the ultimate analysis, there is neither reality nor illusion.

[Shin]

9 minutes ago, Someone here said:

So reality is an illusion in the ultimate analysis? 

It's more real than what you're experiencing now, and more magical and fantastical than what you're experiencing now.

[Someone here]

4 minutes ago, Tim R said:

@Someone here No. 

In the ultimate analysis, there is neither reality nor illusion.

There is what then? 

Or are you just being a clever little devil? 

[Tim R]

Just now, Someone here said:

There is what then? 

There is what then? Well there is ... not a "what" then. Not even a "there is". 

What some people might call "Reality" with a capital R. Mind you, language isn't always very useful when taking about dualities like "real" and "illusory" and their collapse. 

Just now, Someone here said:

Or are you just being a clever little devil? 

Takes one to know one??

[SOUL]

It's amusing to think that any of you are actually real people who exist in the world with this nonsense you are distracting yourself with so apparently you have very vivid imaginations and the distinction between reality and delusion is indistinguishable for some.

[Someone here]

14 hours ago, SOUL said:

It's amusing to think that any of you are actually real people who exist in the world with this nonsense you are distracting yourself with so apparently you have very vivid imaginations and the distinction between reality and delusion is indistinguishable for some.

We are not distracting ourselves. This is a serious inquiry. But you are not contributing anything useful to add to the thread. 

[SOUL]

10 hours ago, Someone here said:

We are not distracting ourselves. This is a serious inquiry. But you are not contributing anything useful to add to the thread. 

My greatest contribution to this thread would be to suggest subtraction.... clear your mind of all this clutter. The ego loves to view all this conceptualizing as 'serious inquiry' when it truly is nothing more than distracting from being... just being.