Advice For 5-meo-dmt Trip

[Deep]

@Leo Gura When you took 5-meo, did you see anything different or was it just your awareness expanding? 

[Leo Gura]

@Deep "Just your awareness expanding" is a rather mild way of putting it. More like:

Infinity descended upon me like a giant hungry motherfucking pterodactyl.

 

[Hunter Arrington]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@Deep "Just your awareness expanding" is a rather mild way of putting it. More like:

Infinity descended upon me like a giant hungry motherfucking pterodactyl.

 

LOL

[Neo]

22 hours ago, OBEler said:

And that might sound crazy for you but sitting at home the whole week alone and meditating can make you much faster grow than a trip to barcelona with your best friends. 

 

I think you'll find that @Debbie B compared climbing a mountain with snorting drugs, but you quote her comparing meditation with a trip to Barcelona.

[AlwaysBeNice]

@John Flores I thought the same thing: 'Drugs are probably bad for the spiritual path, if God wanted you to have an experience, he would just give it to you'.

But then it fucking dawned on me, hey, if these things are not meant to be taken, WHY ARE THEY ALL OVER IN NATURE? 

And when you take them with the intent to heal, go within, expand your awareness you will realize them for the divine tools/medicine they are, just wonderful technology. 

[Leo Gura]

"God helps those who help themselves (to psychedelics)."

[Ozisoki]

@Leo Gura How do you know which perception of reality is the Truth? The one you see on a chemical or the one you see normally. 

I'm not convinced Leo that the Truth is what you see on a chemical. Why should i be? I saw your video on this but you didn't really explain your reasoning on why and how you know, just that you do.

I did some experimenting myself and for years i thought that must be the real Truth i saw! But on basis of what? That it felt more fundamental, truer and realer. What if it just felt like that coz I felt it truer due to a change in brain chemistry? 

I don't want to be a pain in the ass here but this is a real dilemma! For me at least.

It seems like a strange notion to me that I can only perceive reality in my normal state in a way that is qualitatively inferior to the reality a chemical "lets" you see. The world seems so real just in its everyday form, I can touch things, I can feel them, I can drop a glass vase on the floor that shatters into pieces. I see and touch the pieces of glass that I broke with my own body and the floor. Other people can see the glass pieces, they can talk about it and there seems to be consensus that the vase is shattered and that's what reality is. Hell, the guy can even cut his finger on it and a 2nd guy smell the blood. 

I am seriously confused on what reality is!

Edited December 17, 2016 by Ozisoki
Forgot something

[Leo Gura]

16 minutes ago, Ozisoki said:

How do you know which perception of reality is the Truth? The one you see on a chemical or the one you see normally. 

Real vs unreal is something your mind created. There is no such distinction in the ABSOLUTE.

You'll be very surprised to discover that what you call reality is no more real than last night's dream.

Don't underestimate the power of your mind to deceive you.

If you ever experience the ABSOLUTE, you'll know it has nothing to do with brain chemistry.

The fundamental problem is, you've never in your life experienced a higher state of consciousness, the ABSOLUTE, or Truth. So all you've got to work with is experience and thoughts. Both of which are woefully insufficient.

You're missing an ENTIRE CATEGORY of stuff from your worldview. It's sorta like you were born blind, and now you're trying to persuade non-blind people that color doesn't exist. "Leo! How can you be sure colors exists? What if it's untrue? What if you're wrong?"

Enable your vision, and you'll see it's a non-issue. You cannot solve the problem of blindness intellectually.

[AlwaysBeNice]

1 minute ago, John Flores said:

@AlwaysBeNice @Leo Gura

Have you ever wondered why you had a bad trip? It's your subconscious mind (or your soul) saying "this is not the way"....

Yes, everything is a tool, but it's naive to make a blanket statement of "drugs are a tool"...

They are obvious divine medicine when you use them with the intent to heal. And you still have to do the work, it doesn't do it for you, it helps you.

Nature didn't make a mistake in creating you nor did it make a mistake with the plants who work on our brains.

And no, I've had 'bad' (no such thing as bad ultimately, only challenging) trips when I was younger and that was because it was putting me face to face with my fears, that my mind believed in because I was brought up in a sick negative world.

@Ozisoki The One consciousness is projected into spirit which is projected into a body, in the collective physical world there are means to operate with the body so that the spirit can be projected back into itself or into thought realms, which is correlated by the brain as long as you are not dead.

www.evidenceforthesoul.weebly.com

[Ozisoki]

@Leo Gura  I appreciate your answer Leo but I don't understand it. 

For me the distinction between real and unreal is tangible. Based on your reasoning though my last night's dream and my reality today are both equally real or unreal. Ok but I perceive them differently. So how is it true what you are saying?

Either what you're saying is untrue, or it's true but I can't grasp it due to my consciousness level. 

Your talk on the absolute will not convince me for sure until I experience it for myself. Honestly, i think that's the only thing that can resolve my confusion, talking about it sure won't!

[Leo Gura]

12 minutes ago, John Flores said:

if you don't, then you believe that everyone's purpose should be like yours

No, create your own purpose. I am merely offering ideas and possibilities. You design your own life. Nothing I say is ever normative. If you want to become a serial killer, go for it.

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, Ozisoki said:

@Leo Gura  I appreciate your answer Leo but I don't understand it. 

For me the distinction between real and unreal is tangible. Based on your reasoning though my last night's dream and my reality today are both equally real or unreal. Ok but I perceive them differently. So how is it true what you are saying?

Either what you're saying is untrue, or it's true but I can't grasp it due to my consciousness level. 

Your talk on the absolute will not convince me for sure until I experience it for myself. Honestly, i think that's the only thing that can resolve my confusion, talking about it sure won't!

That's right. You cannot understand it because you are like an ant trying to understand the Milky Way. It is not possible.

But, by raising your consciousness, you're able to access deeper understanding.

So you gotta start doing the work: meditation, contemplation, self-inquiry, psychedelics, etc. to raise your consciousness. Raising consciousness is not easy. Takes a lot of time investment.

[Ozisoki]

@Leo Gura 

Yea Leo, I know. It's not the time, it's the pain, the darkness and the confusion that bother me about those things...

I'm coming out of major depression... not 100% out yet but I'm progressing slowly and hope to reach baseline in I hope a couple of months.

This existential shit is exactly what got me into this sinkhole so what you are mentioning here seems to be synonymous with self-mutilation from where I am standing. I mean, I would never say something publicly like meditation=horseshit, but i know I tried so many times and retried and have a massive resistance against doing it and I know that resistance is coming from this feeling. 

Anyway, I think this whole awakening to society's bullshit journey takes too much blood and I'm not convinced anymore if Truth really merits so much blood sacrifice.

Time will sort out this out. It's alright.

[AlwaysBeNice]

1 hour ago, John Flores said:

@AlwaysBeNice

Leo's advice has only gotten me into trouble and on many occasion. He's a very physical man. At this stage he hides all the secrets he knows and for good reason, because they wouldn't understand....

The reason why he was lucky enough to be spared by the spiritual forces is:

A) Because his mission is physically oriented (his head didn't get lost in the clouds)

B) He has millions of viewers per year and the messengers and angels are often defending his channel subconsciously

There are other reasons but I don't want to inspire fear...point is...Leo is not just anyone....he has a following, he has talking skills, he has agents and protectors....it's different...he has "power" lol....that is a force only granted by esoteric aspects....no one gains ability to rule over others  without divine permission/decree

 

Alwaysbenice, I'm saying be careful because I've experienced hell and was intellectually attacked by demons and the satan who tricks the druggy's mind (who pisses him off/  offends his servants) into believing that pain is eternal that death is life....just be careful and follow sensitive and good hearted people with any process related to this 

Nah brother, there's no forces controlling over anyone, all are created equal with the free will to chose who we want to be in every moment, that is God's gift to itself. No one is more special or powerful, that's just duality, we are one. 

Also, demons or 'the Satan' only tricked you into believing they could attack you, and if you know that and that nothing happens by coincidence, that calamity creates growth and wisdom, that there is a perfection in the process and so that ultimately you decide how you feel about anything you will never worry again, whether demons appear or not. 

[Neo]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

b

 

2 hours ago, AlwaysBeNice said:

 

Nature didn't make a mistake in creating you nor did it make a mistake with the plants who work on our brains.

I've heard this before, or similar about "God's creations" particularly with regards to cannabis, and although I appreciate all that nature provides us, it's not quite right. Firstly, the way you use the phrase could be applied to heroin, cocaine, anything.

Secondly, it doesn't recognise how life has evolved within it's natural environment alongside these chemicals, and plants and toads and so forth have produced chemicals (mostly toxic) to act to the detriment of their predators. As far as I know there isn't anything that directly benefits from these LSD like chemicals produced by toads, at least not for millions of years until we discovered them. Or anything benefit from the Peyote cactus etc etc.

Important here not to miss the point that if rain was a solution of LSD, life would have evolved differently so that LSD did not interrupt or destroy life or put it at a disadvantage to other life.

It is through the study of medicine that we are able to find therapeutic doses of what are often toxic or poisonous plants.

So in a nutshell, I don't subscribe to the opinion that there's either a god or a plan to insert these chemicals by intention here and there seemingly hidden in nature.

 

@Leo GuraWith regard to Leo's drug stance, I still say it's not the drugs themselves that are my major point, mostly this; for people who were following Leo's videos week by week, avidly waiting for each instalment, the way the drugs issue was then thrust upon everyone, having been told a few weeks before that this was a mammoth task of endurance possible for only a few watchers who would succeed, it appeared as a massive U turn, a cop out and disappointment. I've tried to make the point before but what happenes is those with their energies invested in the drugs tend to attack me and turn it round to say I'm not open minded yada yadda instead of listening to the subtlety of what I'm trying to explain.

To add, with one of my subtle points now, is that now all the fans of DMT and 5MEO are here, there is no one giving any virtue to the other way any more - which was actually Leo's way not so long ago. In fact it's suggested that I'm basically going to wallow in hell for at least x months if I don't do the drugs. And at this stage some have taken to being very personal about it as I'm sure you've seen in the other threads.

 

 

Edited December 17, 2016 by Neo

[Afonso]

This is some heavy shit

[Tancrede Pouyat]

@Neo Okay... This is not going to be easy.

There's no better path, and no one is saying that the "drugs" path is easier than the other paths. It just seems like 5-meo was the neurotransmitter responsible for the human ego. And don't even think that this makes anything any easier, the experiences are perhaps the most emotionally difficult experiences you'll have in your life.

Oh, and also, the stigma against drugs is purely cultural, entirely arbitrary, and as stupid as a stigma against sending humans into space would be. 5-Meo is merely a mean to an end. You can use your subconscious mind to accomplish success just like you can use 5-MeO to free yourself of the shackles of your ego. And just like you can use anything to accomplish anything. And Leo isn't out here telling you to do the stupid drugs like heroin, he's even saying that MDMA (and extensively all other empathogens) isn't a real psychedelic.

Also, you seem troubled by Leo changing his views but I don't and I'm sure I'm not the only one. He keeps telling everybody that he doesn't cling to any of his perspectives. And neither do I, I understand that all perspectives are partial, so does he.

[Neo]

@Tancrede Pouyat I know you are into your lucid dreaming reports. Here's what happened to me today - no drugs involved. Trip report : daily trip into store cupboard:

 

I stepped from the store room into my office and was confronted with a short hallucination. I'd stepped into the black of outer space and in front of me all I can see against the black background is glass walls or partitions at various intervals.

I immediately feel the urge to look down as it seems to go in all directions and there is no "up", "down", "left" or "right". I can see my legs and feet so I know this is not a "non-dual" experience. I am there in person. The blackness continues below again with more glass lines or partitions with the only facet being a very distant light or star, or is it a triangle / pyramid? Too small to see.

At the same time I was aware that I feel very light in the balls of my feet - and up through my knee joints and hips, I can't feel weight on them, instead the soles of my feet are tingling as I stand on nothing. And then... back in the room. All in a few seconds.

 

I just want you to know this happened by coincidence / chance without effort. I thought I would mention it because I have a strong feeling I don't need drugs. This is not a flashback - I have never done psycodelics. Apart from this the other hallucinations I have are moments of complete joy.

 

There are two schools of thought I have seen; 1. Hallucinations of the ego (non-enlightened) are meaning less because they are born of the ego.

2. Absolutely everything is relevant and has substance and meaning behind it even if it's not immediately apparent.

 

 

 

 

 

[Debbie B]

@Afonso    This is just really basic common sense speaking here..

1.  Perhaps taking this drug is not a big deal....but if it is, can it be undone?  When you make decisions you think of consequences, What are the consequences of doing this?  You do not know that answer and it looks to me, judging by every ones differing opinion here, they don't either.... there is no hard and fast answer. 

2.  Why are you asking total strangers if you should do this?  Ask someone who has invested time and love in you, ask someone who would give everything to make you happy, because they will have your best interests at heart.  People on forums are just passing through...

3.  If you have to ask if you should do something, you are not ready....If you knew, you wouldn't need someone elses' opinion, You would just know without needing their opinion.

And Yes..'.It is heavy shit' !

[Debbie B]

@Ozisoki  I am sorry you have been unwell, but joyful you are beginning to feel more in control.  I too, can understand the confusion regarding the whole concept of the 'Truth' and why it is even needed...You need a whole new vocabulary as well!

Explanations of meditation to me sound internalised, selfish and subjective...I understand.  I am positive it works for so many people, but there are different ways....  And I think you go on this journey ultimately to feel part of something, wanting the connection. A unity if you will.

These are things that work for me, to make me feel grounded, they might help you.   My 'meditation' works in a much simpler way, I sit on the ground in the garden and instead of excluding everything, I let it all in...I try to focus on a bird singing, the smell of the earth, perhaps the sound of water.  I give Thanks.  This refreshes me, nothing mystical at all.   It hurts me to see pain...I try to fix where I can, try that. The offer of a hand, a smile to a stranger. For me it is  connecting in a real way and simply makes me Happy   Go for Happy, fulfilled everytime!