Hiring Game Engine Developer

[alpha_ulrich]

Hi,

Someone with experience developing games (I know Leo is one), can you please point me towards how to get access to a group of game engine developers who would be willing to work on a full-time/contract/freelance basis for creating a table-top game? Is there some Discord server for this?

[Leo Gura]

You can hire freelancer coders at:

• Guru.com
• Upwork.com
• etc.

[impulse9]

You can find skilled game developers on https://forums.tigsource.com/ under Jobs section. Probably the best source I know of, although it's gotten a bit less popular over the years. Another one to try is https://gamedev.net/.

In contrast to what Leo said, I would avoid upwork, freelancer and similar sites because they're overrun by cheap labor from India, very hard to find competent people there. Not impossible, just hard. Go straight to game developer forums or chatrooms (IRC/discord/etc), you'll find skilled people there faster.

Know that game developers are expensive. I could write an engine for you but I charge a lot.

[alpha_ulrich]

14 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

You can find skilled game developers on https://forums.tigsource.com/ under Jobs section. Probably the best source I know of, although it's gotten a bit less popular over the years. Another one to try is https://gamedev.net/.

In contrast to what Leo said, I would avoid upwork, freelancer and similar sites because they're overrun by cheap labor from India, very hard to find competent people there. Not impossible, just hard. Go straight to game developer forums or chatrooms (IRC/discord/etc), you'll find skilled people there faster.

Know that game developers are expensive. I could write an engine for you but I charge a lot.

How much? Would you be willing to come on a voice call to discuss this?

Edited September 6, 2021 by alpha_ulrich

[impulse9]

@alpha_ulrich I have way too many projects going on at the moment, so it's a pass for me at this point in time. For perspective, typically I charge 50 to 100 bucks per hour (depending on how complex the project is), a full game engine usually takes months to develop so you can get a rough idea that it would add up quick. Your description is also way too vague for me to tell you anything substantial, it could be much simpler than I expect, or much more complex than I expect, you have to really define it well before someone can give you a proper overview. I would even suggest you create a detailed GDD (game design document) that you can share with people you would potentially hire. That will make it MUCH easier for them to evaluate the complexity of your project and for you to understand the targets you want to reach. You can probably find a cheaper programmer than me, but make _absolutely sure_ to analyze their prior work in depth. There's a lot of people out there who don't know what they're doing, and those who do know typically charge a lot. So just keep that in mind. Good luck!

[alpha_ulrich]

2 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

@alpha_ulrich I have way too many projects going on at the moment, so it's a pass for me at this point in time. For perspective, typically I charge 50 to 100 bucks per hour (depending on how complex the project is), a full game engine usually takes months to develop so you can get a rough idea that it would add up quick. Your description is also way too vague for me to tell you anything substantial, it could be much simpler than I expect, or much more complex than I expect, you have to really define it well before someone can give you a proper overview. I would even suggest you create a detailed GDD (game design document) that you can share with people you would potentially hire. That will make it MUCH easier for them to evaluate the complexity of your project and for you to understand the targets you want to reach. You can probably find a cheaper programmer than me, but make _absolutely sure_ to analyze their prior work in depth. There's a lot of people out there who don't know what they're doing, and those who do know typically charge a lot. So just keep that in mind. Good luck!

Thanks a lot man. This is really helpful. It will take me this week to actually ingest what you just said, and then probably I can create the GDD, and start hunting the perfect candidate.

[alpha_ulrich]

@impulse9 there is a rule on tig:
Rule #4: Avoid posting job offers if you have no gamedev experience.
There have been multiple instances in the past of people posting offers for both paid and unpaid work while themselves having no experience making games. These projects generally ended in disaster and wasted colossal amounts of time for those involved. If you've never made a game before, but want to hire people to make a game for you, please do not do that. You will likely waste people's time making something that will never make it onto the market. This is not meant to be discouraging or harsh, it is fact. People who lack experience and leadership lead their teams to their eventual doom.
 

Would you be willing to at least help me post my requirements on that forum? I can pay you hourly for consultation and creation of document. Let me know if you can help me out, as I am from software development background (Ex-Amazon Engineer), but do not have personal experience creating games.

[Leo Gura]

It's pretty foolish to develop your own game engine. Just use Unity. You can also hire Unity programmers at the Unity forum. A good Unity programmer will expect $60k-$100k/yr.

[Ghost]

If you write your own game engine, you may as well write your own OS and kernel.

You are not DICE or AAA studio to have your own game engine which you'll be updating for decades.

Use Unreal Engine or Unity. You'll be spending shit tons of time developing anyways. Game development is the hardest thing in programming, why make your situation even worse?

 

Society is standing on the shoulders of giants, appreciate it.

[Raptorsin7]

@Leo Gura Do you still have any inside info on the gaming industry?

Do you know what it would take tech wise to make a jump in the capacity in games.

I was playing age of empires 4 recently, and I was thinking how awesome it would be to combine a game like age of empires, with elements of civ 6 and starcitizen. Maybe even have games where you can swap between RTS and first person mechanics. But idk what kind of technology is required for something like that?

[Leo Gura]

16 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

@Leo Gura Do you still have any inside info on the gaming industry?

There's not much to know other than specific games companies are working on, which obviously I don't know.

Quote

Do you know what it would take tech wise to make a jump in the capacity in games.

I don't think tech is holding any games back these days. The problems are more in a lack of creativity, risk-aversion, lack of good management, and funding.

You can basically make any game you want with Unreal or Unity. The devil is all in the details of the design and the crazy number of man-hours required to actualize it.

Quote

I was playing age of empires 4 recently, and I was thinking how awesome it would be to combine a game like age of empires, with elements of civ 6 and starcitizen. Maybe even have games where you can swap between RTS and first person mechanics. But idk what kind of technology is required for something like that?

It's not a technology problem, it's a design and marketing problem. The question is whether that design makes any sense, who would want to play it, and how to get funding to build it.

[Raptorsin7]

@Leo Gura Interesting, I always thought the problem with games nowadays was that developers were limited by technology so they have to cut corners and settle.

Is it even possible for a single motivated person to make a game of the quality of something like age of empires or civ? What if you use psychidelics?

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

@Leo Gura Interesting, I always thought the problem with games nowadays was that developers were limited by technology so they have to cut corners and settle.

The problems are all in the design, the marketing, and the funding. You have to cut corners because of funding. Your funds are always limited relative to the scope of your vision for a game. You will have to cut out 80% of your vision just to ship the damn thing and not run out of funds.

Quote

Is it even possible for a single motivated person to make a game of the quality of something like age of empires or civ?

No

Most games like that require so many man-years of work that even if one person worked on it 24/7 for 100 years, you'd would not finish 5% of the work.

The best a lone-wolf developer can make is something small, simple, and indie -- like Stardew Valley.

[Raptorsin7]

@Leo Gura Ahh interesting thanks

[Raptorsin7]

@impulse9 How much would it cost to make a game like age of empires 4?

Also, how come it's not as simple as meditating and simply visualizing what kind of game you want, and then the universe unfolds and gives it you

[impulse9]

Millions.

1 minute ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Also, how come it's not as simple as meditating and simply visualizing what kind of game you want, and then the universe unfolds and gives it you

Same reason it's not as simple to meditate and simply visualize what kind of house you want, and having your house build itself overnight.  It's hard work. I make games for a living. It's not uncommon for me to spend the whole day working on just one issue, just one tiny, barely perceptible behavior that most players wouldn't even notice. Imagine how many potential issues a game live AOE4 can have. It's a job for a game studio with 100+ people, each working within their own specialization. If you want to make games as a solo dev, you have to humble the shit out of yourself. Make something retro. Something that wouldn't look out of place on a NES in 1989. That's possible to create alone, but guess what, even that will take you months, if not years of hard work.

[Raptorsin7]

Just now, impulse9 said:

Millions.

Same reason it's not as simple to meditate and simply visualize what kind of house you want, and having your house build itself overnight.  It's hard work. I make games for a living. It's not uncommon for me to spend the whole day working on just one issue, just one tiny, barely perceptible behavior that most players wouldn't even notice. Imagine how many potential issues a game live AOE4 can have. It's a job for a game studio with 100+ people, each working within their own specialization. If you want to make games as a solo dev, you have to humble the shit out of yourself. Make something retro. Something that wouldn't look out of place on a NES in 1989. That's possible to create alone, but guess what, even that will take you months, if not years of hard work.

I understand. I was just thinking about what it would take to make a cool game after playing age of empires 4, I have 0 experience in any kind of development