Girls want Traditional Men, But Don't want to be Traditional Ladies

[Alysssa]

Quote

but this still doesn’t excuse the fact that I don’t wanna feel like a dodo bird ?stooge committing  to some slut who the whole town has ejaculated  upon.

LOL this "slut" annoys you because she doesn't want you due to your shitty personality

Edited September 8, 2021 by Alysssa

[coca]

@Leo Gura How am I dumb for holding this view ?

[Mada_]

On 06/09/2021 at 1:17 AM, coca said:

This is where you see a lot of male frustration arise.

Hmm. Smells like a victim mentality to me. 

 

 

[Preety_India]

Why judge someone for their sexual history? 

Sounds like being too judgemental. 

What a person does in a relationship is more relevant than what they did in the past. 

You have many insecurities to work through. 

 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, coca said:

@Leo Gura How am I dumb for holding this view ?

It simply isn't true.

You've fallen into self-deception by cherrypicking, confirmation bias, and ideology.

Go watch my series on Self-Deception Parts 1, 2, 3.

[Danioover9000]

@coca

On 05/09/2021 at 4:17 PM, coca said:

A lot of misconception, misunderstanding, and back and forth debate surrounding female attraction and sexuality between men and women boils down to one concept:

Girls want Traditional Men, But Don't want to be Traditional Themselves.

This is where you see a lot of male frustration arise.

 Women expect and value traits that associated with traditionally strong men, such as confidence, dominance, assertiveness, status, leadership, and often favor men who are ruthless in attaining these qualities, while telling the public politically correct answers that they like "nice, kind, sweet, honest, and empathetic men.

Further, they absolve themselves of being "traditional women", by having lots of casual sex with assholes, posting their ass and tits on social media, wearing sexually provocative clothes in public, etc. 

Traits such as nurturance, sensitivity, sweetness,[15] supportiveness,[11][8] gentleness,[8][9] warmth,[11][9] passivity, cooperativeness, expressiveness,[25] modesty, humility, empathy,[8] affection, tenderness,[11] and being emotional, kind, helpful, devoted, and understanding[9] have been cited as stereotypically feminine. The defining characteristics of femininity vary between and even within societies.

Standards of manliness or masculinity vary across different cultures and historical periods.[8] Traits traditionally viewed as masculine in Western societyinclude strength, courage, independence, leadership, and assertiveness

   Ok, that's nice to know. So, what do you really want from this thread?

[coca]

@Leo Gura

There is no difference between attracting a chain-smoking club slut vs a virgin enlightened unicorn soul princess.

The attraction triggers are all hardwired deep in her brain stem and are the same.

That enlightened unicorn soul princess likes to get bent over and fucked just like any other girl.

Watch out for the myth of spiritual people somehow being special snowflakes who are above the animal drives. No they aren't. They are horny animals just like everyone else.

The girl who pretends that she is special and "not that type of girl" is exactly the type of girl who will sleep with an asshole psychopath at the drop of a dime.

Every girl thinks she is "not that type of girl".

They like: confidence, assertiveness, detachment from outcome, driven-ness, strength, leadership, charisma.

Which tends to be what assholes have a lot of.

What if I said this:

High quality enlightened guys don't like perfectly shaped big tits. They are just too special for that. They are above that. Only scumbag guys like that.

Would you believe it?

 

Of course no girl will admit to going to a club to fuck. She must act like it's just fun with friends so she isn't slut-shamed by folks like you.

Hot girls have lots of sex on a whim. It's not all about finding some ideal partner. Sometimes people are just horny and looking for an adventure.

Exactly.

Because you have too little experience with the sexual escapades of hot girls.

Girls conceal and lie about how much sex they have and how easily and quickly they have it. She doesn't want you to know she sucked some random dude's cock in the parking lot after talking to him for 30 minutes. Yet this happens all the time. Your innocent girl isn't as innocent as you imagine. Your blood would boil if you knew how much sex these girls are having without you and the kind of scumbags they do it with. I am mean total scumbags.

I've seen too much 

Leo's idea? Lol

Yeah, I invented that. All me. No woman has ever fallen for an asshole.

You can talk and theorize all you want, but the fact remains that a highly feminine girl would rather get fucked by a strong asshole than by a weak guy.

There are some harsh truths about how women have sex. When you learn the truth of it, it busts many romanticized myths and cultural fantasies.

I got nothing against femininity or women. I just don't prepetuate the myths of how they have sex.

Sex is deliberately lied about in our culture because it is still taboo. You women have to maintain an air of innocence and purity. I get it. But I am not going to play those games.

Of course. The reality is, a woman wants strong emotions. And a player gives that to her like no other man can. Which is why women will cheat on their lame boyfriends and husbands with players. A women with get attracted to whatever guy gives her the strongest emotions.

Then don't sleep with players. Sleep with some shy nerd who has zero game. There are millions of them around so you will have no problem finding one.

But you see, you don't want to sleep with such a man. You are not attracted to that. You are attracted precisely to strong men who are players who would sleep with lots of women. But you selfishly want to lock him down for yourself exclusively.

If a woman has enough value, she will be able to leverage it to get the man to be loyal to her. But if she has insufficient value, she won't. And this is what really pisses you off. Because you want to be able to lock down a man with higher value than you, and you see how easily that fails. But you still want it because you are greedy. You want value for free. This is otherwise known as stealing value. Your ego-mind wants to steal sexual value. Well, that doesn't work so well. So stop doing it.

But also, don't pretend like women don't go through a slutty phase. Women sleep around as much if not more than men, but you love to deny it.

Haha

In practice what most women do is this:

They spend their teens and 20s sleeping around with the hottest, most high-value guys they can find. But since these guys are high value, they tend to be players who leverage their value and won't commit, or are abusive narcissistic assholes. So eventually by the time you hit your 30s you learn your lesson and lower your standards to guys who are less players, but also less attractive and you find some comfortable compromise position with such a guy and you two settle down.

Then you get divorced.

This is a tale as old as mankind itself. Nothing at all surprising about it. This is the game. The game is happening whether you know it or not, whether you want it or not.

Are you seriously going to deny that hot women in their 20's sleep around?

Come on.

I just wouldn't recommend sleeping with a crack whore.

How you use sex is a great honest signal of your level of consciousness and development.

The less conscious you are, the more dysfunctional and degenerate your sex will be, and vice versa.

I bet you've opened it to some unworthy 

It's okay. I won't judge.

What you really want is a player who will fall head over heels in love with only you.

Would you want to marry and have kids with the town slut?

Never. You want a nice girl who will be loyal to you.

You may like women being sluts when you're looking for one night stands, but as soon as you start looking for a serious partner you will sing a very different tune. And all women know this subconsciously. They know that a serious guy won't commit to a slut, he will just pump and dump her.

Edited September 9, 2021 by coca

[Danioover9000]

@coca

7 minutes ago, coca said:

@Leo Gura Of course no girl will admit to going to a club to fuck. She must act like it's just fun with friends so she isn't slut-shamed by folks like you.

Hot girls have lots of sex on a whim. It's not all about finding some ideal partner. Sometimes people are just horny and looking for an adventure.

Exactly.

Because you have too little experience with the sexual escapades of hot girls.

Girls conceal and lie about how much sex they have and how easily and quickly they have it. She doesn't want you to know she sucked some random dude's cock in the parking lot after talking to him for 30 minutes. Yet this happens all the time. Your innocent girl isn't as innocent as you imagine. Your blood would boil if you knew how much sex these girls are having without you and the kind of scumbags they do it with. I am mean total scumbags.

I've seen too much 

Leo's idea? Lol

Yeah, I invented that. All me. No woman has ever fallen for an asshole.

You can talk and theorize all you want, but the fact remains that a highly feminine girl would rather get fucked by a strong asshole than by a weak guy.

There are some harsh truths about how women have sex. When you learn the truth of it, it busts many romanticized myths and cultural fantasies.

I got nothing against femininity or women. I just don't prepetuate the myths of how they have sex.

Sex is deliberately lied about in our culture because it is still taboo. You women have to maintain an air of innocence and purity. I get it. But I am not going to play those games.

Of course. The reality is, a woman wants strong emotions. And a player gives that to her like no other man can. Which is why women will cheat on their lame boyfriends and husbands with players. A women with get attracted to whatever guy gives her the strongest emotions.

Then don't sleep with players. Sleep with some shy nerd who has zero game. There are millions of them around so you will have no problem finding one.

But you see, you don't want to sleep with such a man. You are not attracted to that. You are attracted precisely to strong men who are players who would sleep with lots of women. But you selfishly want to lock him down for yourself exclusively.

If a woman has enough value, she will be able to leverage it to get the man to be loyal to her. But if she has insufficient value, she won't. And this is what really pisses you off. Because you want to be able to lock down a man with higher value than you, and you see how easily that fails. But you still want it because you are greedy. You want value for free. This is otherwise known as stealing value. Your ego-mind wants to steal sexual value. Well, that doesn't work so well. So stop doing it.

But also, don't pretend like women don't go through a slutty phase. Women sleep around as much if not more than men, but you love to deny it.

Haha

In practice what most women do is this:

They spend their teens and 20s sleeping around with the hottest, most high-value guys they can find. But since these guys are high value, they tend to be players who leverage their value and won't commit, or are abusive narcissistic assholes. So eventually by the time you hit your 30s you learn your lesson and lower your standards to guys who are less players, but also less attractive and you find some comfortable compromise position with such a guy and you two settle down.

Then you get divorced.

This is a tale as old as mankind itself. Nothing at all surprising about it. This is the game. The game is happening whether you know it or not, whether you want it or not.

Are you seriously going to deny that hot women in their 20's sleep around?

Come on.

I just wouldn't recommend sleeping with a crack whore.

How you use sex is a great honest signal of your level of consciousness and development.

The less conscious you are, the more dysfunctional and degenerate your sex will be, and vice versa.

I bet you've opened it to some unworthy 

It's okay. I won't judge.

What you really want is a player who will fall head over heels in love with only you.

Would you want to marry and have kids with the town slut?

Never. You want a nice girl who will be loyal to you.

You may like women being sluts when you're looking for one night stands, but as soon as you start looking for a serious partner you will sing a very different tune. And all women know this subconsciously. They know that a serious guy won't commit to a slut, he will just pump and dump her.

   Yikes, that's touth. While it's still true that most of red pill is BS, a few men here and there will have much more difficulty in dating and fucking, which might seem like it validates red pill, in fact it doesn't, it's complex and comes down to the man, and the few who suffer far more in this area of life.

   I hope you are not those few. Forget about dating and improve other aeeas of your life instead. Don't give these 'PUA red/black/blue pillers', or promiscuous women any more of your limited energy and time.

[Preety_India]

Red pill nonsense. 

With that many hang ups around sex, how are you gonna find a relationship? 

In one sentence you judge a woman as unworthy because she has been sleeping around. 

But in the next sentence you say a serious guy will pump and dump a woman. 

So you hold a woman to a higher standard but you don't apply the same standard to a man? 

If a woman is low value because she sleeps around... 

How is a man "serious" and "high value" if he just pumps and dumps? 

If you want loyalty from a woman, you're completely okay with a man not being loyal? 

Double standards

 

 

[coca]

@Danioover9000 @Preety_India just to be clear those are all Leos quotes lol 

[Danioover9000]

@coca

4 minutes ago, coca said:

@Danioover9000 @Preety_India just to be clear those are all Leos quotes lol 

     Oh really? LOL!

Edited September 9, 2021 by Danioover9000

[Preety_India]

Doesn't matter whoever quotes. 

Red pill stuff will never help you in life. 

It's a justification for deep insecurity. 

 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, coca said:

@Danioover9000 @Preety_India just to be clear those are all Leos quotes lol 

Like I said, cherrypicking and confirmation bias.

You took stuff I said totally out of context to justify your absurd attitude towards women.

I warned you exactly against this.

[Karmadhi]

Also depends the context and the way you say it. I feel like Leo says it more in a neutral way like explaining how gravity works while you say it in a biased emotional angry resentful way, like being angry at gravity for working as it does. This is the issue with red pill, it has quite some truth to it but it uses it to build a very toxic ideology. I fell into it a year ago for a bit and looking back, well, pride does not follow the statement. There is definetly a lot of hypocrisy from females regarding dating and stuff but as i said in my previous comment, guys are not better. Both genders are hypocritical fucks. Red pill makes it seem as if only girls are so. "Girls love opportunistically and guys love idealistically". BULLSHIT! All love has some opportunistic elements to it. They make men like enlightned yogis when they re just as selfish as females are. 

[Leo Gura]

@Tangerinedream I do say vulgar things. But context. The dude just cherrypicked stuff from thousands of things I've said as if that represents my attitude about dating women. It does not at all.

[coca]

@Leo Gura Can you please elaborate how my view is absurd?

I didn’t take anything out of context, each of these replies is easily searchable and u can find the original thread it would just be too much to paste everything. 

 

[Gesundheit2]

@coca Your view is absurd because it doesn't come from direct experience with thousands of women. It's just a story you're telling yourself and you're clinging to it like an ideology.

Imagine a sophisticated writer who has written dozens, and read hundreds of books. And then you come and read one page and think you've figured everything out. This is what you're doing here.

Go and make thousands of approaches, then come here and tell us about it. By that time, I promise you you will have gotten laid several times.

[zazen]

Delivery is just as important as the content delivered. Women are evolved to respond to strength.  We only just created a somewhat stable environment. Women now have financial security but the physical and emotionally security needs are still present. The body is aroused by strength/sexiness (emotionally-short term) the head is attracted (logically-long term) to security. Women seek the strength for survival, but also seek that strength long term so it translates into protection and provisioning.

A lot of red pillers can become bitter by reality and rage sets in but they must realise this instinct (hypergamy - to reward and procreate with strength) is what drove men to raise themselves, and in doing so raise civilisation along with it, along side women. Without this evolutionary pressure we wouldn't be where we are today. Realise it for what it is, a beautiful mechanism of which a lot of it is subconscious - forgive them for they know not what they do.   

The 'bad boys' or 'barbaric men' on a deep level are displaying strength, although in its negative form.  In today's society where long term security is taken care of by the state or women's ability to earn, women are more inclined to look to other aspect of what men provide which is the more biological short term related strength or sexy genes and is emotionally charged, and thus also fleeting. For this reason we have most women going for the top 10-20% of men leaving other men behind. Before access to these men were limited by geography, smaller populations, religion and monogamous values but now with technology and modern culture we live in a global sexual market place where women have these men at their fingertips. Their biology (and hypergamous instinct is screaming at them - what if i can do better. In the same way the top tier of men are also being teased by the availability of women at their finger tips also.

When sexuality isn't buffered/contained by cultural or religious incentives and is left unchecked it destabilises society. Although religions problem was that they didn't contain but cut off people from their sexuality, the other extreme. The only solution I can think of is either sex evolves in their consciousness. Women evolve in the way that they are able to be happy with their partner and evolve past their hypergamous instinct telling them to see what else is out there, or to not run back to their bad boy lover ex. Or if women are going to only go for the 'alphas' the men left behind have to evolve and channel their sexuality to higher pursuits or just become better and provide women the sexual arousal their bodies react to and desire to satisfy that side of them. Maybe all this loneliness and fragmentation which leads to emotional trauma will lead people to spirituality/actualisation which is part of the evolution also. In the past, men who didn't  have access to women (ie Middle eastern society where harems were a thing) they would go into war. In present day, these men can be sedated in many ways via porn, entertainment etc

Women have the rights of men in the modern world, but the conscious responsibility that comes with those rights ie to select a longer term partner (for emotional security at least) over the short term hot guy (for their sexual security). It is also up to men to become and display masculine strength in its positive light. Don't be the 'nice guy' or the 'bad boy' but the great guy. Evolution will play its course, and natural selection will do its thing in the end.

[zazen]

To add to above, another path of evolution is for the top men getting all the attention to turn down and by pass their biological instinct to mate with anything that moves knowing that it isn't good for society at large. Or everyone becomes so evolved we can all make love to each other or don't need it all together in that form (sexually) but we are very far off from that reality. 

Iv had first hand experience with this so its not all theory, Iv had girls complain about their boyfriends while leaning up on me in bed after a party. A girl who wanted something serious with me which I wasn't ready for, marry a guy have his baby and want to 'see me' when visiting town, and this was a religious girl in that traditional sense. In both cases I turned them down , and these are just two. Our biology is the hardware, our culture and society is the software that over rides our biology.  We are animal by nature, human being by nurture. The modern day is just presenting our biology to us, and our moral tendencies and societal programming isn't too happy with the facts. The modern environment just makes it too easy to live out our animal instinct.

I question whether I should sleep around (not hook up) but date different women knowing Im not interested in anything long term ( I don't lead them on in any way ) knowing that it can cause emotional distress to them and their future relationship/ability to be happy. I understand a lot of guys have the opposite problem and Leo advises them to go out and get dates also. Im open to learning  

[Leo Gura]

Locking this because OP is not open to changing his position on this matter.