Joe Rogan has COVID

[AminB501]

@diamondpenguin @Leo Gura  Joe Rogan it's just the typical lover of stage red. He loves MMA, loves muscle cars, love beer, loves tattoos, loves being aggressive and vulgar. All his sometimes smart sounding words do not at all override where his love is. I think there can be no Spiral Development when one idolatrizes parts of any stage.

 

Edited September 3, 2021 by AminB501

[Sri McDonald Trump Maharaj]

Hes rant about vaccine passports was pretty good.

[Epikur]

1 hour ago, Purple Man said:

I know that educated discrepancy can be easily mistaken in such a hot topic. But I am going to say a few things about this. Only facts, because I don´t care about opinions. If somebody wants to reply, I´ll gladly read his/her comments, but if he/she only has words they heared in the TV to share, such as "negationist", just breath and don´t say it. I´ve dedicated thousands of hours since March 2020 to study the data, science, and every bit of interesting information, apart from  being in touch with highly respected specialists. I mean, REAL specialists. 

1/ I am astonished at people saying he´s an idiot because he did not take the vaccine so he got the Covid as a well deserved effect... Vaccines don´t prevent infection, don´t avoid transmission to the unvaccinated or to other vaccinated individuals. Actually, as the percentage of vaccinated population grows, the obvious effect is that most (by far) of the new infected are already vaccinated. In some places in my country, where 70% are vaccinated, basically almost every infection happened in a vaccinated individual. Vaccines offer immunity, not total protection (no, they are not synonimous). That means that it creates a defensive team to help the immune system in the duty of recognizing and attacking antigens, so the infection in frail people might be softer. That´s its strenght.

2/ The infection Fatality Rate, even in the worst moments of the 1ST, 2ND waves, was as low as 0,03% in ages 0-70, which the media "confused" with Case Fatality Rate or even raw mortality for the sake of taking advantage of general panic. Up until 45/50, the IFR was similar-lower than that of the flu. So calm down, guys. For a healthy immune system, the infection of Sars-CoV-2 is probably never going to even become COVID (again, no, infection from "Sars..." and "Covid" are not synonimous), and when it does, it  most likely  feel like a flu or even milder.  Sick, frail old people are the aim of Covid in a extremely high percentage. For most, there is nothing to worry about. These are facts, not opinions. 

3/ No, Covid has not killed millions. The first thing to check is the way countries tag deaths as "death BY Covid". It has been a total fraud. That does not mean Covid does not exist. It means that it has been grossly exaggerated, because the media know that 99% of people are too lazy to just ask how you enter the "Covid list". For you to have a fair idea:

in the UK, if you ever have a positive PCR (we could talk A LOT about PCR´s, but it´s not the right moment), you join a "Covid positive list". If you die by whatever cause (yes, even suicide or getting strangled by a thug) your name gets cross-checked. If you appear in the "Covid positive list", you enter the official "death BY Covid" list. As two scientists discovered it and were shocked by the manipulation, they complied. The aftermath was that the health authorities kept the same method, but restricting it to 28 days after the positive PCR. Which means if you die by whatever cause (cancer, stroke, getting run over by a bus) within 28 days after the +PCR, you enter the "death BY Covid list". What´s the name for this, if not scam? Especially when we know that  a group of scientists complained that if they kept this same accounting system after general vaccination, people would stop believing in their efficacy, because the "body count" number wouldn´t go down after vaccination, as any death with a +PCR would still be considered as "Covid death". 

You might say "well, this is just in the UK". No. You guys are mostly from the USA. Well, I don´t know how you did not check the stats of your own country, because I did it, for the sake of knowledge. The CDC stats clearly show that only 6% of the "Covid deaths" are purely so. It is explicitely written in the official site. Also, you can see that the reportedly official "Covid deaths" figures is actually the sum of flu+pneumonia+Covid, while the "Covid only" is that 6 %. These are facts.

In Germany or Spain it is even worse. I live in Spain, and it was just pure madness. Every-fucking-body who died in 2020 in a hospital was tagged as Covid when there was a +PCR (which is crazy enough by itself...), but when we didn´t even have enough PCR´s (first half of the year), anybody who died with  respiratory difficulties was a "Covid death" (who dies without breathing difficulties?) I have three close personal cases that are perfect examples of it.
In Germany it is stated that 80% of the reported figures are actually people who died many weeks after the +PCR. 
Italy? One of the main scientific advisors of the government recognized that if he had to do it again, only 12% would have been tagged as "Covid deaths"
This has been going on around the world, and it might come down as one of the biggest manipulations of all time. Those scientists and experts I talked with are both scared and astonished that they could have pulled this off. Again, this does not mean negation of a disease that can kill frail people. It is a total negation of the official narrative, which is an insult to our intelligences. And I say this after reading dozens of papers and absorbed thousands of pages of good information. Not "official", not "alternative", but good, serious information.

4/ Regarding vaccines: Yesterday I talked with one of the foremost experts in Spain. He is TOTALLY for them. Totally. And I don´t have anything but mad respect for his knowledge and intelligence. If he says they are working, they are. But even here the manipulation is unbearable. Why?

Well, the UK health authorities and the Spanish ones have already stated that all those reported deaths (thousands) as a side effect of vaccines are not the direct effect of vaccination, but of the frail immune system of the deceassd, which are old and have comorbidities. So, if you die at age 88, with a positive PCR plus cancer and poor general health, you died BY Covid. If you die at age 88, with full vaccination, cancer and poor general health, you die because you are old and frail. If they used this second method with the "Covid death" tagging, we would have never ever heared about such thing as a disease called "Covid". The fact that this does not enrage intelligent people is beyond me. 

5/My stance on vaccines? Yes, they seem to have worked fairly well with the old and frail.That´s great news. Great.  The long-term consequences? We´ll have to wait. It is true, and I know this for a fact, that the concentration of spike protein in marrow, liver, ovaries, etc., hours after the vaccines who rely on messenger ARN (Pfizer, Moderna) is extremely high and worrying. Again, that is a fact. So as my health is excellent, I have nothing to worry about Covid, and no, I won´t get vaccinated. That does not mean I am anti-vaxx. I have more than my fair amount of them, and I even shot more than the usual ones. But there is no objective need to do it except you have previous risk factors that could turn Covid into a serious disease, even deadly. And vaccinating kids is close to Humanity crimes. And yes, "my" experts all agree.

Oh, and in spite of blindly attacking anyone who has a good reason to not get the jab, I suggest you to read the scientific report the english government requested to a infectious disease experts organization: there it clearly states that (I´m speaking from memory), 95% of the Covid-related deceased will be fully vaccinated individuals who could not stand the vaccine. You won´t see this in the news, will you? 

6/So, guys, things are not black and white. Study the case as seriously as you meditate. 

 

Good stuff. 

What do you think about the high deaths numbers in India and Brazil?

[Purple Man]

13 minutes ago, Epikur said:

Good stuff. 

What do you think about the high deaths numbers in India and Brazil?

I was not very much aware of Brazil case, but in India they have had some of the best results all around the world for a long period. I was quite shocked when in Spain all you could hear months ago was that India was a mess, when in reality in the worst moments they had like 3000/4000 reported daily deaths, which is actually a good number when you consider their population. But the media does not give a damn about context. 

[Opo]

@Purple Man You are using faks to justify your feelings. 

[Purple Man]

21 minutes ago, Opo said:

@Purple Man You are using faks to justify your feelings. 

@OpoSorry, man, I am not a teen. I don´t waste time with "witty quotes" heard elsewhere. Just leave it here.

[Opo]

2 hours ago, Purple Man said:

@OpoSorry, man, I am not a teen. I don´t waste time with "witty quotes" heard elsewhere. Just leave it here.

Why are you here if you're so dense? 

Read the guidelines. 

[ZzzleepingBear]

@Purple Man  There are endless of nuances you can get into, if you want to study pros and cons with how the pandemic has been handled all around the world. So with that said, are you suggesting that it would have been a better idea if covid was treated as a common flu without any vaccines or what?

[diamondpenguin]

6 hours ago, AminB501 said:

@diamondpenguin @Leo Gura  Joe Rogan it's just the typical lover of stage red. He loves MMA, loves muscle cars, love beer, loves tattoos, loves being aggressive and vulgar. All his sometimes smart sounding words do not at all override where his love is. I think there can be no Spiral Development when one idolatrizes parts of any stage.

 

@AminB501 Well, whatever stage is your favorite is prolly gonna be where you end up. My favorite stage is yellow, just because I love learning, and plotting stuff to synergize together. Stage yellow is fucking beautiful. Rogan gets lost down there sometimes for sure. What is your favorite spiral stage and what do you love about it?

[Purple Man]

1 hour ago, ZzzleepingBear said:

@Purple Man  There are endless of nuances you can get into, if you want to study pros and cons with how the pandemic has been handled all around the world. So with that said, are you suggesting that it would have been a better idea if covid was treated as a common flu without any vaccines or what?

Endless nuances that 99,99 of people totally ignore. Most people bought the false dichotomy fallacy of negationism vs. real science, because it is easy and takes the toll of hard work off their backs. As you ask, I´ll give you my take on both the vaccines and how to treat the crises.

1/For those who don´t know, messenger RNA vaccines work this way: you are injected lipidic nanoparticles, with mARN that code spike proteins. That is, in spite of insert attenuated viruses (as was the case with most vaccines in the past), you make the body "manufacture" them and then you expect that it will also create a defensive response. So far, so good. What´s the problem then? The possible problem is double: short/long time effects. and the debate on the necessity or not of mandatory vaccination.

 On possible short/long term effects, they start the same way: the necessary condition for them not to happen is both that the spike protein dies soon (as it is expected and reportedly happening) and it staying at the shoulder muscle where it is injected. If it enters the blood stream, it is chaos. As a spanish excellent scientist said, it´d be like a broken bottle on the floor.  And it is undeniable that in some cases it has happened. We don´t know if this is frequent or not, but we do know (because one of the scientists who did the review of the Pfizer experiments data said it) that it left the shoulder and appeared in high concentrations in marrow, liver, ovaries, etc. That´s fact. Besides, there are gaps that only faith can save: there is no long term experimental data, and also no experiment was performed on kids, frail ancient people and pregnant women. That could end up being a disaster or not. We´ll have to wait decades.

On the necessity of vaccination, the logic structure behind it is just plain bullshit. The vaccine manufacturers´themselves have told a dozen times it does not prevent the vaccinated from getting infected and it does not prevent the vaccinated from infect others. So saying that you need the jab to protect others from the infection is just a lie. As it is the logic behind the "get vaccinated and then avoid contact with people, because you are still in danger too". Imagine that some years ago you had to go to an african country where there is dengue, so you take the dengue vaccine.  What would be the point for the dengue vaccine, if you are going to be scared of unvaccinated natives then? Well, this is EXACTLY what is going on with the Covid vaccine. Which, BTW, reportedly turns you into "an assimptomatic spreader", which is precisely the worst that a non vaccinated, asymptomatic individual can be, haha... You see? Oh, and there is a direct relationship between symptoms and capability of infecting others. Being that the case, why the hell is an asymptomatic person a danger to anybody, vaccinated or not? There is a study with like 70 000 people, with reported asymptomatic infections. And only 0,7% infected the people they live with. I´m talking about people you kiss, hug, fuck, shout in their faces. So what´s the chance of infecting others in a casual situation when you don´t have any symptoms? Basically none. But the media doesn´t tell you this. And most are too lazy to read.


2/ On how the whole crisis should be treated: You just tell the truth from the beginning and allow for proper scientific debate. With real IFR data, you avoid panic, authoritarism, the destruction of individual freedoms and rights that took millenia to get,  of global economics, of the dreams of hundreds of millions of young individuals, and the unprecedented damage, in deaths and in mental health, that one and a half year of antinatural living brought. You let healthy people from 0-65 lead a normal life, and warn the elderly, frail, or both to be cautious, because there is a new virus who feasts on damaged organisms. And meanwhile you work hard to get treatments and vaccines while they live a semi-normal life, with adequate, not crazy self-restriction. 

During the Covid pandemic we have seen for the first time that the exceptional became the rule for politicians, scientists and media. With 24/7 hour overamplifying the exception (deaths, serious sickness) and hiding the truth (95% or the deceassed were sick elderly people. Many of the reported deaths "BY Covid" were actually "WITH a positive PCR", etc.), people´s subconscious has been tatooed with fear, which lead to unprecedented, crazy, unscientific measures (lockdowns, curfews, and the worst of all, masking) that people accepted. Until when? Well, they have used the oldest trick of authoritarianism: First, you create a fear. Second, you take hard measures, that are "temporary". Third, you let people get used to those reportedly temporary measures. Fourth, when people gets fed up, you give them an event that will mark the time to come back to normal. Fifth, you make sure the event is impossible. And there you got it. The impossible event is  "Zero Covd", something that anyone with half a brain knew from the first day it would never happen. As in Australia, where the authorities have already stated that even with 100% vaccination, even with zero cases, the measures won´t stop... 

And of course, that logic scaffolding  that sustained the overreaction is reusable, and they will next winter:  Science will suddendly turn its head towards the flu, and politicians and the media will follow. How do I know this? Because as now it is not necessary to have a number of deaths to get the "pandemic" calification, "cases" will be enough to keep us under exceptional measures. Do you think they won´t use the flu as the new scapegoat? I knew this since March 2020. And just a few days ago, an importan Spanish politician has said that masks should stay forever to avoid...deaths by flu. And Science magazine has started talking about aerosol transmission of the flu. And the CDC´s new PCR´s don´t distinguish between flu and Covid. Etc. 

I´m sorry for the long posts. It would take a 3 long hour video to cover just a tiny part of it. All I am asking is for people to read real science, real statistics, and avoid childish tagging and dichotomies. It takes a great deal of effort, but it is worth it. 

Edited September 3, 2021 by Purple Man

[AminB501]

@diamondpenguin Honestly, I just try to be as humble as I can and look forward. I'm aware that you can become very decieved through what comes as "love", just look how some gurus have nationalists tendencies and believe themselves superior to other traditions. They're teachings are beautiful yes, but you never know. 

For example this week I just was hooked on realizing how much the teachings of the buddha have made me create unnecessary suffering. I was helping a little insect to recover from an injury (very random, I know) and I realize how some of the struggles in life are later look with happiness and joy. Some of the more unhappy moments in my life, I wish I could had I have toke them fully with presence. I change my opinion on the buddha's teachings from now on, negative emotions and experiences are to be enjoyed and lived through as well. The only thing that is suffering is if you lose a leg, or and arm or get in some serious accident, the rest is not suffering, to call it suffering is being very negative and very resistant. 

That's one thing I learned, and I loved buddhism, but it made me very unhappy in the last year in a half, so I don't love it anymore just appreciate it. But blind love could have never showed me these problems within the buddhist dogma. That's what I mean.

Edited September 3, 2021 by AminB501

[ZzzleepingBear]

1 hour ago, Purple Man said:

Endless nuances that 99,99 of people totally ignore. Most people bought the false dichotomy fallacy of negationism vs. real science, because it is easy and takes the toll of hard work off their backs. As you ask, I´ll give you my take on both the vaccines and how to treat the crises.

1/For those who don´t know, messenger RNA vaccines work this way: you are injected lipidic nanoparticles, with mARN that code spike proteins. That is, in spite of insert attenuated viruses (as was the case with most vaccines in the past), you make the body "manufacture" them and then you expect that it will also create a defensive response. So far, so good. What´s the problem then? The possible problem is double: short/long time effects. and the debate on the necessity or not of mandatory vaccination.

 On possible short/long term effects, they start the same way: the necessary condition for them not to happen is both that the spike protein dies soon (as it is expected and reportedly happening) and it staying at the shoulder muscle where it is injected. If it enters the blood stream, it is chaos. As a spanish excellent scientist said, it´d be like a broken bottle on the floor.  And it is undeniable that in some cases it has happened. We don´t know if this is frequent or not, but we do know (because one of the scientists who did the review of the Pfizer experiments data said it) that it left the shoulder and appeared in high concentrations in marrow, liver, ovaries, etc. That´s fact. Besides, there are gaps that only faith can save: there is no long term experimental data, and also no experiment was performed on kids, frail ancient people and pregnant women. That could end up being a disaster or not. We´ll have to wait decades.

On the necessity of vaccination, the logic structure behind it is just plain bullshit. The vaccine manufacturers´themselves have told a dozen times it does not prevent the vaccinated from getting infected and it does not prevent the vaccinated from infect others. So saying that you need the jab to protect others from the infection is just a lie. As it is the logic behind the "get vaccinated and then avoid contact with people, because you are still in danger too". Imagine that some years ago you had to go to an african country where there is dengue, so you take the dengue vaccine.  What would be the point for the dengue vaccine, if you are going to be scared of unvaccinated natives then? Well, this is EXACTLY what is going on with the Covid vaccine. Which, BTW, reportedly turns you into "an assimptomatic spreader", which is precisely the worst that a non vaccinated, asymptomatic individual can be, haha... You see? Oh, and there is a direct relationship between symptoms and capability of infecting others. Being that the case, why the hell is an asymptomatic person a danger to anybody, vaccinated or not? There is a study with like 70 000 people, with reported asymptomatic infections. And only 0,7% infected the people they live with. I´m talking about people you kiss, hug, fuck, shout in their faces. So what´s the chance of infecting others in a casual situation when you don´t have any symptoms? Basically none. But the media doesn´t tell you this. And most are too lazy to read.


2/ On how the whole crisis should be treated: You just tell the truth from the beginning and allow for proper scientific debate. With real IFR data, you avoid panic, authoritarism, the destruction of individual freedoms and rights that took millenia to get,  of global economics, of the dreams of hundreds of millions of young individuals, and the unprecedented damage, in deaths and in mental health, that one and a half year of antinatural living brought. You let healthy people from 0-65 lead a normal life, and warn the elderly, frail, or both to be cautious, because there is a new virus who feasts on damaged organisms. And meanwhile you work hard to get treatments and vaccines while they live a semi-normal life, with adequate, not crazy self-restriction. 

During the Covid pandemic we have seen for the first time that the exceptional became the rule for politicians, scientists and media. With 24/7 hour overamplifying the exception (deaths, serious sickness) and hiding the truth (95% or the deceassed were sick elderly people. Many of the reported deaths "BY Covid" were actually "WITH a positive PCR", etc.), people´s subconscious has been tatooed with fear, which lead to unprecedented, crazy, unscientific measures (lockdowns, curfews, and the worst of all, masking) that people accepted. Until when? Well, they have used the oldest trick of authoritarianism: First, you create a fear. Second, you take hard measures, that are "temporary". Third, you let people get used to those reportedly temporary measures. Fourth, when people gets fed up, you give them an event that will mark the time to come back to normal. Fifth, you make sure the event is impossible. And there you got it. The impossible event is  "Zero Covd", something that anyone with half a brain knew from the first day it would never happen. As in Australia, where the authorities have already stated that even with 100% vaccination, even with zero cases, the measures won´t stop... 

And of course, that logic scaffolding  that sustained the overreaction is reusable, and they will next winter:  Science will suddendly turn its head towards the flu, and politicians and the media will follow. How do I know this? Because as now it is not necessary to have a number of deaths to get the "pandemic" calification, "cases" will be enough to keep us under exceptional measures. Do you think they won´t use the flu as the new scapegoat? I knew this since March 2020. And just a few days ago, an importan Spanish politician has said that masks should stay forever to avoid...deaths by flu. And Science magazine has started talking about aerosol transmission of the flu. And the CDC´s new PCR´s don´t distinguish between flu and Covid. Etc. 

I´m sorry for the long posts. It would take a 3 long hour video to cover just a tiny part of it. All I am asking is for people to read real science, real statistics, and avoid childish tagging and dichotomies. It takes a great deal of effort, but it is worth it. 

I can't respond to all your points in here, but what I noticed is that you bring up alot of "what if" scenarios, and while those points certainly can be worth looking deeper into, it's stil basically alot of scepticism that lack action by getting stuck on what if's in a crisis that require some kind of action. Hence why I asked you if any precautions should be made by taking a vaccine or not? I didn't see any clear response on this from you.

I mean, the fear people have for the virus itself, that level of fear doesn't seem any worse than in those who are anti vaccine to be fair. So to blame anyone to be fearful seem quite meaningless as it appear to be a mutual fear on both sides of the extreams.

Nothing is black or white as an absolute. But a incoming crisis calls for action within a narrow timeframe. So if you where against vaccine as the virus broke out, then you would take the passive approach in good faith that the virus would create less damage to peoples health in general, right?

It also implicitly means that you think that the vaccine causes more damage to peoples health than the virus itself would right now. So why not add those thoughts in there with the rest of your critisism?

You bring out valid considerable points, but when forget your own clear cut stance on what would be the right action to take, then your scepticism becomes less relevant.

2 hours ago, Purple Man said:

You let healthy people from 0-65 lead a normal life, and warn the elderly, frail, or both to be cautious, because there is a new virus who feasts on damaged organisms. And meanwhile you work hard to get treatments and vaccines while they live a semi-normal life, with adequate, not crazy self-restriction.

This is a very vague approach tbh. Do you really think that this approach would has been less damaging to peoples health? And would result in less deaths in a rapidly growing crisis?

[Johnny Galt]

@ZzzleepingBear Have you looked into the response by Sweden and Taiwan? I just spoke with a friend who was living there (Taiwan) since this started and he said it was like there wasn't even a pandemic, due to the actions that their government took from day one, which is aligned with what the Purple Man is saying. 

[Philipp]

@Purple Man vaccine does reduce infencting others. its just like 60% reduced. But with a third shot this could go up. You even said it yourself, transmissability corelates with symptoms. Well guess what, vaccines reduces the symptoms of covid if you do get it. 

Second, if you don't trust mRNA vaccins, you can take one of the others. + since when are vaccines evil and dangerous? you probably got vaccinated a dozen times already. Vaccines that got allowed with the same amount of clinical trials. 

Third, if you worried about long term effects of vaccins, why aren't you worried about long term effects of covid, which are also unknown and evidence is coming out that it can even lead to alzheimer.

Fourth, i don't think there is anything wrong with trying to reduce deaths caused by the flu, with asking people to wear a mask on public transport. 

Fith, if you don't like lockdowns, you should like vaccines, because they are our best chance to reduce covid deaths without a lockdown.

[diamondpenguin]

@AminB501 Whatever floats your boat, whatever makes your heart beat. 

[ZzzleepingBear]

1 minute ago, Johnny Galt said:

@ZzzleepingBear Have you looked into the response by Sweden and Taiwan? I just spoke with a friend who was living there (Taiwan) since this started and he said it was like there wasn't even a pandemic, due to the actions that their government took from day one, which is aligned with what the Purple Man is saying. 

So no deaths or sickness there from covid? No vaccine needed? That's great!

Look into brazil, the president there don't belive in covid it seems, and they are not doing so good so far from what I read.

[Johnny Galt]

@ZzzleepingBear 

6 minutes ago, ZzzleepingBear said:

So no deaths or sickness there from covid? No vaccine needed? That's great!

What makes you think I was claiming there were no sickness or death? or that they didn't vaccinate? 

What does Brazil have to do with anything I said? 

 

 

[ZzzleepingBear]

24 minutes ago, Johnny Galt said:

@ZzzleepingBear 

What makes you think I was claiming there were no sickness or death? or that they didn't vaccinate? 

What does Brazil have to do with anything I said? 

 

 

Wait.. So they got a pandemic going on there?

No brazil is probably fine, forget what I said

[Purple Man]

19 minutes ago, ZzzleepingBear said:

So no deaths or sickness there from covid? No vaccine needed? That's great!

Look into brazil, the president there don't belive in covid it seems, and they are not doing so good so far from what I read.

One of the main fallacies that this pandemics brought is precisely the fake direct relationship between measures and good results, which science has totally debunked. 

I am going to give you three graphs, comparing Sweden with Israel, UK and Spain. Israel, hard approach. UK, tremendously hard approach. And, as you know, I live in Spain, where we spent three months locked down in our homes, where even today there are places where you can´t be at night on the streets, and where e-ve-ry-fu-cking-bo-dy (except me and I suppose a handful of others) wears a mask all the time, many even alone in the cars. The results?  Catastrophic. Some of the worst in the world. And we have one of the best public health systems worldwide...

Meanwhile, in Sweden, no mandatory masks indoors or outdors (only a 14 % used them, if my memory does not fail), no lockdowns, and excellent results, with overall mortality similar to year 2017, once adjusted by population. What has the rest of Europe done with the information? Just avoid mentioning Sweden. Here in Spain, it literally is like they that country doesn´t exist. 

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E8yCNUoWQAYbChx?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E511DbnXoAUK1M2?format=jpg&name=4096x4096
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E511DbnXoAUK1M2?format=jpg&name=4096x4096
If we go into detail, which I won´t because I have talked a lot, you can be sure that lockdowns, curfews and especially masks don´t work at all. But I will cite Czech Republic, which is a particularly interesting case: The 1ST wave was almost inexistent to them. They bragged about discipline, masks, etc. The 2ND wave came, they followed the same rules, and they were the country with most infections in the whole world.

[Johnny Galt]

@ZzzleepingBear Are you Kathy Newman?