Gender roles

[KennedyCarter]

@Vzdoh Yeah definitely. I would go out with men who wanted to be “equal” and it didn’t feel romantic. Maybe for some couples but for me I found myself most attracted to guys who were more masculine, in that they had the instinct to take care of me. I think it’s a great way for a guy to feel like a “Man” without competing with other males. He can show his masculinity through being the provider and protector for his woman. 
@Dryas

Edited August 19, 2021 by KennedyCarter

[KennedyCarter]

@tsuki  Yes thank you. It’s about creating our own reality. People all have a choice. Gender roles are neither good or bad. We shouldn’t force either way on people but let others know they have a choice. @Dryas

[Karmadhi]

Do you guys think Eastern Women (europe especially) tend to be more feminine and overall better material than western women? 

I saw a video that argued so.

[Windappreciator]

8 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Do you guys think Eastern Women (europe especially) tend to be more feminine and overall better material than western women? 

I saw a video that argued so.

No they tend to be more submissive due to trauma and toxicity.

[Karmadhi]

@Windappreciator Then why their marriages tend to last longer without issues? I come from a country like that myself and the traditional family seemed to work very well. Wife was submissive and feminine and guy was strong and masculine. In western europe the roles are all over the place and they top divorce rate charts.

What are your thoughts?

[Windappreciator]

12 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

@Windappreciator Then why their marriages tend to last longer without issues? I come from a country like that myself and the traditional family seemed to work very well. Wife was submissive and feminine and guy was strong and masculine. In western europe the roles are all over the place and they top divorce rate charts.

What are your thoughts?

I can see your point and appreciate your thoughts on this there is some truth to what you say but,

What does being more feminine have to do with lasting marriages?

Because they are submissive.

Because they suppress alot about themselves. 

Because their social environment doesn't allow for something else.

Because there the chances of falling into toxic or abusive relationship is higher, so rather stay with what you know.

Because they judge themselves with that moral code.

Marriages last long this way unless everyone of these women has found their soul mate, which is unlikely.

Edited August 19, 2021 by Windappreciator

[SgtPepper]

It's not completely made up.

You have to also consider hormones and life experience. Men and Women have genuine exclusive features and experiences such as periods, boners, child birthing, physical prowess. 

I mean just look at this forum, there is a clear distinction in how the men and women act. 

[Karmadhi]

@Windappreciator Submissive is feminine behavior, it is their natural state.  When you are closer to nature you will be naturally happier. Which is why women tend to be resentful and bitchy when the guy does not act masculine and makes her the man of the relationship. 

Being submissive is what they ultimately want. Submissive does not mean a pushover. Nuance.

You can have a personality and boundaries and still be feminine sweet and submissive.

Just like a guy can be kind yet decisive and strong.

I am saying this because in my country marriages seem a lot healthier and almost no divorces. Not a lot of abuse either, both parties know their roles and act on it. Abuse happens in the west too, it is not exclusive to eastern societies. 

Edited August 19, 2021 by Karmadhi

[Windappreciator]

@Karmadhi 

It's more curcuimstancially invoked and less from the inwards with Eastern European women.

And overall I asked about femininity and lasting marriages.

Edited August 20, 2021 by Windappreciator

[Karmadhi]

@Windappreciator Elaborate please. I would be curious to hear another perspective. Like in detail   

[KennedyCarter]

@Karmadhi I think what he means is that the women in these countries are most likely doing it because they think they have to and not because they have looked inward and made that choice for themselves. 

[Emerald]

38 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

@Windappreciator Submissive is feminine behavior, it is their natural state.  When you are closer to nature you will be naturally happier. Which is why women tend to be resentful and bitchy when the guy does not act masculine and makes her the man of the relationship. 

Being submissive is what they ultimately want. Submissive does not mean a pushover. Nuance.

You can have a personality and boundaries and still be feminine sweet and submissive.

Just like a guy can be kind yet decisive and strong.

I am saying this because in my country marriages seem a lot healthier and almost no divorces. Not a lot of abuse either, both parties know their roles and act on it. Abuse happens in the west too, it is not exclusive to eastern societies. 

Submission is more of a Shadow Feminine trait than a Divine Feminine trait. 

Surrender and receptivity are the Divine Feminine qualities. 

Submission is a denigrated version of these two qualities, which has to do more with self-nullification and learned helplessness. It is a giving up of the feminine power. 

But the feminine power is much more akin to receiving and surrendering. 

[Karmadhi]

@Emerald Why the divorce rate so much higher in the west then? I would like some explanations. Not just divorce rate but overall less happy sexless marriages. The film American  Beauty is a prime example. Weak ass submissive guy and bossy super bitchy annoying woman. Fuck that shit.

[Windappreciator]

@Karmadhi What does it have to do with that? Why are you so stuck on the divorce rate?

How is marriage stability an indicator for femininity?

Edited August 19, 2021 by Windappreciator

[Emerald]

12 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

@Emerald Why the divorce rate so much higher in the west then? I would like some explanations. Not just divorce rate but overall less happy sexless marriages. The film American  Beauty is a prime example. Weak ass submissive guy and bossy super bitchy annoying woman. Fuck that shit.

Because women and men are given the choice to divorce without extremely negative social consequences.

Longevity of marriage doesn't say anything about the quality.

When two people feel forced to stay together, you can have an exceptionally long (and exceptionally draining) marriage.

If those same two people are raised in a society where they don't have to submit to strict rules around marriage being a forever-union, most people will grow apart and eventually divorce... though some will stay together.

My view is that a high divorce rate is actually a good indicator of how developed a society is. If a society has an extremely low divorce rate, the society is probably very Stage Blue and authoritarian in its control over the details of people's everyday lives.

But if a society has a divorce rate of 50% or more, it's an indicator of how free the society is. 

[Emerald]

16 minutes ago, Windappreciator said:

@Karmadhi What does it have to do with that? Why are you so stuck on the divorce rate?

How is marriage stability an indicator for femininity?

He's making a correlation between a woman giving up her sovereignty and her ability to keep the relationship together.

And it's true, if you have a relationship where one person gives away all their power and boundaries and never complains and just goes along with whatever the other person wants, you can have a very long relationship... because it isn't really a relationship.

If the understanding is that one partner sets the tone and the other partner obeys the tone, you can keep things together in a very shallow way because it guarantees no conflict as long as the woman can continue to submit. 

But it's not a real relationship because it isn't really about intimacy. It's a social contract... a very solid social contract especially if the society is very punitive towards the partner that's expected to submit.

 

 

Edited August 19, 2021 by Emerald

[Windappreciator]

@Emerald Thank you. As much as I enjoy your insightful response, those are not questions I actually ask myself ?

[Emerald]

3 minutes ago, Windappreciator said:

@Emerald Thank you. As much as I enjoy your insightful response, those are not questions I actually ask myself ?

I know that you're just responding to what the other guy was saying. 

[Windappreciator]

@Emerald

Oh, my bad.

[Karmadhi]

@Emerald No i do not mean that. I mean that a submissive female is her natural role, a marriage works when both parties are at their best self. Strong man and submissive woman, it is basic biology. From a higher TRUTH perspective then this is all BS but in the relative survival driven world where marriages operate then such behaviour ensures longevity.  Basically females want to be feminine and submissive, if they start acting all alpha it will make them miserable and resentful even if they are not aware of it. Sounds sexist but this is how things see to be.

And marriages in these more traditional societies not only last longer, they are generally better. Rarely any issues, and both are happy doing their thing. Of course they can split housework and stuff, doesnt have to be a male dictatorship but the gender roles allow it to last longer.

Plenty of cases where in a marriage in the west the man has become the woman and the marriage is miserable. As soon as the man gets some coaching and becomes more masculine and assumes his natural role as the leader , the whole marriage gets better.

Read "The way of the superior man", he explains this in detail.