Clear cut definition of heaven and its characteristics

[5-D - L O V E]

I would love if @Leo Gura or someone which has had some profound kind of awakening or insight on the topic to give us a clear and somewhat "concrete" definition of Heaven. Is it EXACTLY the same manifestation of God as Enlightenment, or is it some degree of enlightenment actualized and integrated into one's psyche to acheive their desired outcome (assuming they are aligned with God/Absolute Reality).

What confuses me is that I have what seem to be many backdrop stories and narratives about what "Heaven" is, going from the "Good life", to "Spiritual realization and fulfilment (without forcibly having it "good" in life), to being absolute God realized (which is some kind of fantasy that I haven't fully integrated) meaning I can do things "magically" i.e in total flow as long as they are in alignment and that I work towards it.

All of those projections fall short when they are put against some core spiritual truths like detachment, patience (things blooming in their right order in time and energy), karma... for example if we take Heaven to mean being God realized (according to the fantasy I have which may or may not be true) then how does it integrate with detachment, like how can I manifest WHAT I (ego/self) WANT when heaven is also total detachment (in another interpretation).

 

The second point which I still have no clear idea about as when this whole process of self nquiry started many years ago is what happens after "physical death", I had many profound awakenings into the nature of Karma, the absolute balance of all energies in the universe, duality, incarnation and re-incarnation, the layers of Reality and Self... And they used to explain a lot of my reality and inner truths, but the more time goes the more I believe that there is NOTHING after death, going into absolute consciousness can totally dissolve ALL current energies, like it creates them continually giving birth to this experience.

But I can't know anything for sure, I might be completely wrong and there can be ANOTHER form of dualistic experience (maybe less or more dense than the actual one) depending on the person's karma and that also is logical to my mind and makes sense to me experientially, 

I'm sure I'm missing something important through this whole inquiry and can't seem to grasp it, has anyone gotten through such patterns of thinking and actually reconciled them ? can it be done ?

[Leo Gura]

Heaven is simply when you become so conscious that you realize there is no difference between any two situations.

There can of course be other definitions or version of heaven, like some literally dream of never-ending pleasure, but I would consider these inferior to the above. You can have a sort of finite heaven vs an infinite heaven. The finite heaven would have form, the infinite would just be the Godhead itself -- pure abstract metaphysical Love.

Death never happens. Death is imaginary.

[Moksha]

The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’ For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you.

- Luke 17:21

Heaven translates as spaciousness. It is not a place, but the pure state of being. Consciousness, unfettered by its dreams, is heaven.

[Goldzilla]

We are living in heaven right now, am i the only one experiencing this? 

[Moksha]

3 minutes ago, Goldzilla said:

We are living in heaven right now, am i the only one experiencing this? 

No individual experiences heaven, at least not in its fulness. Heaven is the dissolving of boundaries, and the end of individuality.

[Goldzilla]

10 minutes ago, Moksha said:

No individual experiences heaven, at least not in its fulness. Heaven is the dissolving of boundaries, and the end of individuality.

What do you know about that? I say is a lie what you say. 

[Moksha]

3 minutes ago, Goldzilla said:

What do you know about that? I say is a lie what you say. 

Individuality is the lie.

[Goldzilla]

 

Just now, Moksha said:

Individuality is the lie.

Stop taking your dogma from the christian paradigm or the east, or Leo. Only through one can "God" be experienced. There is no heaven out there. 

[Moksha]

19 minutes ago, Goldzilla said:

Stop taking your dogma from the christian paradigm or the east, or Leo. Only through one can "God" be experienced. There is no heaven out there. 

Agree 100%. Ultimately, there is no division, and no "out there". Consciousness is all there is.

[5-D - L O V E]

@Leo Gura Let's say you find heaven in the absolute sense and you realize that you maybe weren't not fully ready for it, in other words your ego continues resisting giving itself into just pure being, I feel like that, and honestly I'm still dealing with the same issue for months, it feels like I was pushed through my life to seek past materialism and duality from early on (meaning I missed on most of teenagehood and early adulthood), and somewhat I still can't "forgive" myself that, I can't recontextualize it as being the "higher good" anymore (that feels like me bullshiting myself, although I know it's all far from true). I feel like if I just went on seeking regular experiences and not being so critical and iquisitive... I wouldn't feel the lack that can't seem to be refilled  now, which is what my ego refers to as "lack of innocence", like "yeah I see the necessity of (maybe?) me going out and seeking money, sex, travel and whatever other experieces my ego wants", but it feels it wouldn't be the same knowing all what I know now, like I know much, and I can't be in flow doing that, I can't "believe" in dating, working for money.. and I also know that this in itself is me sabotaging myself and not taking care of myself and loving myself.

But these energies seem to always get the best of me, no matter how conscious I become.

And when I get that feeling that I should transform my past into something way greater than material satisfaction/revenge?, I still feel like I need to go through what I'm missing on life, it's a loop within a loop and I can't seem to get out with what I know.

I feel like I need to know something which is so simple and plain that I'm completely missing, and I guess it has to do with me realizing God consciousness and being ON MY PATH but I feel like I haven't advanced a bit (which is also not true... I see the way I made) but I haven't advanced that much when it comes to (ego) confidence, manifestation, being unapologetic and just not giving a fuck about people (basically, I feel like I can't fully integrate masculine power and that it's the main source of all my current earthly problems). 

[Breakingthewall]

38 minutes ago, Moksha said:

No individual experiences heaven, at least not in its fulness. Heaven is the dissolving of boundaries, and the end of individuality.

True. Heaven and individual are mutually exclusive. for one to appear, the other has to disappear

[5-D - L O V E]

52 minutes ago, Goldzilla said:

We are living in heaven right now, am i the only one experiencing this? 

I have that experience but it feels very limited, partial and out of my control.

I'm not in the hell I was once in, but I'm still fully not ON IT (forget heaven, for me it's about feeling powerful as a man which is something that has plagued me for most of my life).

For most of my peers it's a given, given their upringing and context, but for me I can't seem to manifest it for the life of me, and I know I'm being conditional and I may even sound childish taking a thread about Heaven and making it about me feeling like my ego belongs here, but that's it for me, I can't deny my experience anymore.

[Insane butterfly]

Walk through Hell and you'll find Heaven .

Only if you know what Hell is you'll start realizing Heaven!

Edited August 14, 2021 by Insane butterfly

[Goldzilla]

There is no experience outside individuality. This thing i am everyone does not fit in the real world, only into the imagination of tripping people. 

Being the reason the majority of people don't awaken. They still rely on others, or see oneself as others. Reality does not work that way, only concepts and duality and dogma. 

[Gili Trawangan]

This is heaven.

It's not somewhere else, it's not some other infinite state, because this IS the infinite. This, the absolute, is that which allows all possible states and experiences and it is heaven.

The only difference between heaven and hell is that hell has an added experience of a mind resisting and fearing. So one could say that heaven requires a recognition of this as it is in order for heaven to be actualized. But even that would be going too far, because ignorance is ultimately an illusion.

So yeah, this is heaven  cool, huh?

[The0Self]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Heaven is simply when you become so conscious that you realize there is no difference between any two situations.

^^ Precisely — no difference between any two circumstances / situations / arisings. However, this is actually already fully realized, but not by anyone who is experiencing themselves as separate from what happens (everything). When the separation is seen to have no substance at all, and never did have substance, then Heaven becomes obvious. Then, it’s recognized there was only ever Heaven.

[Nahm]

17 hours ago, Goldzilla said:

We are living in heaven right now, am i the only one experiencing this? 

Yes & no. 

[Mason Riggle]

Perhaps the notions of Heaven and Hell are metaphorical.  

Heaven is just a word for a hypothetical 'ultimate state of 'being' which the Universe desires and Hell is 'that ultimate state it desires to avoid'.. two hypothetical ends of an infinite relative spectrum. 

Thus, when understood as this between two people, they can communicate moral prescriptions(shoulds and shouldn'ts), based on past experiences .. 

"If you don't want what history has revealed you don't want, you shouldn't do 'x, y and z'."

To avoid 'hell' (if you don't want a shitty experience you don't want) then don't cheat on your wife and shoot the neighbor kids.. That's not good (God) yo. 

Edited August 15, 2021 by Mason Riggle
Sentence structure and grammar

[The0Self]

21 hours ago, Goldzilla said:

There is no experience outside individuality. This thing i am everyone does not fit in the real world, only into the imagination of tripping people. 

Being the reason the majority of people don't awaken. They still rely on others, or see oneself as others. Reality does not work that way, only concepts and duality and dogma. 

Individuality, sure. But there is no individual that is in any way separate from everything. The story can appear as different from apparently different perspectives, but there is no absolute perspective.

Edited August 15, 2021 by The0Self