Increase in vaccine coercion

[BadHippie]

Quote

I could probably use that book as a citation for my lethal virus claims and show that you haven't actually read it. The rest are not books on virology.

Did you ever consider that not everything written down is true? Just because the book says it´s based on science, doesn´t mean it´s true. Leo did a lot of videos on that. Science is full of shit. But you have to be good at finding the bullshit. You can´t give away your own ability to make sense of the world to a book (authority)...

Quote

1. It's a calculation not a simulation. Every utility calculation is limited. 2. "Show me studies" is not an argument.

Exactly my point. All the calculations done in the beginning of 2020 were wrong and false... and there were already many experts telling us exactly that, but they were censored. And now that almost all "conspiracy-theories" regarding COVID and Vaccines came true. People use other ways to diffame other perspectives. Just like you do right now, by not even considering my point and simply saying I´m full of shit.

 

 

 

 

[ArcticGong]

2 hours ago, impulse9 said:@Carl-Richard And I'm here to tell you that a vaccine mandate goes against basic human rights.

[Nobody_Here]

@impulse9 Bad analogy. An adverse reaction to a psychiatric med typically has reversible effects -- in other words, don't retake the medication, and you'll be fine. Vaccines are used to train the immune system to fight against diseases when your immune system has little or no natural defense. Don't get a vaccine if you have a medical condition that prohibits it or if you have specific allergies, but generally, getting the vaccine outweighs the downsides for most healthy people. This applies to any vaccine, not just covid. 

Many professions require vaccines for all kinds of legitimate reasons. The US government will probably not do a vaccine mandate for all because of political reasons, but employers can legally require it for their employees. I imagine soon it won't be easy to do much without a vaccination. The practical thing is to take care of it now while it's easy to get a free vaccine. 

Edited August 6, 2021 by Nobody_Here
Clarity

[impulse9]

You say this but I personally know a person who had terrible complications after getting the vaccine, and he came into it healthy. Now yes, he's the only one I know that had complications and it's obviously anecdotal. My thought process is, if I'm ever to get it, I'd rather wait a few years and get vaccine version 5.0 instead of getting the 1.0.

[Nobody_Here]

3 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Do you mean even after vaccination the person can die? 

Less than a fraction of a percent of vaccinated Americans to date have died of covid after being fully vaccinated -- and the majority of those who died after being vaccinated had been older with underlying health conditions. The vast majority of Americans hospitalized with covid these days have not been vaccinated at all.

[Nobody_Here]

@impulse9 Well, I'm sorry about your friend’s rare adverse reaction, but all vaccines have adverse reactions even at version 10.0 for a small number of people. If you're waiting for the perfect vaccine for no bad reactions for anyone, you're going to be waiting for the rest of your life. 

[impulse9]

@Nobody_Here The very first thing my Statistics professor told us in the first lecture was "there's 3 types of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics". When you talk about vast majorities, that doesn't really help the tiny minorities that do end up suffering from it. Greater good doesn't' really justify individual suffering. But I get what you're saying and I mostly agree with it. But you have to be careful when talking broadly like that.

[Nobody_Here]

@impulse9 But what you're doing is throwing out the baby with the bathwater--and in this situation, you're the baby. 

[Talinn]

13 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

You say this but I personally know a person who had terrible complications after getting the vaccine, and he came into it healthy. Now yes, he's the only one I know that had complications and it's obviously anecdotal. My thought process is, if I'm ever to get it, I'd rather wait a few years and get vaccine version 5.0 instead of getting the 1.0.

The mental collective infrastructure for taking Vaccine version 5.0 literally does not exist unless the mental collective infrastructure ofr taking Vaccine version 1.0 takes root. Version 5.0 might exist, but it'll exist because other people carried your ass and because you placed value on them as guinea pigs in your subconscious psyche in this context. This is a further distortion of what actually happened because in the real world there were trials, which everyone has collectively chosen to forget.

It's similar to how you wanna wait for a yacht when your homies are busting their asses on a canoe. The yacht won't get created unless people people hop on the canoe.

[impulse9]

I didn't invent the vaccine, nor have had anything to do with its development. I'm not in a risk group and I'm hardly risking anyone else's life so don't put the blame on me. Maybe blame the guy who ate that bat soup.

[knakoo]

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/22598415/covid-vaccinate-world-virus-variant-delta-lambda

Here are 2 opposite perspectives on this situation. Whatever you guys think or believe, try to see those perspectives with an open mind.

 

Personally I think a key point is : do vaccines increase or decrease the risk of the arrival of more dangerous variants ? The answer is clearly not obvious.

For instance here you have Luc Montagnier, French virologist and nobel prize, who discovered the VIH, saying that vaccines promote the apparition of more dangerous variants. There are also quite a lot of highly regarded virologists expressing similar concerns. On the other hand, many highly regarded virologists say vaccines are our best options to prevent more dangerous variants. 

[knakoo]

One more very conscious and smart guy I respect saying there are some serious shady stuff going on. 

[hoodrow trillson]

The vaccine is an IQ test.

[impulse9]

1 hour ago, knakoo said:

 

Thanks for sharing. I don't fully agree with him on everything he says but this was a interesting and fresh perspective.

12 minutes ago, hoodrow trillson said:

The vaccine is an IQ test.

That statement can be interpreted in 2 very distinct ways.

[Parththakkar12]

15 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Which is why wearing a seat belt and having insurance is mandated by law.

So according your own logic it is perfectly fine to hand out tickets for not being vaccinated and to even get sued if you infect someone else. It is also perfectly okay for police to keep a national database of your vaccination record and restrict you from operating without a license.

This is all your own logic.

Also note, car crashes are not contagious. A virus literally goes viral. So a loose virus is WAY worse than all the car crashes in the world. 38k people died of cars crashes, but 600k died from Covid. 20x difference. And Covid hasn't finished.

Would it be fine to destroy the economy, destroy small businesses, destroy your currency over car accidents? Is that justifiable?

Do you know how many people will die because of this? Many many more than those from COVID, I can tell you that much.

Edited August 6, 2021 by Parththakkar12

[Carl-Richard]

4 hours ago, BadHippie said:

Did you ever consider that not everything written down is true? Just because the book says it´s based on science, doesn´t mean it´s true. Leo did a lot of videos on that. Science is full of shit. But you have to be good at finding the bullshit. You can´t give away your own ability to make sense of the world to a book (authority)...

It's possible to question authority and science and also perform utility calculations that say we should consider collectively sanctioned measures. If your skepticism comes at the cost of practical and cognitive flexibility (or other handicaps), you should maybe consider calling it dogmatism. Dissection should be done carefully and with the right tools, or you might lose an arm. 

The main point about questioning authority is to discover the mechanisms of bias and self-deception within not just other minds, but your own mind; that you're in fact helplessly relying on the words of other people to make sense of the world and that you should be sharply aware of the ramifications of that fact.

That is not an invitation to abolish all forms of externally contigent sensemaking or instinctively place a minus sign in front of whatever the mainstream narrative is pushing. It's rather about not fooling yourself about the nature of that process. In short, strategic pragmatism is your hammer, epistemic self-awareness is your shield. Does that mean you should swallow whatever they feed you? Not at all. In fact, be more ruthless, just don't be a dork.

[Carl-Richard]

3 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

Would it be fine to destroy the economy, destroy small businesses, destroy your currency over car accidents? Is that justifiable?

Reminds me of the Ford Pinto scandal in the 1970s. Ford found out that it would be more profitable to design cars with fuel tanks that increased the chances of irreversible damage in an eventual rear-crash by a fiery explosion. This is because the cost of a brand new car was lower than the cost of spare parts and repairman labour. However, this plan would of course increase the amount of lethal car accidents. 

 

Quote

900 death and burn reports and Ford’s knowledge of the potential problem beforehand being uncovered by a journal, lead to one of the worst scandals in automotive history.

https://www.hotcars.com/biggest-automotive-scandals/

In this case, business was indeed destroyed over car accidents  

[knakoo]

1 hour ago, hoodrow trillson said:

The vaccine is an IQ test.

Do you know that Christopher Langan, the highest IQ ever recorded in the US (195), is anti vaccine ?

This idea that only dumb people are skeptical or cautious about the vaccine is absurd.

To be clear I am personally more skeptical of the different conspiracy theories (some are nuts, other less so), than I am of the mainstream narrative. I can also see that a lot of the people I know who believe in conspiracy theories are lost in ego.

But there are also several highly conscious and smart people I respect who believe there is some serious shady stuff going on. So overall I accept that I don't know what is going on and being cautious.

Edited August 6, 2021 by knakoo

[Carl-Richard]

51 minutes ago, knakoo said:

Do you know that Christopher Langan, the highest IQ ever recorded in the US (195), is anti vaccine ?

He is also pro-Trump lol

[Nobody_Here]

Today, I found out another one of my parents’ friends died of COVID yesterday.

He was anti-vaccine as of last Wednesday, when he posted an anti-vaccine TikTok video with hashtags, “#vaccine #covid19 #bs #politics #fyp #lmao #teamnovaccine #mybodymychoice.” 
Edit: Yes, I double-checked: Anti-vaccine on Wednesday, dead of COVID on Thursday. This is serious stuff, folks.

And now he’s dead. He died on the way to the hospital in an ambulance because he could no longer breathe. 

There’s really nothing left for me to say, because that really says everything I’ve been attempting to communicate to the naysayers. 

I’m out of this thread *mic drop*

 

Edited August 6, 2021 by Nobody_Here