Increase in vaccine coercion

[Preety_India]

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Vaccines have alway been mandatory for school. So your whole logic is silly.

Do you think vaccines should be mandatory for everyone?

How about those who are allergic to vaccines ?

 

[impulse9]

Fewer things I put into my body the better. I feel like the whole world has gone nuts with this. It should be my and my choice alone whether or not I decide to put something in my body, and this whole "vaccine shaming", even from Leo, is disgusting. Take the vaccine if you want to, just don't moralize to me about what I should or shouldn't do.

Here's almost my exact thoughts on this, he sums it up extremely well:

 

[Seed]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Vaccines have alway been mandatory for school. So your whole logic is silly.

Without vaccines you get the Black Death of Europe. Killed 100+ million. 1/3rd of the population.

Don't be a fool. Your body is not just your body. Your body only exists thanks to a collective.

I don't know about America, but vaccines in the UK, have never been mandatory. I am not anti vax or pro vax, but I am pro choice and thinking for yourself, as well as the greater good. And given how corrupt the pharmaceutical companies are and continue to be; my fear is not the Covid vaccine it itself (I can see why that is needed), but that these big pharma companies use this gateway to further expoit the masses, creating more 'mandatory' treatments, as they years / decades go on. Which could potentionally be very harmful for the collective. And the planet. We all know how much damage has already done by pushing unnecessary medicines on otherwise healthy people and I would hate to see things escalate!!! 

That is my fear and I am entitled to have fears and share and discuss them. I repeat - I am not a believing in a conspiracy and also no anti vax. So please no labels. I think it's important to discuss all of this and listen and empathise with everyone's views.

 

 

 

Edited August 2, 2021 by Seed

[impulse9]

@Seed Yeah good luck with that, you're just gonna be labeled a conspiracy theorist and an antivaxxer anyway. I've been labeled both multiple times simply for stating my own personal preference in the matter, which is that I will not be getting the vaccine. I immediately lose a lot of respect for anyone that tries to forcefully coerce me to change this opinion, as if their judgment is somehow better than mine. I have 0 problems with people choosing to take the vaccine, but I have an enormous problem with people trying to shame others into a sense of guilt because they decide that they won't take it.
 

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Don't be a fool. Your body is not just your body. Your body only exists thanks to a collective.

Sorry Leo but this is the stupidest thing I ever heard you say. So when a psychiatrist tells me to load my body full of Xanax and go through years of unimaginable pain and suffering I should just accept that too because "it's not my body" anyway? Or when a woman wants to get abortion and she's not allowed to, it's fine because it's not her body anyway, right? Do some introspection on this one because what you just said is very dumb. Sometimes you need the high perspective but sometimes you need the down to Earth, grounded perspective. And this falls into the latter category. My body is my choice and if the government interferes with that then I'll fight to my dying breath to maintain that essential right.
 

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Without vaccines you get the Black Death of Europe. Killed 100+ million. 1/3rd of the population.

If it was black death then you'd have everyone choosing to take the vaccine because the potential benefits would far outweigh the risks, which is not at all the case with Covid where you have the majority of the population survive the infection just fine. You're comparing a grenade to an atomic bomb here.

Edited August 2, 2021 by impulse9

[AtheisticNonduality]

If some young healthy person doesn't want to get the vaccine, that is probably not the end of the world. But if all young people had the vaccine, the virus would spread less since the young people that do get infected would have less severe infections, like less coughing and stuff. Also, plenty of young people have died from it.

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Seed said:

but I am pro choice and thinking for yourself, as well as the greater good. And given how corrupt the pharmaceutical companies are and continue to be; my fear is not the Covid vaccine it itself (I can see why that is needed), but that these big pharma companies use this gateway to further expoit the masses, creating more 'mandatory' treatments, as they years / decades go on.

Your paranoia and cynicism is cloudinng your judgment. That's how fear works, it leads to terrible decisions.

Just because pharma companies want to make money does not mean they don't also save millions of lives. This is what happens when you develop an unnuanced ideology of "big corporations bad".

Big corporations are not bad. They literally save millions of lives. And yes, they are greedy too.

In this case the vaccines are cheap and given out for free. No one is gonna force you to take a vaccine unless millions of lives are at stake. And in this case they are.

Again, this all boils down to bad epistemology and ideology from the media sources you consume. Your mind has been poisoned with anti-corporate ideology and it distorts how you see the whole world, and now millions of people will needlessly die and the economy will stay bad for years.

Nobody who is anti covid vaxx is thinking for themselves. It's just ideology. People are herd animals. They do not think. Hence government laws and mandates exist for all sorts of things. If people contemplated, laws would not be necessary.

[Joel3102]

Honestly at this stage I think they should just be mandated. It's so bad that only 50% of the US is vaccinated

[impulse9]

Honestly at this stage I think they should just be mandated. It's so bad that only 50% of the US is vaccinated

No one is gonna force you to take a vaccine unless millions of lives are at stake. And in this case they are.

So much for freedom and liberty. Accusing others of being paranoid yet you're the ones trying to force others into taking action because of your own paranoia. The day they try to force this shit on me is the day I buy a shotgun.

[Seed]

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Again, this all boils down to bad epistemology and ideology from the media sources you consume. Your mind has been poisoned with anti-corporate ideology and it distorts how you see the whole world, and now millions of people will needlessly die and the economy will stay bad for years.

 

Thanks for your opinion, I will take it on board. Also, just to clarify. I haven't been reading any media sources on this matter. 

 

[Leo Gura]

@impulse9 What you call freedom is just stupidity.

[impulse9]

Sure, however I'm free to be stupid.

[Peter Miklis]

@impulse9 You're saying you're not a conspiracy theorist, but you are one inch away from fucking being one?

There's a ton of people like you in my country. Even organized protests and shit couple days ago?

[impulse9]

Here it comes, predictably. Call me what you want but no one's forcing anything into my body that I don't willingly agree to. You can try to persuade me in a civil manner and I have no issues with that, but it's my freedom and my choice to refuse if I so choose.

[Leo Gura]

31 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

Sure, however I'm free to be stupid.

No you're not, that's just your stupidity talking.

Society has never allowed unchecked stupidity. And it never will.

[impulse9]

You say this without a hint of irony meanwhile the society indoctrinates you to be as stupid, tame and programmed to be miserable 24/7 as possible.

[Peter Miklis]

@impulse9 The biggest irony is, it is most likely YOU who have been indoctrinated with some stupid conspiracy theory? not us. Most people I know try to weight their options of vaccines, try to find which one has the least potential to harm them, etc.

Meanwhile, no conspiracy theorist does any kind of research, they just keep blabbing their fucking mouths on social media, with their uninformed opinions? Just sayin. Not calling you one, but you are pretty close to being one.

[impulse9]

I can understand your point of view @Peter Miklis, and I understand that it's very easy to get very agitated when you see the anti-vax crowds seemingly work against any sort of progress. I have my own reasons for why I don't trust this vaccine, and I have a lot of trust issues when it comes to modern medicine.

[Harlen Kelly]

3 hours ago, Seed said:

my fear is not the Covid vaccine it itself (I can see why that is needed), but that these big pharma companies use this gateway to further expoit the masses, creating more 'mandatory' treatments, as they years / decades go on

The ''slippery slope'' is a logical fallacy. 

16 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

I have my own reasons for why I don't trust this vaccine

Could you share those reasons to better understand your ideological position?

Edited August 2, 2021 by Harlen Kelly

[Seed]

8 minutes ago, Harlen Kelly said:

The ''slippery slope'' is a logical fallacy. 

Please explain why? I really want to learn more. 

Edited August 2, 2021 by Seed

[Harlen Kelly]

@Seed

A slippery slope fallacy occurs when someone makes a claim about a series of events that would lead to one major event, usually a bad event. In this fallacy, a person makes a claim that one event leads to another event and so on until we come to some awful conclusion. Along the way, each step or event in the faulty logic becomes more and more improbable.

Example:

''If we enact any kind of gun control laws, the next thing you know, we won’t be allowed to have any guns at all. When that happens, we won’t be able to defend ourselves against terrorist attacks, and when that happens terrorists will take over our country. Therefore, gun control laws will cause us to lose our country to terrorists''

Apply the same faulty logic to your stance on pharmaceutical companies providing vaccines. 

Edited August 2, 2021 by Harlen Kelly