A Question About ACIM and why the world exists.

[Aimblack]

On 23/07/2021 at 4:21 PM, Leo Gura said:

As far as maps go, this is a shitty one.

Ego is a function of state. Plain and simple. Stop dancing around with cute metaphors that just feed the ego.

Change your state and there will be no more ego.

Why are you having such absolutist position on a body of teaching you are clearly unfamiliar with?

How do you know that the course doesn't hold the view that ego isn't a function of state?

The reason words like guilt are used is because it aims to directly address certain views in the christian traditions by adopting the same words but having entirely different concepts behind those words. In addition it weaves together those words and concepts in such a way that it is inappropriate to speak of how one word is used in isolation.

[EnRoute]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Human and God identities are mutually exclusive. Pick one.

Jupiter exists out of my subjective consciousness. It will be there after the body dies, right?

[Leo Gura]

14 minutes ago, Aimblack said:

Why are you having such absolutist position on a body of teaching you are clearly unfamiliar with?

I am a fan of ACIM. I recommend the workbook.

However, every teaching must be cherrypicked. Not all parts are good. This particular part about guilt is inaccurate. Other parts of ACIM are spot-on.

Yes, Christians in general have a lot of hang-ups around guilt, because they are brainwashed to be so damn anally repressed and moralized to. But that does not mean the whole of reality revolves around your guilt. It's just brainwashing.

8 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

Jupiter exists out of my subjective consciousness. It will be there after the body dies, right?

Lol

Only in your dreams

[EnRoute]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

Only in your dreams

NASA has sent an orbiter device around Jupiter. That's not a dream. It is reality, Leo!

I can not fool myself with the so-called "games of consciousness" or with the "ilusory-imaginary nature of reality."

Sorry. I don't feel like being one with Jupiter.

[Leo Gura]

2 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

NASA has sent an orbiter device around Jupiter. That's not a dream. It is reality, Leo!

So you dream.

NASA only exists in your mind.

Quote

I can not fool myself with the so-called "games of consciousness" or with the "ilusory-imaginary nature of reality."

You just did it. Fooled yourself.

[Aimblack]

@Leo Gura  I apologize then it seems that I was the one jumping the gun. And thanks for clarifying.

[Leo Gura]

Just now, Aimblack said:

@Leo Gura  I apologize then it seems that I was the one jumping the gun. And thanks for clarifying.

No worries

[EnRoute]

16 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You just did it. Fooled yourself.

The outer world is objective and it exists outside of my consciousness. It is there.

Before I was born, I had no memories of this world.

I don't even have memories of consciousness.

Edited July 24, 2021 by EnRoute
To modify a word.

[Leo Gura]

2 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

The outer world is objective and it exists outside of my consciousness. It is there.

Before I was born, I had no memories of this world.

I don't even have memories of consciousness.

So you imagine.

[Batman]

2 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

The outer world is objective and it exists outside my consciousness. It is there.

Yeah, so where does it exist outside your mind?

Your assumption that there is something outside your mind, also exist in your mind.

[EnRoute]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

So you imagine.

I just clicked on a (CNN) YouTube video and I saw the anchors over there talking about the NSA.

Did I have the need to imagine them and listen to their theories? What do I have in common with them talking about the NSA, spying on civilians?

Are you imagining what I'm writing here, Leo?

And am I imagining you? Aren't you real as a person?

Moreover, am I imagining your objective answers?

Edited July 24, 2021 by EnRoute
To add a question.

[EnRoute]

11 minutes ago, Batman said:

Your assumption that there is something outside your mind, also exist in your mind.

No, it doesn't. I've been calling my brother on WhatsUp to tell him to write a verse from the Bible on paper and put it under my doormat.

When I arrived home, I found the paper there. I wasn't the one who put the message under the doormat.

Now, I will imagine my brother writing down a verse from the Bible on paper, without calling him on WhatsUp. I'll go and check to see if the message will be there.

I'll be right back!

Edited July 24, 2021 by EnRoute
To add a sentence.

[Batman]

35 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

No, it doesn't. I've been calling my brother on WhatsUp to tell him to write a verse from the Bible on paper and put it under my doormat.

When I arrived home, I found the paper there. I wasn't the one who put the message under the doormat.

Now, I will imagine my brother writing down a verse from the Bible on paper, without calling him on WhatsUp. I'll go and check to see if the message will be there.

I'll be right back!

Okay, so now you are just assuming there are other minds in the game. Indeed legitimate and reasonable assumption, but it still is an assumption within your mind. Tell me, when you dream at night, and there are 'others' that occupy your dream, aren't you holding them as distinguished from you and having a separate mind? Did the "I" that you refer to ever experienced being your brother?

[EnRoute]

1 minute ago, Batman said:

Tell me, when you dream at night, and there are 'others' that occupy your dream, aren't you holding them as distinguished from you and having a separate mind?

No. I don't hold them as distinguished from me. They're just different aspects of myself disguised as other people.

[Batman]

Not 'post-dream', but during.

[Andyforreal]

5 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

No. I don't hold them as distinguished from me. They're just different aspects of myself disguised as other people.

You can't believe someone on that if you're not awaken to it yet, you are not conscious of it. Because in your current state this all sounds like madness or some stupid fairy tale, and you don't have to be conscious if you don't want to.

Just enjoy your life as it is and that's it, your choice

[Windappreciator]

[Batman]

2 minutes ago, Andyforreal said:

You can't believe someone on that if you're not awaken to it yet, you are not conscious of it. Because in your current state this all sounds like madness or some stupid fairy tale, and you don't have to be conscious if you don't want to.

Just enjoy your life as it is and that's it, your choice

He does not have to believe. Belief is antithetical to this pursuit. Actually, he is already practicing belief without noticing it. He is already here, why encourage him to go back to ignorance?

[EnRoute]

2 minutes ago, Batman said:

He does not have to believe. Belief is antithetical to this pursuit. Actually, he is already practicing belief without noticing it. He is already here, why encourage him to go back to ignorance?

I can't know for sure what consciousness is and where did it come from. I can't find out if reality is imaginary by nature. We simply can not know.

The rest is speculation.

[Andyforreal]

2 minutes ago, Batman said:

He does not have to believe. Belief is antithetical to this pursuit. Actually, he is already practicing belief without noticing it. He is already here, why encourage him to go back to ignorance?

31 minutes ago, EnRoute said:

 

And forcing him to believe will help? His mind is currently not open for it