How real is Johnny Bravo?

[RMQualtrough]

Imagining Johnny gives him existence, but does he have a subjective perception via some other mechanism. E.g. if something can exist it does. And I don't see why such a universe could not exist with a Johnny Bravo.

Hm...

[Mason Riggle]

@RMQualtrough Johnny Bravo does exist.  He's a cartoon character. 
 

My questions for you would be.. what would be different about a 'real Johnny Bravo' and the one you know?  Doesn't the Universe already exist with a Johnny Bravo? 

 

[Hulia]

36 minutes ago, Mason Riggle said:

My questions for you would be.. what would be different about a 'real Johnny Bravo' and the one you know?  Doesn't the Universe already exist with a Johnny Bravo? 
 

Interaction. Interaction makes a difference

[Mason Riggle]

@Hulia not sure what you mean.  When I watch Johnny Bravo, am I not interacting with Johnny Bravo? 

If 'the real Johnny Bravo' is different from 'Johnny Bravo', then it's not the 'real Johnny Bravo', but rather some other thing that resembles Johnny Bravo but isn't Johnny Bravo. 

[Hulia]

24 minutes ago, Mason Riggle said:

not sure what you mean.  When I watch Johnny Bravo, am I not interacting with Johnny Bravo? 

No, you are not. It´s a half-ineraction. One-way interaction.

You cannot through a stone and see the circles on the water. Johnny Bravo is a dead image.

[Mason Riggle]

@Hulia if Johnny Bravo isn't interacting with me, how do I see him when I watch him? Isn't my 'watching Johnny Bravo' me interacting with Johnny Bravo? 

Edited July 22, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[Hulia]

10 minutes ago, Mason Riggle said:

@Hulia if Johnny Bravo isn't interacting with me, how do I see him when I watch him? Isn't my 'watching Johnny Bravo' me interacting with Johnny Bravo? 

Yes. Johnny Bravo IS interacting with you. But you ARE NOT interacting with him. One-way-interaction.

[Mason Riggle]

@Hulia okay, but why does that make Johnny Bravo any less real?  

(we seem to have different notions of what 'interacting' means, so I'll go along with your definition and agree that I don't interact with Johnny Bravo any more than I interact with the rest of my surroundings, like my chair, which is still real, even though we don't 'interact'.) 

Edited July 22, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[Anahata]

Consciousness is not localized 'in your human body'.

The experience of 'watching Johnny Bravo' is happening to Awareness itself. 

 

 

[Hulia]

7 minutes ago, Mason Riggle said:

@Hulia okay, but why does that make Johnny Bravo any less real?  

(we seem to have different notions of what 'interacting' means, so I'll go along with your definition and agree that I don't interact with Johnny Bravo any more than I interact with the rest of my surroundings, like my chair, which is still real, even though we don't 'interact'.) 

ok, Johny Bravo is as real as a chair, but not as real as an entity capable of reaction and change while being interacted

[Mason Riggle]

@Hulia chairs are less real than people? 

[Hulia]

1 minute ago, Mason Riggle said:

@Hulia chairs are less real than people? 

:))) It would cause people quite a lot discomfort

OK.. Let´s beging from the start

Your initial question was:

1 hour ago, Mason Riggle said:

My questions for you would be.. what would be different about a 'real Johnny Bravo' and the one you know? 

I just answered what is different. But yes, they both are real

[Mason Riggle]

@Hulia I guess that was my point.. Johnny Bravo is already real.  He already does exist... and if there is some difference between 'the Johnny Bravo that already exists' and 'some other more real Johnny Bravo' then they are two different things.  

I think the OP is conflating 'real' with 'has all the qualities of a human'.  

Would the hypothetical 'real Johnny Bravo' have skin like me, or remain a cartoon? 

[Anahata]

Try to 'Zoom out' a little bit. Or to 'Zoom in'. Same thing. In and out of the 'conceptual lenses'...

You are not a person. I's not @RMQualtrough that is being conscious rn in a bubble of subjective experience inside your head/brain. It's the unlocalized Awareness being aware of a dreamed up character which became the imaginary '(your human identity) avatar'.

You are Awareness/Consciousness, not a sentient, conscious *human being*. You are Existence itself. 

Awareness/Consciousness/Existence is where the experience of 'you imagining' or 'you watching Johnny Bravo' is occuring & 'THAT' which is aware of it. 'The content' is what's being dreamed up by 'it', not a perception of an external reality. 

Now...What does 'You watching Johnny Bravo' mean?...

Well, it's Consciousness entertaining itself. 'It' is something that's happening spontaneously --- as in --- the whole indivisible experience of *all that's being experienced when you're watching the cartoon Johnny Bravo*.

*The cartoon character Johnny Bravo* is a distinction you're making within the whole experience you're having. The observer and the observed is a distinction you're imagining. The observer and the observed are One. Not 'a conscious human' watching a lifeless cartoon/imagining Johnny Bravo. But unlocalized Consciousness having the experience of •believing it's a human watching a cartoon on a screen, standing on a sofa, in a room, on planet Earth•.

Dreaming it all up in the now...

It's all spontaneous -- as in -- 'a past' where ideas were materialized as a cartoon by humans some time ago is a thought you're having in the now. 

It's like watching your human reflection in the mirror. If you fall asleep while standing in front of a mirror, the reflection is not being experienced by Awareness anymore. Because this time Awareness is aware of smth else --> what you call 'your night time dream'. Which is being experienced in the same way 'your human character' is appearing to Awareness while being in the 'wakeful state'. What's aware of the whole thing?

But the mirror, your body, the reflection & the room are one. When they disappear, •all the content disappears all at once• -- as you fall asleep. 'All of this' as a whole... turns into 'dreams you're having in your sleep'. What remains unchanged is Existence. The content is changing throughout your 'journey', but You are always here. As God.

 

 

 

Edited July 22, 2021 by Anahata

[Hulia]

43 minutes ago, Mason Riggle said:

Would the hypothetical 'real Johnny Bravo' have skin like me, or remain a cartoon? 

Even if he had skin like you, it still wouldn´t contain billions of nerve endings, like your skin or my skin.

[Mason Riggle]

@Hulia then it wouldn't be skin like mine, it would be some other kind of skin that resembles mine.   He can't have skin like mine that's not like mine. That doesn't make sense. That's like a beverage that tastes like grape and not like grape. 

Edited July 22, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[Anahata]

Just now, Mason Riggle said:

@RMQualtrough Johnny Bravo does exist.  He's a cartoon character. 
 

Notice 'what' exactly you're reffering to when you say Johnny Bravo is a cartoon character.

And I mean... Really investigate this matter. 

 

[Mason Riggle]

@Anahata when you say 'Really investigate this matter' notice 'what' exactly you're referring to.. 

Of course I get what you are saying.. it's all consciousness. (I think perhaps you meant to direct your comment to @RMQualtrough rather than me). 

I could have said, 'Johnny Bravo seems to exist. He seems to be a cartoon character', language that's a little better at conveying that it's the 'seeming' that's 'real', while the contents of seeming (what seems to be) are just that.  

We might explore what it means for something to 'exist'.  Does Johnny Bravo exist? Sure, just as much as my chair exists, or thoughts about chairs exist, or the experience of chairs exists.   Does anything 'really exist', or does everything only 'seem to exist'?  Is there any difference? 
 

Edited July 22, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[Anahata]

Just now, Mason Riggle said:

We might explore what it means for something to 'exist'.  Does Johnny Bravo exist? Sure, just as much as my chair exists, or thoughts about chairs exist, or the experience of chairs exists.   Does anything 'really exist', or does everything only 'seem to exist'?  Is there any difference? 
 

Any experience 'exists' as you think it, as That which is thinking it is Existence itself.

[Mason Riggle]

@Anahata yes. Imaginary = Real