A Metaphor for Pick Up in Relation to Female Sexuality

[Emerald]

Now, one of my main gripes about pick-up (though I do understand why it exists), is that it presents an inaccurate view of female sexuality while simultaneously being thoroughly convinced that it's got an accurate view to where puas advocate not listening to women at all about their desires.

And it's a shame because women really need to feel seen and understood to feel intimacy and satisfaction in a relationship with a man. And being with a man who won't/can't give you that from the female perspective, is as boring and dry as being with a woman who never even touches your penis from the male perspective.

And many men find this inaccurate understanding of female sexuality useful for their purposes of having sex and getting dates because it's a numbers game and eventually you'll have some success if you just approach. So, it is a bit of a magic feather and a user friendly distortion... at least user friendly for pick up.

So, the inaccurate understanding of female sexuality that pick up artists usually have works up until a point for their own purposes. But there is usually little curiosity otherwise, which is boring. 

So, this is the metaphor that came to mind.

I recall when I was in early elementary school, I was taught about subtraction. And we were taught to always subtract the small number from the big number. And this advice worked well for the time. I really got the technique. It got the job done. 

But I only understood the pattern and not the actual concept.

I knew what worked, but I didn't really know why it worked until I developed a broader understanding that included the existence of negative numbers.

This is how I see pick-up. There are things that work in it. But most men misattribute or don't know why these things work. 

And that understanding of the patterns but not the causes behind the patterns, ends up very "meh" for women when it comes to intimacy... which is the main thing that motivates most of us to want sex in the first place. 

 

 

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Emerald

[Thunder Kiss]

The thing with pickup is that it's not really about the woman at all. It's about men competing with eachother, and a woman is just a pawn in their game. so, they can exploit this knowledge and fake being emotional just to pull the girl.

[NoSelfSelf]

Im confused, pick up and relationships are 2 different things..you can be good at pick up and suck at relationships and vice versa...and what does being heard and hear what women desire means exactly? Usually as a guy you should know better what women wants than her imo?‍♂️....

[NoSelfSelf]

@Lucas-fgm thats a bad reason to do pick up imo... its about creating your confidence and game to win at life in general imo...

[Preety_India]

3 minutes ago, Tangerinedream said:

the problem is that using the phrase "pickup" is automatically thought of as toxic, becazse in general it has been used in toxic ways.  i dunno why you guys can't come up with a different name for this 'concious style pickup' that is used for gaining confidence and genuinely meeting girls.  the word pickup itself is triggering.

I agree

[Karmadhi]

All females that do not like pick up, ask yourselves this.

How would you feel if you had a son and one day he comes home very upset. You try to get him to talk but he just says everything is okay. Eventually, he tells you crying that every time he likes someone they do not like him back and even though he is a kind respectful person no girl seems to be interested in him. I feel unlovable, like something is wrong with me he says.

How would you feel if your son told you that? 

Pick up may have a lot of devilrly in it for sure, but it is the only realistic solution to fix this problem. The issue is not pick up per say, it is conscious versus devilry pick up. Big nuanced difference.

 

[Karmadhi]

@Tangerinedream Female friends are very healthy to have  and i personally have a lot of them however they will not help you get laid most of the time. Translations from friends to girlfriends are quite rare and messy processes that cause a lot of pain. Not a good idea. Trust me, i have tried it and also many of my friends have tried it. The success rate is crazy low and almost always involves a shit lot of pain. You might say the success rate of pick up is very low and it can be difficult too. True, however you gain a skill set that is priceless.

Also i notice that female friends tend to make guys quite weak and soft. Not good for attraction to be weak and soft. It should be balanced between guy and female friends. Too much guy friends is also bad imo because then you will objectify women or treat them as species from another planet.

I think best strategy to date is to talk to girls for a bit of time and then try to date them.  Does not have to be pick up but pick up is most conveninent for people post college. 

Pick up= talking to a girl you do not know, if you vibe well then go on a date with her, if date goes well then you have sex/start relationship. This is healthy pick up. No need to be evil.

[NoSelfSelf]

@Tangerinedream Sorry but you cant help him there,you will just ruin him in almost every case that this happens is because father failed on him and let his wife do the heavy lifting of raising him...she will do everything that will turn him into a weak simp ?

[LastThursday]

13 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

its about creating your confidence and game to win at life in general imo...

Fair enough. But what does win mean here anyway? There's other ways to create confidence than just doing pickup no? Probably better ways IMO.

Isn't it more natural and easy just to openly flirt and "advertise" yourself and letting that do the work? The quantity and tenacious mindset of pickup just doesn't click with me, way too artificial and potentially demeaning for both the woman and the man. Or am I missing something valuable here?

[Windappreciator]

You Guys.. why are we occupied with puck up so much?

Edited July 19, 2021 by Windappreciator

[Leo Gura]

58 minutes ago, Emerald said:

puas advocate not listening to women at all about their desires.

Guys should listen to a woman's desires and values once a relationship is formed.

Just don't ask women about attraction or dating advice.

[Karmadhi]

@LastThursday

3 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

Isn't it more natural and easy just to openly flirt and "advertise" yourself and letting that do the work?

You take for granted how hard it is for some people to "openly flirt and advertise yourself". For some it is super difficult and needs 15 different limiting beliefs getting tackled. Imagine you think you re a shity boring weak ugly guy, you will not have the guts to even flirt with her.  Imagine being super shy, you will not have the guts to even look her in the eye yet alone create sexual tension.

Pick up is a last resort for such people.

[Windappreciator]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Guys should listen to a woman's desires and values once a relationship is formed.

Just don't ask women about attraction or dating advice.

Why Leo, why? Why throw wood.

Edited July 19, 2021 by Windappreciator

[NoSelfSelf]

@LastThursday You define whats winning for you in life....in dating if you are not good at pick up i see someone thats usually stuck with a person because its their only option...thats not loving imo..

I dont know tell me whats better option for buildong confidence i havent found it...

What do you mean by advertising yourself?

[Preety_India]

15 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

You take for granted how hard it is for some people to "openly flirt and advertise yourself".

Why is it hard and if it's hard, isn't that a good thing ?

 

[soos_mite_ah]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

All females that do not like pick up, ask yourselves this.

How would you feel if you had a son and one day he comes home very upset. You try to get him to talk but he just says everything is okay. Eventually, he tells you crying that every time he likes someone they do not like him back and even though he is a kind respectful person no girl seems to be interested in him. I feel unlovable, like something is wrong with me he says.

How would you feel if your son told you that?

You know that situation isnt unique to men? Women experience this all the time. We just feel the hurt and move on without harboring bitterness towards the other person. 

If my son or daughter came up to me I would tell him that they are beautiful, smart, interesting, and lovable people. Just because someone doesnt see that or doesn't like them in that way, doesnt mean there is anything wrong with them. I would teach them to have a healthy ego and have an inner sense of self esteem. I would teach them that if someone doesnt like them back, that isnt the time to persue that person more because of issues of consent and because if you were secure in your identity, why would you chase after something that wasnt meant to be yours or after someone who doesnt like you in that way? 

If my child was a girl, I would tell her that her worth isnt dependent on a boy and that her value lies outside of a relationship status since there is that pressure for girls to get into a relationship or else its thought that they are failing at their femininity and that they are undesirable. I would tell her that she doesnt need to change herself, especially physically to appeal to men. I would teach her the importance of self acceptance and how eventually someone is going to come around and its going to be even better because he will like her back for who she authentically is. 

If my child was a boy, I would also tell him that his worth isn't dependent on a girl and I would have a discussion with him regarding how society has this expectation of masculinity where if you dont get girls you're some type of a loser. I would teach him that this isnt a healthy way to approach masculinity and relationships in general. I woul teach him to d be mindful of society's expectations for men and how it isn't always accurate or healthy when it comes to dealing with friendships and relationships with women. I would teach him self acceptance even if it feels like it's going at odds with society's standards for him. 

Edited July 19, 2021 by soos_mite_ah

[Jacob Morres]

 

@soos_mite_ah

7 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

You know that situation isnt unique to men? Women experience this all the time. We just feel the hurt and move on without harboring bitterness towards the other person. 

 

lets be fair women harbor bitterness to men all the time. not pitting men against women here but u said that like yall just move on without ever getting bitter lmao 

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Jacob Morres

[soos_mite_ah]

@Jacob Morres the bitterness often comes from dealing with things racism and misogyny. It doesn't come from the rejection itself. 

How many women do you see shooting places up or assaulting people because they got rejected? 

[Jacob Morres]

 

11 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

how society has this expectation of masculinity where if you dont get girls you're some type of a loser

thanks!! but i remember your comment several months ago of your rant about how some people on the forum were a bunch of weirdos for not being good with women and needing help (paraphrasing). i can pull up the comment if you'd like lmaoooo 

[soos_mite_ah]

@Jacob Morres when I talk about weirdos who cant get laid, I'm specifying weirdos as the sexist people who try to justify their bs with incel, redpill, rhetoric/ideology . Talking about alphas, Chads, etc on 4chan without having any irl interaction is weirdo behavior in the eyes of most people. 

There are plenty of normal men and women who dont get laid and those arent the weirdos I'm talking about. 

As a whole, if we want to prevent people from turning into these weirdos who internalize their self hatred and take it out in the form of violence, we need to stop acting as it romantic relationships are the end all and be all and that someone's sexual and romantic status means anything about people's worth.