How Dangerous is Postmodern Cultural Relativism?

[Eph75]

That is still fear based. Imagine a world that is post-gender-and-sex identification, where ones sex or whatever wouldn't matter.

Reproduction might be an issue, but life indeed finds a way. 

In that world there wouldn't have to be need to present oneself as such or such, and the human connection is all that matters.

Not for the sake of shifting acceptance towards the one group or away from the other more traditionally accepted group, but instead from the position that gender and sex is nothing else than a preference and a piece of flesh that happen to be attached to a body. 

It wouldn't be dangerous from anyone's perspective. It would just be. 

The norm creates the perspective, and the perspective crates the values, and the values creates the fear.

Ok so we don't live in such an world, but it's easy to see that we're increasingly moving in such a direction where equality becomes absolute, and the construction of mind will dissipate. We won't live to see this, probably, but we will live to see this shift. 

Would I feel scammed?

As a heterosexual man enjoying the heterosexual female "form", I certainly would be surprised. Would I get angry, or shamed, or feel guilty and so on? Don't know, haven't been there, but if I did, I am conscious enough to see that it lives within me. 

If you are desire and deficiency driven, you will perceive anything that is a potential obstacle to achieving that which you desire out of such defieinecy as a threat, and fear is the result.

Would anyone expect you to suddenly shift preference? No, of course not, that is your freedom. But shifting perspective just for a moment for the sake of exercising the mind is an interesting and healthy activity.

Of course, unless you do so and your current fears become challenged, and changes your norms, and then it becomes dangerous, to your old self 

That would be a beautiful thing 

Edited July 25, 2021 by Eph75

[Leo Gura]

13 hours ago, Harlen Kelly said:

This assertion presupposes that the LGBT+ community is dangerous. How exactly are they dangerous?

Elaborate...

If one struggling to construct and maintain a traditional hetero male or female identity, LGBT is dangerous.

[Karmadhi]

Are gays, bisexuals etc born or made?

I have had many discussions with my conservative friends about this and they say they are made by today's culture which promotes it a lot.

The thing is that, in ancient rome and greece there have been records of homosexuals so i do not think it is made.

I think it is just born.

I do not know why they are hated so much, usually they use the bible or the quran as proof that they should be hated.

I think that is BS tbh.

[Epikur]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

Are gays, bisexuals etc born or made?

I have had many discussions with my conservative friends about this and they say they are made by today's culture which promotes it a lot.

The thing is that, in ancient rome and greece there have been records of homosexuals so i do not think it is made.

I think it is just born.

I do not know why they are hated so much, usually they use the bible or the quran as proof that they should be hated.

I think that is BS tbh.

Contries are created by war. If countries with gay rights would be more succesful every country would adopt it one way or the other. Till then everything risky and new for survival will be seen negatively.

[Anastas Sia]

 

3 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

Are gays, bisexuals etc born or made?

It shouldn't really matter.

But from my experience people are born like this. My first crush was a girl and I didn't even realize until I started to compare the love I felt then to the love I feel now in a heterosexual relationship. I barely had any lgbt influences, but I wasn't homophobic either.

maybe people could transcend their preferences at some point (doesn't necessarily change who they sleep with) but i don't know how that would work yet, i didn't have a preference to begin with lol

Edited July 25, 2021 by Anastas Sia

[Karmadhi]

@Anastas Sia

48 minutes ago, Anastas Sia said:

It shouldn't really matter.

It does matter a lot because people hate liberals because they think it makes people homosexual. They say all this LGBT shit makes people homosexual/lesbian/bisexual etc and this stuff is made and not born.

If it became consensus that lgbt preferences are not made but born, then these movements would become a lot less hated and slowly accepted.

In the long term it will help to normalize these views in the first place which is the root of the problem.

One step at a time.

[Carl-Richard]

58 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

It does matter a lot because people hate liberals because they think it makes people homosexual. They say all this LGBT shit makes people homosexual/lesbian/bisexual etc and this stuff is made and not born.

They simply have to evolve past viewing everything through the lens of pushing a political narrative and adopt freedom of thought. If people are free to be whoever they want to be, this shouldn't be a problem at all. If someone believes that people ought to believe in their restrictive worldview and somebody says "we accept a wider range", of course they will project by saying "you're forcing this on me!".

Edited July 25, 2021 by Carl-Richard

[Karmadhi]

@Carl-Richard I come from a very homophobic conservative country i have heard basically every argument they have against LGBT stuff.

One of the main ones aside religion (forbiden in holy books), is that they say it goes against nature. 

Typical argument of them: "Nature created male and female, to go against it is a crime. All other species are hetero therefore this is some bullshit human invention that goes against the sacred fundamentals of life".

Heard this like a dozen times hahahahaa.

 

[cookiemonster]

4 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

Are gays, bisexuals etc born or made?

 

It's a combination of both. You can think of it as a 3-step process via the metaphor of hardware, firmware and software. There's a lot of space for variation, but once all 3 elements have been "baked in ", it's pretty much permanent from then on.

1. Hardware is built first (in utero) and pertains to genitalia type. (male / female).
2. Firmware is baked in shortly after and pertains to instinct. (masculine / feminine).
3. Software comes last and is the learning process of attraction aesthetics that takes a few years to develop following birth.

Hardware is the most binary. Firmware is a spectrum with binary polarities. Software is a collection of practically unlimited variables depending on cultural environment.

For example a person could be born with male hardware running feminine firmware attracted to a person running masculine firmware that has culturally feminine aesthetics.

And so on.

 

[Carl-Richard]

11 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

@Carl-Richard I come from a very homophobic conservative country i have heard basically every argument they have against LGBT stuff.

One of the main ones aside religion (forbiden in holy books), is that they say it goes against nature. 

Typical argument of them: "Nature created male and female, to go against it is a crime. All other species are hetero therefore this is some bullshit human invention that goes against the sacred fundamentals of life".

Heard this like a dozen times hahahahaa.

Maybe the worst part is that homosexuality has actually been observed in nature in other species than humans. Besides, when did theologans suddenly pull themselves down to the level of animals? (or maybe that's just a Christian thing) ?

Edited July 25, 2021 by Carl-Richard

[Happy Lizard]

@Anastas Sia very interested to learn more about this, or if you have found others who have changed preferences like yourself.

I knew friend who identified and dressed like a boy for the majority of her life, had relationships with girls too, and was sexually attracted to girls, said she didn't feel anything for guys. One day she told me she just woke up and found out that she likes guys now. I'm not sure how this happens so suddenly.

[Karmadhi]

@Carl-Richard These are arguments done by non religious people against LGBT. Religious people just say the holy book says so and thats it.

[Harlen Kelly]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

If one struggling to construct and maintain a traditional hetero male or female identity, LGBT is dangerous

Why?

Edited July 25, 2021 by Harlen Kelly

[Arcangelo]

 

 

5 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

If it became consensus that lgbt preferences are not made but born, then these movements would become a lot less hated and slowly accepted.

I agree 100%

No one chooses to be a homosexual, just like no one chooses to be heterosexual. It just happens like that.

4 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

All other species are hetero

But why no one ever tells them that there are lots of other animals that engage in homosexual behavior.

 

[Opo]

1 hour ago, Arcangelo said:

But why no one ever tells them that there are lots of other animals that engage in homosexual behavior.

I do and it works great. 

You can even show them a silly video. 

 

[Carl-Richard]

7 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

@Carl-Richard These are arguments done by non religious people against LGBT. Religious people just say the holy book says so and thats it.

Oh I misread that, I'm sorry. Yeah, appeal to nature is just a lazy argument in general. If you're trying to build a successful society, looking to nature is probably the last thing you should do. Animals kill and rape eachother. Very applaudeable stuff.

Edited July 25, 2021 by Carl-Richard

[Akemrelax]

On 2021-07-23 at 2:03 AM, bejapuskas said:

You're attached to your privileged identity.

Irony. If you want to know privilege look at yourself first. 

On 2021-07-23 at 2:03 AM, bejapuskas said:

But then progressives usually do not kill people because of their identity,

That’s a dumb argument, just because they don’t kill people doesn’t mean we can’t criticize them. It causes problems to people. By your logic we shouldn’t criticize western countries because look, there’s so much red and blue still in the world.

Solving political problems requires understanding identity. More identification and excessive pride will cause problems. 

Progressives want white people to disassociate from their identity while telling the opposite to POCs. How are POCs and minorities going to be free from cultural conditioning if they are so identified? How are they going to question their society? Does it encourage stage blue minorities to self reflect or does it embolden them? As a POC, if I listened to progressives I wouldn’t be able to break free from cultural conditions, I would be stage blue, they don’t help you break free.

It’s more about problems within the white community (or problems from their end), it’s doesn’t really care about the internal problems of minority groups (they don’t see them as their own). It’s very white centric in this way. It’s comfortable critiquing whites/Christians/western civilization (“their” community) but won’t do it to other communities. if you’re a minority you see that as a problem in your community not getting highlighted, it’s  further perpetuated by the encouragement of identification from progressives. 

[Willie]

I think the answer’s obvious. It’s relatively dangerous, because it’s all relative. It depends on a person’s worldview and prior life experience. Some feel threatened and hate it, while others love it and confuse it for absolute truth.

[bejapuskas]

@Epikur  Countries with better LGBTQ+ rights are the most successful in fact. 

@Akemrelax  I do not respect criticizing green from below. There is so much of it on this forum. Look at all this homophobia, transphobia on this thread. Horrible devilry. I do not get the sense that people here understand green. Why does people fighting for their rights offend you? Are you mad?

[Milos Uzelac]

@Roy

Q: How dangerous is Neo-liberal *American and International proxy institutions Capitalism

Very dangerous in fact for your wellbeing and your families wellbeing if you are employed as working class in a neocolonized half-periphery banana republic or society if you can suffer an unemployment rate worse than in the time of the Great Depression in America for 7 years. 

From Weights of Chains 2 Doc on the Neo-liberal economic reforms implemented in the Balkans and the effects of these reforms on all aspects of life in the former Yugoslavia, from politics, economics, military, culture, education to the media. 

Reasons for Edit: I couldn't for some reason comment on my phone on the quoted question posed on this thread so I had to do it this way. I will delete the quoted sentence in the upper comment later on my laptop. 

Edited July 26, 2021 by Milos Uzelac