Is this just petty games?

[roopepa]

If there is Truth, it must be appearing in direct experience. Otherwise, it is not Absolute Truth. What would truth be, if not that what is Here Now?

So...

Love is bullshit. Oneness is bullshit. Infinity is bullshit. There is none of that Here Now.

In direct experience, there is a bunch of abstract "sensory experiences" (shapes, colour, sound), a thought, and perhaps a feeling.

Truth is not in some experience yesterday or tomorrow, psychedelic or mystical. Truth is not in some realization or state. Truth is here, and that's it.

So what the fuck is this oneness/love/infinity about? Please explain me how there is something that is not here now? What the actual fuck are you talking about? Don't give me that "take a psychedelic" or "you must get to higher consciousness" bullshit. Give me truth right here now.

[Mason Riggle]

It's Always Now.

The Truth (It) is Eternally (Always) this Moment (Now). 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"It is always now.

However much you feel you may need to plan for the future, to anticipate it, to mitigate risks, the reality of it is now.

Now, this may sound trite, but it's the truth.

It's not quite true as a matter of physics, in fact, there is no "now" when it comes to the entire universe… You can't talk of an event occurring simultaneously occurring here and at the same moment occurring in Andromeda.

The truth is, "now" is not even well defined as a matter of neurology. Because we know that inputs to the brain come at different moments and that consciousness is built upon layers of inputs… whose timings have to be different. Our conscious awareness of the present moment is in some relevant sense already a memory. But as a matter of conscious experience, the reality of your life is always now.

I think this is a liberating truth about the nature of the human mind.

In fact, I think there is probably nothing more important to understand about your mind than that if you want to be happy in this world.

The past is a memory. It's a thought arising in the present.

The future is merely anticipated. It is another thought arising now.

What we truly have is this moment. And this. And this…" - Sam Harris

[Barna]

Exactly. Truth is the present moment. But what is your perspective on the present moment? Are you looking at it from a separated point of view? Or are you actually one with what you experience? 

Psychedelics are "just" for realizing that you're actually one with what you experience (the present moment).

[Mason Riggle]

@Barna ?

"I have no other self than the totality of that which I am aware." - Alan Watts

What is mistaken to be the experiencer of experience, is just more experience. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[allislove]

Quote

Love is bullshit. Oneness is bullshit. Infinity is bullshit. There is none of that Here Now.

If there is a rope in a dark room and you think it's a snake, does it mean there is actually a snake? Find the source of "I"-thinking to see that it's just a rope.

[roopepa]

16 minutes ago, allislove said:

If there is a rope in a dark room and you think it's a snake, does it mean there is actually a snake? Find the source of "I"-thinking to see that it's just a rope.

I'm sure there is like a gajillion of beliefs and reasonings that make it seem like now is not really what is now but they ain't now.

[Nahm]

@roopepa

The truth is thought activity settles for those who adopt the practice of an hour of proper meditation every single morning. 

Think all you want. Argue all you want. Trip balls all you want. Learn all you want. Believe whatever you want. Say whatever you want. You’ll never get it. 

The thought activity is the veil. The thought activity is the petty game. No mind is not conceptual. 

[allislove]

@roopepa 

The key is in the "I'm sure" part, since as @Nahm mentioned "no mind is not conceptual", but "I'm sureness" is a concept.

[Thought Art]

You just aren't in the right state of consciousness....

But for now, look. Anything at all exists and it is earth and people etc... That is only possible because of the fundamental oneness and intelligence. 

[Wilhelm44]

1 hour ago, allislove said:

If there is a rope in a dark room and you think it's a snake, does it mean there is actually a snake? Find the source of "I"-thinking to see that it's just a rope.

What is the best way to find the source of "I"- thinking ?

[Consilience]

2 hours ago, roopepa said:

If there is Truth, it must be appearing in direct experience. Otherwise, it is not Absolute Truth. What would truth be, if not that what is Here Now?

So...

Love is bullshit. Oneness is bullshit. Infinity is bullshit. There is none of that Here Now.

In direct experience, there is a bunch of abstract "sensory experiences" (shapes, colour, sound), a thought, and perhaps a feeling.

Truth is not in some experience yesterday or tomorrow, psychedelic or mystical. Truth is not in some realization or state. Truth is here, and that's it.

So what the fuck is this oneness/love/infinity about?

When one studies direct experience long enough, when one trains the mind to have a high level of mindfulness (concentration, sensory clarity, and equanimity) one eventually sees that our mundane sensory sober experience, the most non-mystical experience you can think of, is actually none other than infinity, oneness, and love. These three words all pointing to that which is absolute. 

It's impossible to describe why and how this present moment direct experience is infinite; this is not even something the mind can "do." However, I can explain why you don't perceive it as such:

Our present moment sensory experience for the average individual is constructed out of a plethora of distortions, beliefs, interpretations, and the belief in an identity based on emotion predispositions, a life story, a being moving through space, and events happening across time that weaves and tangles all of the raw sensory data together. This distortion, this deep entanglement of physical perceptions and mental perceptions (many of which are so subtle they're completely unrecognized by conscious surface level awareness) creates a sense of known reality, a sense of "the way things are" when in fact complex matrix of distortion has nothing to do with the way things really are. When we see reality as anything other than pure infinity, emptiness, love, god, the absolute, etc., we are playing into a story we're unconsciously constructing. The way out of this unconscious construction is by rigorous investigation, deconstruction, contemplation, and meditation. 

So yes right now the mundane sensory field feels very... dull. That's due to an entire matrix of un-cognized, background beliefs and interpretations driving your experience you've yet to sufficiently become aware of through deep mindfulness/observation/investigation. Until a sufficient amount of mindfulness, for example, is brought to see into the heart of what this field is, understanding how reality is love, for example, will be impossible. 

[VeganAwake]

The word truth implies that there is something false.

There is nothing false, only misunderstandings.

The experience that you are a separate individual that can one day find something within everything called truth is a misunderstanding.

There is only everything without separation. 

Love it or hate it.....It's the only show in town ❤

 

[allislove]

14 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

What is the best way to find the source of "I"- thinking ?

Investigate the direct experience. Thinking arises... "What is the best way to find the source of "I"-thinking?" for example... notice that for thinking to arise there should be existence that switch on the thinking and everything else... notice that thinking arises in you in the same way as sound of bird singing for example... notice that it is you playing with yourself, pretending that you should find the source of "I"-thinking.

[roopepa]

@allislove @Nahm 

I'm not really arguing about anything. I'm just pointing at direct experience right now. There is no oneness, love or infinity appearing here now. And how could anything else than Absolute Fucking Truth be appearing? What does Truth even mean anymore when it is 'given a chance' to not be directly here??

Look. You may say that hours of meditation is required to 'get it'. And that the truth is hiding, or veiled behind the mind. You may say this from your experience. Maybe believe you, given a "your experience" even exists. Maybe I meditate every tomorrow morning. But is this "hours of meditation, truth veiled by the mind" not the thought-story? Are you not selling me Maya?

I'm sorry if this makes any of you guys uncomfortable, but I'm really just pointing out at what is. Something just does not sit right with this whole awakening thing people are selling me. All this talk about direct experience, and when it is truly looked at, I get recommended more meditation and something that seems to me like dream-stories.

[roopepa]

@Leo Gura By the way, I know you don't like us denying Love. I'm really just being curious and trying to figure out something I find valuable. I hope you don't block this at least before some clarity is gained.

[Leo Gura]

10 minutes ago, roopepa said:

There is no oneness, love or infinity appearing here now.

There is, but you are not conscious of it.

You are like a fish asking, "Where is the water? Water is bullshit!"

The Truth is here and now, but that does not mean you are conscious of what it is.

Yes, indeed you should take a psychedelic to help you bust out of your ignorant condition.

When someone tells you there is Japan, what they mean is: you can be in Japan but you aren't there yet. And you say, "That's bullshit, only where I am now is true." This is a conflation of relative and absolute. Yes, where you are now is true, but you can also go to Japan. Truth changes.

[Nahm]

52 minutes ago, roopepa said:

I'm just pointing at direct experience right now.

Nonduality. Not-two. Try literally pointing at direct experience to realize that is not possible. 

[allislove]

@roopepa

Yeah, meditation practice is also a Maya, but what you can do ?‍♂️?

You are the f*cking creator of everything. Just sitting and investigating the direct experience in meditation is the best you can do so to speak. Otherwise, you give your power to substances, gurus, and other stuff. Meditation practice is easier to let go since it involves only the body, silent place... Good luck, my friend ?

[Wilhelm44]

20 minutes ago, allislove said:

Investigate the direct experience. Thinking arises... "What is the best way to find the source of "I"-thinking?" for example... notice that for thinking to arise there should be existence that switch on the thinking and everything else... notice that thinking arises in you in the same way as sound of bird singing for example... notice that it is you playing with yourself, pretending that you should find the source of "I"-thinking.

Wow, thank you, that's magical 

[allislove]

@Wilhelm44