Pertinent Question on taxation on billionares.

[captainamerica]

1 hour ago, Epikur said:

 

That  is what the aristocracy in France thought as well before they ended up in a bad place. 

The biggest angst of the rich is when the poor decide to come for them.

 

This is a kind of insight that Leo allows??

Misunderstanding a situation by 100-1000x.

 

 

Not unexpected from a conspiracy theorist though. 

[captainamerica]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Lol

As if they would even give 1% unless it was taken from them by force.

@Leo Gura Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, Ray Dalio, Jack Dorsey etc. are ready and asking.

You are straw-manning my argument as it is suiting your agenda based on your lack of complex systems understanding which require mathematicians in universities to decipher.

Lack of a general proper understanding of money is one of the major factors in the minds of the super rich in virtually all fields, creating fear in them. Can't say about wall st. rich.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

You sure make a good shill for the rich. They would happily pay you money to spread your ideas.

You sure make good straw-mans, as long as it suits your agenda. Nice way to deflect a good point.

Intention does not determine agenda, competency and understanding do. 

Edited July 8, 2021 by captainamerica

[captainamerica]

48 minutes ago, Opo said:

Where is the line between these two things? 

Is Donald Trump self made? 

... 

Donald Trump is already known to inherit it. 

Is there a better, nuanced example? 

48 minutes ago, Opo said:

Is someone who's parents payed for tutors and a good school self made? 

 

Education of millions can be funded from higher taxation alone. Not about 100 percent tax needed for it. 

Do you have volunteers or experts and political leaders in the democratic party to do it?

So many things would have been done if the US govt. was not lazy. Why straw-man and blame it on one group? That is a second-rate understanding. It requires effort to learn this. Not some YT or Reddit browsing.

Is someone like Einstein who had better genetics in IQ self-made? Is someone like Steve Jobs who used to get insights from intuition self-made? Is some like your favorite Hollywood actor who won the genetic lottery self-made? Is someone whose friend let him couch surf for 10 bucks after he risked and lost everything for his idea self-made?

The prob. with these questions is that it requires a very nuanced understanding in order to answer them, otherwise, it is very easy to straw-man them. Like an active minefield, just one uncalculated breath on it and boom.

Edited July 8, 2021 by captainamerica

[Epikur]

This would help too:

 

Quote

Also, unlike North America or Europe, there is little in the way of a billionaire class living ostentatiously wealthy lifestyles. There are, of course, rich people in Japan, but they tend to live in the same communities as everyone else, not in mansions on a hill or in remote gated districts. Flaunting wealth is simply not socially acceptable in this country which takes egalitarianism and mutual cooperation seriously.

In his view, Japanese populism has been constrained by the fact that the nation’s social safety net – like its national pension programme, unemployment benefits, and national health insurance programme – has been well maintained, meaning that there is not much dire poverty in Japan, or at least not many visible manifestations of such poverty.
 

https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2021/6/10/why-is-populism-so-unpopular-in-japan

[captainamerica]

@Epikur Best way to research is on Reddit, YT and Aljazeera, Right ?!

https://wwd.com/fashion-news/fashion-scoops/rolls-royce-hermes-custom-phantom-car-japanese-fashion-billionaire-zozotown-1234811234/

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2014/09/29/business/billionaire-mikitani-builds-new-tokyo-house-luxury-prices-gain/

.....

Do you want 50 more counter-examples?

Edited July 8, 2021 by captainamerica

[Epikur]

1 minute ago, captainamerica said:

@Epikur Best way to research is on Reddit, YT and Aljazeera, Right ?!

.....

Do you want 50 more counter-examples?

Yes give me an article that says that the japanese rich are as flashy as the americans.

Something like that:

 

Quote

Japan's rich: acutely aware of their wealth and not flashy with it

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/10/10/business/economy-business/japans-rich-acutely-aware-wealth-not-flashy/

[captainamerica]

@Epikur Okay, Jack. 10,000-15,000 sq feet of mansions, Rolls Royces, and sports cars, Vacations and first-class flights, even private jets. But at least they don't flash it because an article on my internet research told me so! Also, we have so much freedom to earn wealth, but those who earn it are Aristocrats from the France era! Reddit research.

[captainamerica]

8 minutes ago, Epikur said:

Yes give me an article that says that the japanese rich are as flashy as the americans.

Something like that:

 

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/10/10/business/economy-business/japans-rich-acutely-aware-wealth-not-flashy/

https://www.businessinsider.com/tadashi-yanai-net-worth-house-richest-person-japan-life-photos-2019-3

Not living huh! 

"They don't build houses" according to your article.

[Epikur]

4 minutes ago, captainamerica said:

@Epikur Okay, Jack. 10,000-15,000 sq feet of mansions, Rolls Royces, and sports cars, Vacations and first-class flights, even private jets. But at least they don't flash it because an article on my internet research told me so! Also, we have so much freedom to earn wealth, but those who earn it are Aristocrats from the France era! Reddit research.

Bring an article that invalidates what the article says. 

[captainamerica]

This is a psychological trap. You fell into it.

Wanna know the reason for this?

https://twitter.com/ramit/status/1366518969276846081

Read this thread. And contemplate on it.

[Epikur]

5 minutes ago, captainamerica said:

This is a psychological trap. You fell into it.

Wanna know the reason for this?

https://twitter.com/ramit/status/1366518969276846081

Read this thread. And contemplate on it.

Accept you were wrong. Japanese rich are not flashy as americans. You might recognise this is not reddit. It is about Taiwan:

https://www.businessinsider.com/living-as-a-millionaire-in-taipei-taiwan-homes-lifestyle-photos-2019-5
 

 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Epikur

[Opo]

1 hour ago, captainamerica said:

Donald Trump is already known to inherit it. 

What if he made a billion more. 

1 hour ago, captainamerica said:

Is there a better, nuanced example? 

Education of millions can be funded from higher taxation alone. Not about 100 percent tax needed for it. 

Do you have volunteers or experts and political leaders in the democratic party to do it?

So many things would have been done if the US govt. was not lazy. Why straw-man and blame it on one group? That is a second-rate understanding. It requires effort to learn this. Not some YT or Reddit browsing.

Is someone like Einstein who had better genetics in IQ self-made? Is someone like Steve Jobs who used to get insights from intuition self-made? Is some like your favorite Hollywood actor who won the genetic lottery self-made? Is someone whose friend let him couch surf for 10 bucks after he risked and lost everything for his idea self-made?

The prob. with these questions is that it requires a very nuanced understanding in order to answer them, otherwise, it is very easy to straw-man them. Like an active minefield, just one uncalculated breath on it and boom.

Yea I'm out. 

[Karmadhi]

Does Jeff Bezos really deserve having 200 billion dollars in his name? Did he work as much as millions of his employees combined? No body is saying he should not be rewarded more than someone stacking boxes in Amazon warehouses, however the amount of money he makes is ridicioulous. No reason for Jeff Bezos not to have 20 million in name and the other 199 billion distributed more fairly to the millions of underpaid workers that do 99.99999 percent of the actual work.

[Danioover9000]

@captainamerica

4 hours ago, captainamerica said:

@Epikur Oh! a holy lone data point of a conspiracy theorist.

 

 

   LOL this is why conspiracy theories are too OP for logic and understanding: they are intuitional forces of nature.

   

   The real issue is that mankind at large has little to weak AF vision and visualization skills such that they can't even consider the possibility of overcoming any kind of obstacles, including financial ones. Also, they are not ready for such a radical change. 100 taxation rate on billionaires? This requires so many changes to consciousness and developments of infrastructures such that people don't hurt themselves during the process. It's really easy for a few manipulative figures to turn this change into a similar event with the formation of the soviet union and have the masses go wild.

   We'll have to see what happens when A.I and A.G.I are complex enough.

   

[JosephKnecht]

20 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Does Jeff Bezos really deserve having 200 billion dollars in his name? Did he work as much as millions of his employees combined? No body is saying he should not be rewarded more than someone stacking boxes in Amazon warehouses, however the amount of money he makes is ridicioulous. No reason for Jeff Bezos not to have 20 million in name and the other 199 billion distributed more fairly to the millions of underpaid workers that do 99.99999 percent of the actual work.

Wealth should be capped at 1 billion.

Once someone becomes a billionaire, we should throw a party and name a train station after them.

They have won capitalism. 

Everything over the billion of wealth then should go into the name of the employees that made someone a billionaire. 

 

 

[Danioover9000]

@Karmadhi

22 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Does Jeff Bezos really deserve having 200 billion dollars in his name? Did he work as much as millions of his employees combined? No body is saying he should not be rewarded more than someone stacking boxes in Amazon warehouses, however the amount of money he makes is ridicioulous. No reason for Jeff Bezos not to have 20 million in name and the other 199 billion distributed more fairly to the millions of underpaid workers that do 99.99999 percent of the actual work.

   I'm more curious to see if Bazos would still keep working his position without pay.

[Epikur]

3 minutes ago, JosephKnecht said:

Wealth should be capped at 1 billion.

Once someone becomes a billionaire, we should throw a party and name a train station after them.

They have won capitalism. 

Everything over the billion of wealth then should go into the name of the employees that made someone a billionaire. 

 

 

Agreed. For every extra billion a train station should be named after him and the extra money taken away. So he can still be in competition with other billionaires and brag.

[captainamerica]

10 hours ago, Epikur said:

Accept you were wrong. Japanese rich are not flashy as americans. You might recognise this is not reddit. It is about Taiwan:

https://www.businessinsider.com/living-as-a-millionaire-in-taipei-taiwan-homes-lifestyle-photos-2019-5
 

 

First, you fell into a common psychological trap. I asked you to contemplate on it as it is used against you for manipulation, like right now, but you are not getting it.

Second, this is stupid technical minutia. They are living amazing lifestyles but you won’t look beyond your own article's definition of it.

[captainamerica]

10 hours ago, Opo said:

What if he made a billion more. 

Quote

There is a natural difference between inheriting a billion dollars from your parents and getting a world-class education with your parent's money. Every child receiving the same opportunity will require physical changes in society, including more wealth creation, for 2000 years straight.

Come on bro, I stand for higher taxation, education reform, and other things too.

Asking for whole wealth is one of the ways to steal as of today. Leo's life purpose is getting fulfilled by visioning 300-500 years from now. He can vision it daily and live in that context as well, like a philosopher. This does not mean people who will emotionally follow through and strawman whole groups are philosophers.

In this context, the sense of right and wrong is not absolute but determined by the time in which you are alive. Not only because of people's low conscious thinking as Leo would have you believe. It is because of the very physical development of mankind for the most part. External hardware limitations in the form of collective wealth (best studied by economists and people who study technological growth of the society).

 

[captainamerica]

9 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

Does Jeff Bezos really deserve having 200 billion dollars in his name? Did he work as much as millions of his employees combined? No body is saying he should not be rewarded more than someone stacking boxes in Amazon warehouses, however the amount of money he makes is ridicioulous. No reason for Jeff Bezos not to have 20 million in name and the other 199 billion distributed more fairly to the millions of underpaid workers that do 99.99999 percent of the actual work.

@Karmadhi

There are many flaws with your argument:

1. The inverse pyramid of paying the workers, farmers and teachers due to a more literal physical labour does not work in real life as it collapses the economy. Reduces the food production and everything else by 10-100x easily. (Study economists, not conspiracy theorist on the internet) Like marxist theory which is good on paper but had failed in real life implementations. This inverse pyramid is against the foundation of how economy works. A better alternative is higher taxation and using it for social security for the groups you care about.
2. Your proposals, (and similar ones to yours) will act as cannibalizing influences on the whole businesses and founders you are talking about. What you are asking from them is to self-cannibalize, not pay taxes. This destroys the source of tax or income you are using for employees itself in some time.  Seems good only on surface level. 
3. You live in Nepal, I believe. You are probably stage Blue the way talked before. It is easy to not understand how Orange works and straight fall into the trap of groupthink of "Green". This is not the same as mastering Orange and being Green. This leads to unhealthy consequences in the real world even when the ideas seem the same on the surface.
4. You are wrong about 99.99999 percent work as well. This is inverse pyramid thinking. It is a common fantasy. If implemented the whole economy will crash today. Practically, it leads to insights for worker rights after contemplation. What you are thinking is less than half-baked and common fantasy. This is what happens when one skips from Blue to Green directly, not understanding value creation. Of which there are many but they try to hide this fact persistently. I don't believe that you are trying to hide it though.

I agree with you that they deserve a wage hike.

Edited July 9, 2021 by captainamerica