Questions about mass compliance and blind obedience to orders of wearing a mask

[Brandon Nankivell]

States in Australia have been in put in lockdown again, and it's been ordered that wearing masks is mandatory.

• How effective do you believe masks are for helping to stop the spread of Covid?
• Do you think that mass compliance to this order (and the residual effects caused) is enough of a concern that it could lead to a dictatorship or some form of authoritarian rule within the next few years?
• Is it enough of a concern that may make sense for a minority (let's say 1-5%) not to comply with the order, in order to reduce the likelihood of supposed creeping authoritarianism, whilst still maintaining a high capacity of mask-wearers to help stop the spread of Covid?

[Preety_India]

10 minutes ago, Brandon Nankivell said:

• How effective do you believe masks are for helping to stop the spread of Covid?

Very effective along with staying home and social distancing can halt transmission effectively.

 

Quote

• Do you think that mass compliance to this order (and the residual effects caused) is enough of a concern that it could lead to a dictatorship or some form of authoritarian rule within the next few years?

Not at all. This is just a public service announcement and cooperation from public is necessary 

Stage Green cooperates with the government when it's absolutely necessary.

Citizens owe their duties to the government just as the government owes its services to the citizens.

This is called civil responsibility rather than dictatorship.

Quote

• Is it enough of a concern that may make sense for a minority (let's say 1-5%) not to comply with the order, in order to reduce the likelihood of supposed creeping authoritarianism, whilst still maintaining a high capacity of mask-wearers to help stop the spread of Covid?

Even a small number of people who do not follow mask wearing mandates can be quite harmful because this is a highly contagious disease and it is a pandemic, not something to be dismissed lightly.

It's important to respect those with low immunity. So even a small percentage of Rebellious people can cause rapid transmission affecting vulnerable groups 

When obedience is absolutely necessary, you can't call it blind obedience or authoritarianism.

Protective authority is not the same as dictatorship.

Protective authority is called one word, LEADERSHIP.

Try to understand the difference and don't confuse one for another 

 

Edited July 1, 2021 by Preety_India

[Tanz]

2 hours ago, Brandon Nankivell said:

How effective do you believe masks are for helping to stop the spread of Covid?

There has not been an official study done in a lab to test this.  

 

2 hours ago, Brandon Nankivell said:

Do you think that mass compliance to this order (and the residual effects caused) is enough of a concern that it could lead to a dictatorship or some form of authoritarian rule within the next few years?

They have done social experiments way before covid where they found if you put hand sanitizer at a workers desk, that they have an increased likelihood of voting conservative.  If people perceive a threat they are going to vote for someone safe compared to choosing a radical alternative.  Bush won the second election because America was in the middle of a war.  
Many people question the government when they are asking people to be considerate to other people while most of their actions in the past and present show they are considerate to often the wealthy and powerful.  Covid has been one of the largest if not the largest transfer of wealth in history, so its easy for someone to be conspiratorial.  Its like a father that is beating a mother all the time while asking his son to be nice and kind to his sister.  

2 hours ago, Brandon Nankivell said:

Is it enough of a concern that may make sense for a minority (let's say 1-5%) not to comply with the order, in order to reduce the likelihood of supposed creeping authoritarianism, whilst still maintaining a high capacity of mask-wearers to help stop the spread of Covid?

Vaccines, heard immunity even without vaccines, we will all be fine given time.  Our species is too clever and selfish to lose to nature.  Our biggest threat is and has been ourselves.  

Personally, I wear a mask outside, not because I am scared of spreading the virus or getting covid, but because it just makes people around me feel safe.  Its better to entertain a hysterical person than to create a confrontation with them or challenge them in any way.

The authorities arent giving us useful data like the average age of mortality and underlying conditions with those that died, more information would be a way to develop trust and reduce any anxiety or increase caution if there is any.  

Edited July 1, 2021 by Tanz

[Leo Gura]

How effective is the authoritarian mass compliance of wearing pants?

Why are you such a sheep? Just walk around with your dick hanging out.

[Danioover9000]

@Brandon Nankivell

On 01/07/2021 at 1:57 AM, Brandon Nankivell said:

States in Australia have been in put in lockdown again, and it's been ordered that wearing masks is mandatory.

• How effective do you believe masks are for helping to stop the spread of Covid?
• Do you think that mass compliance to this order (and the residual effects caused) is enough of a concern that it could lead to a dictatorship or some form of authoritarian rule within the next few years?
• Is it enough of a concern that may make sense for a minority (let's say 1-5%) not to comply with the order, in order to reduce the likelihood of supposed creeping authoritarianism, whilst still maintaining a high capacity of mask-wearers to help stop the spread of Covid?

1. It is really effective for containing, not limited to covid, any kind of ilness that has you coughing and transmitting the sickness in the air. Also is good for hiding uglier parts of your face.

2. Authoritarian like, but no not really. More like a cyborg society opposite of dictatorship, but until we realised an advanced AGI that develops like sky net, we don't have much to worry.

[ValiJustus]

Good question, about mask effectivity is rather complicated to explain, it is to some degree, but not completely.

It is dangerous for informing people that mask is 100% complete virus proof, because (1) it is not, (2) I have seen lots of patients or people gather in close contact and closed room because they believe that they have complete immunity from simply use mask, and (3) people often use mask incorrectly or reuse without clean it first.

It safe to imagine it like an additional layer of protection, like extra defense point, not cheat shield. If its impenetrable why do you think those physicians use those extra suit dealing with covid patients? 

To resort to authoritarian gov. is quite extreme though, using mask is not a burden at all, evenmore that now it is easily procured, its not early 2020, come on. Lol. 

Well some background, I am a MD (although since 2020 I only deal with med students), my wife too, and my parents and grandparents (yeah asian family thing probably lol) during med training, especially clinical years/clerkship it was apparent how usefull those extra safety equipment, I'm not in US, in my country (third country), tuberculosis, other pneumoniae, and lots of infections are still the head to head in patient count with non-infections disease (such diabetes and heart failure). There are lot of cases of med student and residents got infected from patients (or colleagues) and most of it quite severe (since we have to deal with multi drug resistant variant that not curable with usual antibiotics or antiviral drugs), most of it because the negligence of proper safety measure, like hand washing, proper sterilisation of surgical equipment, or simply by using mask and handscoen (gloves), so by knowing that, we automatically and gladly use those equipment and deploy extra measure like no touching and head straight to bathroom  when we got home, and not using accessories during clinical hour since it can be a transmitor of infectious agents. So with our knowledge and our fear (of getting infected), I happily seeing this pandemic as a training for non medic for practicing safety measure, like at least use mask and hand wash.

Using mask is far easier though and no-brainer though, compared to those people (in my country) who are hunting for ventilators, hospital beds and, lately, oxygen. There are now even a recommendation to use double mask for extra crowded place or dangerous zone (like in red-black marked zone and hospital). Oh and compared to medical personnel using uncomfortable special suit during clinical hour. Yeah I strongly support the use of mask. 

Anyway, regardless the mask regulations, it is easier to build a authoritative regime during chaotic time. Like in teaching, less conscious institute may deploy more forcefull measures or absolute rules, but more conscious one will lead and motivate their student to better themselves, to actively study and do more safety oriented action for example. Since more forcefull measure will bring more hate and resistance toward authority, and angry people usually doesnt learn much.

Then again my country most of people are below SD orange, so the knowledge by itself will probably wont be enough, so gov regulation which may seems authoritative may be needed (it proven not yet effective sadly). And people start to distrust the gov and rioting which again make the regulation less obeyed, which cause it to be less effective and infection spread further.

Yeah it is a possibility that authoritative tune that initially rose from cumulative panics and fears will continue long after the pandemic passed, since the low concious populist and ideological movement started even before pandemic in our country and world wide.

It just the way of progress from blue-orange oriented toward more orange-green one, (anyway I seen more of those greener stage in newer med student, I'm so happy)

The health care system are severely exhausted during this 1+ years marathon. People in our gov is not developed enough to make long term plan so, I can only wait. 

Oh yeah the third question, whether 1-5% people neglect the regulation may affect the community, theoretically, it might be a place for viral mutation (newer variant that render our current vaccine useless), or simply increase the chance of infection, (remember mask is not 100%), and if they got the virus, they will increase the hospital burden and lessen the activity of curing other non covid patient.

Gov. rules is not only for those 1-5%, will those 95% use mask if its not forced by the gov.? yeah it depends on how developed the people, and (more) people not using mask may persuade or discourage those 95% already mask-user to give up their mask too.

Its easy, why not, just like wash your hand, unless u have special medical need though Lol. 

[lmfao]

@Brandon Nankivell Well, I don't wear my mask unless I have to. Which means I wear it when I go into some shops/buildings, otherwise they'll kick you out. I'm not going to lie that I'm medically exempt, so I wear the mask. 

Some people are used to it and feel physically comfortable with wearing their masks even when they're walking alone outdoors. That's not me. Maybe you can look like a ninja if you cover your mouth in a cool way but otherwise I don't get why people do that. 

I kinda dislike just putting on the mask for show alone. For example you see people wearing a mask but they don't cover their nose. They want to pretend to be wearing a mask.

Even if covid becomes a small threat, masks will become a part of the culture forever probably. Which is makes me go "oh noooooooo" 

Quote

Do you think that mass compliance to this order (and the residual effects caused) is enough of a concern that it could lead to a dictatorship or some form of authoritarian rule within the next few years?

No,  but maybe you can learn something about human psychology and culture from how masks are worn and debated.

People just "go with the flow". Some will have NPC reasoning on deck and ready to use. 

I intellectually understand this idea that making people more obedient to the government will make them more likely to accept authoritarian rule, but in this situation the theory doesn't resonate with me or induce anything from me. I'm just a blank and have nothing to say. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by lmfao

[Brandon Nankivell]

On 01/07/2021 at 11:04 AM, Preety_India said:

Very effective along with staying home and social distancing can halt transmission effectively.

 

Not at all. This is just a public service announcement and cooperation from public is necessary 

Stage Green cooperates with the government when it's absolutely necessary.

Citizens owe their duties to the government just as the government owes its services to the citizens.

This is called civil responsibility rather than dictatorship.

Even a small number of people who do not follow mask wearing mandates can be quite harmful because this is a highly contagious disease and it is a pandemic, not something to be dismissed lightly.

It's important to respect those with low immunity. So even a small percentage of Rebellious people can cause rapid transmission affecting vulnerable groups 

When obedience is absolutely necessary, you can't call it blind obedience or authoritarianism.

Protective authority is not the same as dictatorship.

Protective authority is called one word, LEADERSHIP.

Try to understand the difference and don't confuse one for another 

 

Great point. Recently been listening to Leo's conscious politics videos which have been good.

[Brandon Nankivell]

On 01/07/2021 at 0:25 PM, Leo Gura said:

How effective is the authoritarian mass compliance of wearing pants?

Why are you such a sheep? Just walk around with your dick hanging out.