Looking for landlord relationship feedback and perspectives

[Matt23]

Rant:

So I'm looking for some feedback about what other people think about this situation and what they think is the best and wisest way to treat the relationship.  And also just any thoughts too.

I rent a room from a women in her place.  We both live together.  In terms of Spiral Dynamics, she's like high Orange low Green (a bit toxic and ideological I'd say).  In terms of the Cook-Greuter model I'd peg her at Achiever and maybe a bit beyond.  Though, she's not what I'd call a top performer or necessarily the healthiest personality.  She's nice enough.  I often get triggered by the things she says and the radio she listens to and just feel so much that she's also very tied to valuing and being attached to academia, science, and that whole thing.  I feel like I often hold back my true beliefs and values and ideas since I feel she'll just disagree and will put it down since she's, in my view, very much in the perhaps toxic green ideology. 

Anyways, I just often feel so negative with her and don't have many pleasant or enjoyable experiences.  She's like nice enough and reasonable enough, and wouldn't I don't think just kick me out.  Like she values kindness and stuff.  But I just often feel so triggered and angry with her.  

For example, when I told her the other day "I was listening to this podcast (Ben and Charlie) and they were talking about how there's so much info out on the internet that it's hard to know what's true."  This to me is such an obvious and well thought out subject.  She said "I disagree." And then went on to say something about "I think you're listening to some bad podcasts and that it's dangerous to question science, like people like Steven Crowder."  That's not verbatim and obviously I could be totally misinterpreting what she was saying.  But I got angry cuz she just automatically lumped me in with people like Steven Crowder, doesn't have any idea of who I listen to (people like Leo, Daniel Schmachtenberger, Jordan Hall, and other stage yellow peeps).  I just hated how she was obviously so attached and indoctrinated into that ideology of "If you criticize science at all you're bad" and like, I dunno, maybe I just felt like she was totally dismissing my P.O.V.  

Like, she's not all bad and is quite reasonable and accommodating and even feels bad when I tell her about feelings of pain or anger I've experienced in relation to her.  It's just these seeming value-system and ideological differences that seem to get in the way.  

Like we disagree on so much that I just feel I can't say any of my opinions or share with her without her disagreeing and having an argument and me feeling fucking frustrated.  

I just feel/felt like I have to "submit" to her ideas n such without having a say or being able to get what I believe acknowledged or something.  I feel so pained and pissed off and hatred towards he that I even hit myself later the pain and hate was so big.  

What do you guys think?

Obviously I don't enjoy this relationship.  

I'm obviously feeling pretty shitty.  But I wonder, what would you do in this situation or type of relationship?  

I also fully see how this is probably my own attachments to ideologies n such and being at a different stage of development and value-system.  Perhaps lower.  I dunno, I wanted to get that out and see what people thought at the risk of looking bad.  

Edited June 26, 2021 by Matt23

[Opo]

She's to dense to have a discussion with and if you try to change her mind again the same thing will repeat. 

Just cut her out as much as you can. 

[PlayOnWords]

Utilise Stage Yellow and meet her where she is at, see the morsels of truth in her perspective. Also, Stage Yellow can be good at injecting "seeds of doubt" in subtle, tactile ways.

Realise that everybody is trying their best. This may help when you feel frustrated with her ideas.

 

[Nahm]

@Matt23

That she is your landlord isn’t relevant. But it is to you, which is why you led with it, and aren’t seeing why that’s triggering. Yet. I bet she doesn’t “rant”. 

Everything you’re feeling, namely, that you don’t want to continue or repeat feeling… are your perspectives about her. You are not feeling her perspectives about you. 

And the perspectives about her which aren’t resonating, aren’t resonating due to the underlying indirect beliefs about yourself. 

Make the distinction… if she or someone else physical harms or hurts you, then someone else is behind your being physically harmed or hurt. If someone else is not, the suffering is ‘in the lens’, amidst your own thoughts, perspectives & views, and there are beliefs about yourself to let go of. When this is missed, there is a false narrative that others should behave in a certain way to accommodate your beliefs or perspectives. 

To the extent you self-love, is the extent which you peacefully talk with anyone, un-rattled & appreciative of the conversation for what it is, and the person for who they are, as they are now - free of judgements, conditions & projections. 

They key is peace with who you are, as you are, now. Put another way, the truth is that there is nothing wrong with you. 

In a way, she might represent a yet-realization… that conceptualization doesn’t amount to much actuality of change in regard to changes you desire, both in your life & inner world harmony… but aligning thoughts / perspectives with feeling, changes everything. 

When people react to negative inner talk angrily by outwardly hurting someone else, this is easy for anyone to see, because it’s visual. When people react to negative inner talk angrily toward themself, this is not readily seen by most as it is empathically felt. The key point is these scenarios have the same root - thoughts about oneself which are not true and therefore feel, ‘not true’. 

In the analogous sense that when a sprinkler expresses sincerely, the expression is that of the water… when we express earnestly, the expression is that of Truth. It feels amazingly awesome to express honestly, to ‘come clean’ with ourselves. It illuminates our discordant beliefs and is simultaneously the action of relinquishing them. Expressing each emotion up the scale is a simple, fruitful way to go about this. 

[Jacob Morres]

i dont have advice but i feel for u lol. i have been on both sides

she's definietely marginalizing your opinion though, unconsciously i think because of her conditioned scientific mind. i think maybe you could bring it to her how u feel about it. i dont think you could change her mind but she might be more respectful to your beliefs. she has growing to do this area but maybe you could also assert your values and your feelings while simultaneously exploring the trigger and working through it. your feelings matter bro

i do have super scientifically oriented friend but he just kind of "accepts" my beliefs. probs thinks im a little crazy for some things that i do but i dont get a sense of judgement or criticism from him 

Edited July 2, 2021 by Jacob Morres

[Matt23]

I addressed this issue with her.  Haha phew... fears overcome.  

Lots to unpack. 

Biggest lesson I'm "circling" around right now is how, in disagreements and polarized situations between people(s), attachment and love to one's P.O.V. leads one to perhaps be over-defensive about that P.O.V. and thus when critiques are brought against that P.O.V. they're interpreted as far worse and less reasonable (i.e., they are quickly and perhaps almost automatically straw-manned) then they actually are (i.e., leading to misunderstanding the other side).  Thus a fight ensues since the other side now feels totally misunderstood and hurt and angry since the other has demonized their self-image and side and placed a negative self-image upon them (through the means of the straw-manning).  Thus a fight ensues.  

But, through our conversation, we got to a place which felt way less triggered.  This seemed to come about from clearing up what we meant by things.  Like, for example, I think my biggest issue was her saying that I was "saying science is wrong".  Which was a total mischaracterization of my point.  My point was that humans use science, science is a man-made thing, thus science is fallible and also isn't an absolute truth.  This clarification seemed to really make me feel better.  She also said she acknowledges how she did that.  I'm not sure how much I felt better from her saying that in particular.  

But ya.  Right now, a few minutes after the disagreement, I feel a bit like staying with her as I feel there's still "air to clear" between us and I don't want to just abandon her and make her feel unsafe from me just leaving after that fight.  Like, I acknowledge we may disagree, but like we can still get along and respect each other and be there.  Or something. Like it's about balancing the people-feelings with the truth-logic-sayings.  I dunno.  This last part is a bit more vague to me and am working through clarifying it as I write.  Like I also sense there's still something not quite right about this and what was said (or left unsaid).  Like, I dunno... hmmm... I dunno, maybe it does have something to do with the fact that she's my landlord.  I dunno.  Maybe there is something to that.  I feel like she doesn't acknowledge that she's not right and that I'm right and that ,,,, haha ,... i dunno. maybe that's it.  I dunno. .... hmm like i just feel like she's not being honest with me or me with her and that that is keeping us from connecting and getting back to a place of cnonection and safety in the relationship between each other.  Like there's something in the way. 

Currently, I'm feeling a bit of fear-tension as I feel like we have a slightly antagonistic relationship now (us-vs.-them vibes) and like ya, we're not sharing or there for each other and that something's in the way.  I'm unsure how to proceed.  Whether I should just focus on letting it go and being with her amicably, or continuing the conversation to clear it up.  Even if that means just getting to a place where we feel "good" and safe with each other and not like we're "separated" by some us-them dynamics.  I dunno.  Like, something in me is feeling like overcoming the us-them dynamics, on my part, would be perhaps impossible without being understood properly and not having us be at odds with each others' way of seeing each other's P.O.V..  Which would include me seeing her too.  So I dunno.   

I digress.  

Anyways, would love to hear your thoughts on the last bit.  Or any bit.

Cheers

[Nahm]

@Matt23

All of what you’re experiencing is ‘on your part’, though it admittedly seems like the product of you & her, or the relationship. When you change the lens of the flashlight, all imagery on the wall miraculously changes.