None of my spiritual experiences so far have demolished materialism

[Javfly33]

Here's my "curriculum":

I have done

- 5 Lsd small-medium dose

- 1 5-MeO-DMT trip inhaled

- 1 Changa trip

- +10 5-MeO-DMT plugged contemplating about reality 

- +5 Several other trips of unknown psychedelic (mdma, ketamine, etc) with intention of self development/Spirituality and not recreation

- +150 Hours Yoga

- + 100 Hours meditation

- +30 Hours self inquiry/mindfulness meditation

- +30 Hours Watching non duality/actualized clips

 

On top of that, I've always had a metaphysical inclination towards knowing what is Reality.

 

STILL haven't realized Truth. Yes I've had a bunch of weird, nerve racking, heart breaking, joyful, ecstatic realizations, BUT I can't put my hand on the fire that Non duality is the Truth and we are one. I even can't say that materialism is false. 

I basically have beliefs about spirituality and "hopes" that death is not real and union is the Truth, but it's no different than a religious man.

I need some advice because either I'm doing something wrong or there's a lot of people bullshitting themselves and not being honest about Truth realization.

Right now I'm focusing back 100% on stage orange stuff but anyways I thought sharing this would be interesting to know if you guys relate to it.

[mandyjw]

There's a kind of reality in an illusion. Something has to have some sort of inherent reality in order to be truly disproved. Maybe less hope in the methods and more sheer curiosity and enjoyment of whatever magic is unfolding right now is enough in and of itself. 

[RMQualtrough]

I doubt it will do it if 5 does not, but, try n,n-DMT freebased (not Changa).

In my experience I could replicate nondual trips with high dose acid + DMT smoked on top of it.

I understood that the drug had affected my brain, but that fact didn't carry any meaning. It's like, yes my brain is me, yes a drug altered the brain, no it has no bearing on the realization whatsoever.

There are some serious issues with Materialism. Some of the truths are factual even from a Materialist paradigm. E.g. a person must realize they arose FROM the universe and are a manifestation of that.

I can show many things regarding the apparent truth are more logically sound than materialism.

Edited June 18, 2021 by RMQualtrough

[Shin]

This isn't a sprint, it's a marathon my dude.

Don't be interested in having results, just be genuinely interested in knowing what's true.

If you aren't right now, that's fine just do something else with your life, there is lots of stuff to embody in life, not just enlightenment.

[Adamq8]

There is certainly a reason why the majority of people believes in the materialist paradigm.

It does make sense at the "shallow" level of reality.

But when you start looking into evidence and use logic and reason on the materialistic paradigm it kinda breaks down fast, and then meditate, become aware and just be in the moment. 

Just let everything be exactly how it is without trying anything.

Let thoughts arise and feelings and do not force anything.

Investigate reality without a non dual paradigm or materialism, IE without assumptions. 

Non duality might be wrong too.

Just be and Investigate scientific evidence for idealism, I suggest you start with bernado kastrup and essentia foundation on Youtube but dont Just assume that it is true, just listen, and then Investigate your direct experience without a need to have something to happend.

Eventually there might be a clean break down of your prior assumptions and then Reality shines through and a remembering happens, but it has always been the same it is just that has been hidden by alot of thoughts/beliefs/paradigms.

 

[gettoefl]

sorry to have to burst in on your nice dream and dis illusion you but here is what jed has to say

[Nahm]

@Javfly33

Aw my man I feel for ya. Kinda going at it the hard way. You’ve got to align your behaviors and actions with your intention. Feels great and is effortless. 

[Carl-Richard]

I didn't start cracking before 1k meditation hours ?

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

I basically have beliefs about spirituality and "hopes" that death is not real and union is the Truth, but it's no different than a religious man.

Death becomes real very fast when you realize there is no you anymore ?

[Javfly33]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

@Javfly33

Aw my man I feel for ya. Kinda going at it the hard way. You’ve got to align your behaviors and actions with your intention. Feels great and is effortless. 

@Nahm Yeah. And anyway since "I" can't be Enlightened it has been reveiled there's nothing for me to achieve in terms of "getting enlightened" that's why I'm going self development again and forgetting Spirituality for a long time

[hoodrow trillson]

27 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

@Nahm Yeah. And anyway since "I" can't be Enlightened it has been reveiled there's nothing for me to achieve in terms of "getting enlightened" that's why I'm going self development again and forgetting Spirituality for a long time

I don't want you to begin to "do" this but:  some people have become enlightened or awakened when they threw all the spiritual bullshit away.  Like completely gave up and it hit them.

I believe Mooji realized it this way too

[Consilience]

Mystical experiences aren’t needed to see through materialism. I actually discovered materialism was bullshit before finding actualized.org. The only reason I found actualized.org was because I was trying to find ANY mainstream philosophy on materialism vs. idealism; I was so shocked at how my philosophy of mind professor and science teachers in University were just completely ignoring the hard problem of consciousness. Accidentally found the “brains don’t exist” video... 

Understanding why materialism is bullshit requires you to realize it’s a belief. Then this requires you to understand that the nature of all beliefs is that they are false. ALWAYS. This requires an extremely high level understanding of epistemology and metaphysics. You have to see that it’s impossible for logic and reason to justify the belief in an external, physical world. 

Again mystical experiences aren’t needed. Not only are they not needed, they wont do the deconstructing for you. Contemplate either while sober or while in the middle of a mystical experience. Deeply study the philosophy  of this stuff via Leo’s videos while grounded and sober. Recognize materialism is not inherent to experience, but is an existential assumption about the nature of experience. 

[Jodistrict]

A single dose of 5-meo permanently demolished materialism for me.   Then in the next year, my experiences and contemplation served to strengthen and reinforce my shift in perception.  Also, I wasn't seeking this out.  It was unexpected.

[roopepa]

4 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

BUT I can't put my hand on the fire that Non duality is the Truth and we are one. I even can't say that materialism is false. 

Where have you gotten this idea that materialism has any legitimacy to it whatsoever, that there is any point trying to disprove it, as if there was any debate on the matter in the first place?

Perhaps try to explain "materialism" and then this "idealism" as simply as possible. Write down exactly what you think they mean. Leave nothing out. Deconstruct both. Make them a bunch of thoughts with no actual basis whatsoever.

Have you read Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything?

Edited June 18, 2021 by roopepa

[Incognito]

A coin has two sides but without a mind to perceive the world, the world is nothing.

Mind = world

Edited June 18, 2021 by Incognito

[Javfly33]

22 minutes ago, roopepa said:

Where have you gotten this idea that materialism has any legitimacy to it whatsoever, that there is any point trying to disprove it, as if there was any debate on the matter in the first place?

Perhaps try to explain "materialism" and then this "idealism" as simply as possible. Write down exactly what you think they mean. Leave nothing out. Deconstruct both. Make them a bunch of thoughts with no actual basis whatsoever.

Have you read Jed McKenna's Theory of Everything?

That the chair in front of me is not me/us.

That's what I mean with materialism

[nistake]

@Javfly33 You perceive an object and you assign the label 'chair' to it. Okay, so far so good. What is it made of? Wood. Where does wood come from? From trees. Where do trees come from? From forests. What are forests and where do they come from? And so on...

This is just a random example, but if you contemplate this at great length, you'll definitely get some insights.

Also Adyashanti has a brilliant video where he explains oneness in an everyday language. Check it out:

 

 

[Leo Gura]

@Javfly33 How is it possible that with all those psychedelics you didn't realize the chair is you??

Sounds like you got a very dense baseline state of consciousness.

[Javfly33]

@Leo Gura I "realized" on 4-aco-dmt come up that I was literally the spoon I was moving with my fingers. That until now was the most clear non dual state I reached.

But what? Is "just" a state, insight,  realization, hallucination, feeling, or whatever.

It is not Truth.

If it was, I would have stopped playing the game. 

In the sober life the realization is that I am SEPARATE from the spoon and the spoon might exist outside of me.

And that separation is as real as the psychedelic state, sorry to break it to you.

It seems we have different goals of what Truth is. For me Truth must be always clear, not only in a meditative or psychedelic state.

[_Archangel_]

@Javfly33 bro, 
Step 1 - deliberately divide reality between raw experience and thoughs.
Step 2 - look that this division you just made up is the work of mind.
Every difference/division is mental activity.