Why this society?

[The Buddha]

I'm not usually interested at all in this topics, I'm more of a God-realized searcher. However I really have this question in my mind that due to my ignorance in this topic I cannot resolve. For me, all societies are like a game, now we play roman, now we play Babylonic, now feudalism, now communism, now capitalism. However, I was thinking about it in a higher perspective, what a bullshit game honestly. Honestly, who the fuck wants this society? What sense has to work this much? All this scientific (or whatever self-masturbation interest have society in it's time) non-sense? In the way that we all just could live a very simple, tranquil and happy life. Technology is an amazing tool but we could take life more chill, because in fact now technology allows us to do so. In the sense that, we can truly build the society of our dreams and we are in a cyclic wheel of suffering, running pleasure after pleasure and the system encourages that.

For then what an absolute disfunctional societies we have been creating, I mean as a game it's not a one I would ever play at least. We could say that Tibet or some parts of India at one time arrived at some decent games, but in general I'm really surprised and shocked. Maybe I'm projecting all this, maybe it's not what I would like society to be and I'm making up everything. But honestly, if we took humanity and make them build again society, would really anyone create this? Even close? Even remotely close?

Idk, hope that u could give some insights because at least for my own I have arrived to a dead spot. Where something is missing, to make at least a bit of sense of this profound disfunctionality of earth that we are always creating.

[Preety_India]

 

Society is all about survival. At the same time it's counterproductive to survival. 

Just imagine how many people died just because of society. 

It's a double edged sword. 

 

 

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by Preety_India

[Shin]

By thinking you're not part of society, you're actually participating by not helping.

You couldn't live without a society, you'd be fucking dead already.

[The Buddha]

2 hours ago, Shin said:

By thinking you're not part of society, you're actually participating by not helping.

You couldn't live without a society, you'd be fucking dead already.

Of course I am a part of society in fact that is the main reason of my interest. I feel great compassion for all being and of course to my fellow humans, is from that compassion that I help society and my brothers and sisters. However, while helping this insight is unavoidable. It's like a rock in the shoe that is the reason I wanted the insights of this subgroup of the forum.

[Leo Gura]

4 hours ago, The Buddha said:

In the way that we all just could live a very simple, tranquil and happy life.

You don't appreciate how difficult and burtal survival is. Watch some of my recent blog posts.

Your simple tranquil commune will be raped and pilaged by your neighbors as soon as they run out of food or women.

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Technology is an amazing tool but we could take life more chill because in fact now technology allows us to do so.

If we could we would.

Technology was created by the necessity and struggle to survive. To build and maintain technology requires never-ending labor and wage slavery.

Quote

In the sense that, we can truly build the society of our dreams

That is precisely what we are doing. But the problem is, no two people have the same dream. And creating that dream takes 100,000 years. And no matter how close you reach the dream, you will still not be happy.

Your ancestors would consider today's 1st world democracies paradises. Yet no one is happy in these paradises.

[The Buddha]

@Leo Gura

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Your simple tranquil commune will be raped and pilaged by your neighbors as soon as they run out of food or women.

I mean that is what usually happens but it is not a law. A very clear example is Tibet: It's one of the most cruel places to live. Every day u have to survive, u have the most harsh conditions and it is very common to die. Even so, a great compassion toward all being arose in all Tibetan people. So that everyone helped each other. So u have a real example where in one of the most cruel places in the world to live, a great civilization was born from compassion and love to the fellow humans.

 

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Technology was created by the necessity and struggle to survive. To build and maintain technology requires never-ending labor and wage slavery

It has always been like this, but does it truly has to be like this? Sorry, I can't buy that there isn't a much better way of creating, sustaining and transforming technology, without destroying the happiness of other beings.

 

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

That is precisely what we are doing. But the problem is, no two people have the same dream. And creating that dream takes 100,000 years. And no matter how close you reach the dream, you will still not be happy.

Wow, I strongly disagree. Sure that each one has it's own fantasy. But we all want the same, don't we? Love and peace. For a system that grants that and then let's peple do that dream that u talk about. So u are happy, u are joyfull then pursue whatever u desire or want to do with your time/life. Maybe I'm just saying crazy things but doesn't all this just sound normal? Like they way things should be. Not a fancy or crazy new society idea or whatever, but just a very natural state of living, within ourselves and towards humanity in harmony with mother earth.

 

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Your ancestors would consider today's 1st world democracies paradises. Yet no one is happy in these paradises.

For what they thought made them happy does not make happy one, as we can really see. For a change of scope is needed, in the individual and therefore reflected in the collective. But Jesus it shouldn't be that hard to create a reality where we all live more or less joyfull.

[Windappreciator]

What you mean is that we have the skills to create our own paradise already, but our minds keep us from using it that way.

I guess we could see psychology as a technological development of the psyche and group both under one category and see that there are deficiencies in this region.

But as it goes, I feel with you.

Edited June 7, 2021 by Windappreciator

[Shin]

Ok I totally misread again then ?

Read Spiral dynamics and the Ego development theory (the one from Susanne Cook Greuter).

Leo has videos about them.

It's easy to understand why society is how it is if you understand those models.

Edited June 7, 2021 by Shin

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, The Buddha said:

But we all want the same, don't we?

Not at all

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Love and peace.

Everyone has a different idea of love and peace.

One person's idea of love might be to rape you. BTW, Tibetan monks are notorious for raping young monk recruits.

[Preety_India]

10 hours ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

Rajneeshpuram was a sneak peek on how humans should live.

I thought same. Damn I miss that. 

 

[The Buddha]

@Shin

Yes, I've studied both in profoundity yet honestly they only made sense up to when I was in yellow and beggining of Turquoise, now is like I get it but they don't have much sense. It's like categories and those distinctions don't have much sense. The ego stages are more deep, however they miss the universal aspects that I talk about. It's like they are focused on what is different, which is in fact very important but what remains the same in all that developement is for me they most important aspects in fact. However, if I changed opinion once it can happen again, so I'm very open to be just stages that society must live. However, rn I can't buy it because it has no real sense, in the way that we all want to be happy and feel love in all those levels of conciousness and understanding.

[Shin]

Depending on your level of consciousness, you seek love and happiness in ways that serves your worldview and survival agenda.

It makes perfect sense at each stage.

[Leo Gura]

15 minutes ago, The Buddha said:

However, rn I can't buy it because it has no real sense, in the way that we all want to be happy and feel love in all those levels of conciousness and understanding.

Sounds more like the hippie utopian thinking of stage Green.

People will be slaughtering each other for at least another 500 years.

[Hap E-Boi]

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Technology was created by the necessity and struggle to survive. To build and maintain technology requires never-ending labor and wage slavery.

And it makes more and more people sick, think of the cancer epidemic, electrohypersensitivity (I'm suffering from this), social media addiction, etc. Also it destroys what we perceive as our environment. Not that any of this is wrong, suffering is consciousness teaching itself.

[The Buddha]

@Leo Gura

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Not at all

Everyone has a different idea of love and peace.

I again have to strongly disagree. Of course it is relative to each individual but that is the own interpretation of the individual to a universal experience. That is how each human being cognizes and assimilates a phenomena which is common to all beings (at least beings...) and I would even say that is a cosmic reality. The same an alien would have it's own bios and interpretation of the same phenomena of love and peace. Therefore, each individual will have it's own ideas about how to generate and sustain this states, but the underlying truth and experience is one and the same among all human, animals, plants, aliens... Each at it's own level of understanding, each one just understands what it can understand but the melody is the same. As different beings watching the same movie. One will get the plot, another wouldn't even understand the language but enjoyed the visual aspect of it, another is just thinking about other things... Yet the film is one and the same. So saying that each one has a different idea of the film is true, but the next assumption done that the film therefore must be different: is a big trap. The melody is the same, each one hears/listens what their ear can hear/listen.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

One person's idea of love might be to rape you.

Is that love or lack of love? It's just the same thing but a more condensed and solid form of love. For what is true is that an individual who is already exuberant in love would not rape. So the fact is the same, is the interpretation of that film. How it thinks that he can get the same underlying truth that each one experiences, by his own understanding and means. It may be his idea of the film, but it is not The Film. So a society which encouraged the understanding of The Film and it's experience; while understanding the meta perspective about the whole game of the ideas about the film, would be the most optimal way to live.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

BTW, Tibetan monks are notorious for raping young monk recruits.

Please, I am talking about a much broad understanding of Tibet. So u pointed out that the main blindspot was survival. Yet we have a country whoose survival is brutal where pain, suffering and death was very very common. However, even before Buddhist era, since the shamanic way of live they already had deep compassion and love toward all the people that they had contact with. Instead of happening what u were saying, that survival need would make them lose it all; the opposite happened. So Tibet, has been and is a very clear example that even in the worst survival situations we can still create a good society. Was so the case that when buddhism arrived to tibet had such a great acceptance, because we could say in a way that they were buddhist before buddhism. Moreover, even in this extreme survival conditions a third of the population (just take a few moments to understand how much that is) became monks and lived with the bare minimum to substain it's life.

[The Buddha]

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Sounds more like the hippie utopian thinking of stage Green.

Are u truly saying that Love is just a stage Green/hippie thing? lol. Moreover, that a society were love is the base is utopian. I say it very very clear: Any society which is not based upon love is distopian a fucking torture to it's inhabitants. I'm talking about the love of a mother for it's child, I'm talking of the compassion that arises when u see an animal suffering, I'm talking about that Love that u feel when u are in presence of God.

25 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

People will be slaughtering each other for at least another 500 years.

Maybe or maybe not. Who knows and what is the point? It is in fact this disfunctionality that I'm pointing at, that truly surprises me.

[The Buddha]

17 minutes ago, Hap E-Boi said:

And it makes more and more people sick, think of the cancer epidemic, electrohypersensitivity (I'm suffering from this), social media addiction, etc. Also it destroys what we perceive as our environment. Not that any of this is wrong, suffering is consciousness teaching itself.

About electrohypersensitivity I also was very much affected by it. I recommend u to buy an orgonite at home. Wear also Rudraksha bead (108) properly done and have some Shungite or Black Tourmaline. There are many other ways but in my experience these are the best. Hope that I could help you <3

[Leo Gura]

This is what Love looks like for many humans on this planet:

You grossly underestimate the power and function of survival.

Consider it your spiritual practice to contemplate deeply the profound function of survival.

Only then will you understand why your utopia is a childish dream.

[Yali]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Tibetan monks are notorious for raping young monk recruits.

any famous monks guilty of this? @Leo Gura

Edited June 8, 2021 by Yali

[The Buddha]

@Leo Gura Sorry that video is blocked in my country. Could u please send me the link and I'll watch with a vpn.