Question to Leo on Veganism @Leo Gura

[mivafofa]

@Windappreciator lol I'm not an alien and I don't have the power to cage up humanity. But my theory is already put into test with veganism alone

 

[Windappreciator]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

If one's body can handle it, then I suggest one try it.

Of course people will make up what excuses they want.

No Leo, you don't understand. Many people have a romantic idea of animal products consumption and this body type thing feeds into it, especially from someone they unconsciously consider "high status". That's like putting butter on the bread.

Their minds are disconnected from what animal products actually mean.

Emotionally they are far gone but also even on the conceptual level.

They do not understand for the sake of understanding, understanding is a tool for them to pick what preserves their current behaviour.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Windappreciator

[kieranperez]

30 minutes ago, Twega said:

We are primates, it is clear that we were meant to eat plants. Everything in our physiology points toward this being the case. 

Homie have you heard of persistence hunting of animals that went on for tens of thousands of years and maybe even hundreds? There is no conclusive bulletproof evidence or case of what exactly human being were eating when it came to the fatty sources nutrition that enhanced the very size of our brains but it was a mix of meat vegetables. This case about how we were only “meant to eat fruits and vegetables” is utter hogwash. Human beings have been relying on meat for thousands of years as well as fruits and vegetables. 

[Windappreciator]

2 minutes ago, mivafofa said:

@Windappreciator lol I'm not an alien and I don't have the power to cage up humanity. But my theory is already put into test with veganism alone

 

Test it on yourself.

[mivafofa]

9 minutes ago, Windappreciator said:

Test it on yourself.

lol you think I speak out of my ass without personal experience?  It lasted 2.5 years until I acknowledged the insidious damage it caused in me both physically and mentally.  Learning that veganism wasn't the holygrail to every human as it claimed to be was a hard pill for me to swallow

Edited May 27, 2021 by mivafofa

[mmKay]

@Leo Gura yup look at gorillas. Effin 250 kg of pure muscle from chewing leaves lol. Now thats some vegan bodybuilding genetics right there. 

[Windappreciator]

1 minute ago, mivafofa said:

lol you think I speak out of my ass without personal experience?  It lasted 2.5 years until I acknowledged the insidious damage it caused in me both physically and mentally.  Learning that veganism wasn't the holygrail to every human as it claimed to be was a hard pill for me to swallow

What did it cause?

[mivafofa]

26 minutes ago, Windappreciator said:

What did it cause?

 

Physically speaking, shortness of breath, brain fog, hair loss, to which at the time, I chose to attribute these issues to anything but veganism.  It might not sounds so bad on the surface, but I couldn't form a full sentence anymore without adding "err" "yknow" "uhm" between every 5 words. My training is the love of my life and it was getting affected.  

Mentally speaking, it was turning me into a member of a cult. My whole identity and lifestyle was surrounding veganism. Personally, it goes against my values to push, probe or guilt trip anyone to follow any lifestyle I incorporate.  I seriously hated pushing the vegan agenda onto people, preaching them and going onto crusades about it (just like what this thread is doing).  But the alarming suffering of the animals was calling to put my discomfort to the side. After all my discomfort was nthg compared to what the animals have to go through, right? 

After I ended my veganism, you know what it felt like? Like I just ended a toxic relationship. You don't notice how bad it was until you're out.  You're blind to it while you're in it. Everythg seemed good while it lasts, you deny and minimize lots of suffering you were having, you even lie to yourself and others. 

[DocWatts]

Vegetarians / Vegans would do well to put more emphasis on strategies for helping people transition towards a more ethical and sustainable diet, rather than approaching it from a viewpoint of moral absolutism.

Vegetarianism/Veganism is a lifestyle change after all. For my part, it took me a good year or two to reach a point where something like %95 of my diet is Vegetarian, something that I wouldn't have been able to stick with if I didn't adopt it gradually.

[Windappreciator]

25 minutes ago, mivafofa said:

 

Physically speaking, shortness of breath, brain fog, hair loss, to which at the time, I chose to attribute these issues to anything but veganism.  It might not sounds so bad on the surface, but I couldn't form a full sentence anymore without adding "err" "yknow" "uhm" between every 5 words. My training is the love of my life and it was getting affected.  

Mentally speaking, it was turning me into a member of a cult. My whole identity and lifestyle was surrounding veganism. Personally, it goes against my values to push, probe or guilt trip anyone to follow any lifestyle I incorporate.  I seriously hated pushing the vegan agenda onto people, preaching them and going onto crusades about it (just like what this thread is doing).  But the alarming suffering of the animals was calling to put my discomfort to the side. After all my discomfort was nthg compared to what the animals have to go through, right? 

After I ended my veganism, you know what it felt like? Like I just ended a toxic relationship. You don't notice how bad it was until you're out.  You're blind to it while you're in it. Everythg seemed good while it lasts, you deny and minimize lots of suffering you were having, you even lie to yourself and others. 

Yeah I feel you, I had that same feeling with carnism.

It really feels good for me being vegan, not contributing to the animal holocaust. 

My health improved on veganism as well, I lost my acne, I got more stamina and needed less sleep and so on. Much benefits honestly, but originally I started because I liked animals, I did not expect any benefits. I just found out that we don't need protein from meat and went vegan as a response, because I saw no reason anymore in contributing to harming animals in that way.

And since it is for the love I have for these animals, advocating is not an issue, because I am not doing it for myself, that alleviates all the anger and possible frustration for me.

I am really happy to have made that transition 9 years ago and I wish I could have done that earlier honestly.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Windappreciator

[mivafofa]

@Windappreciator lol you sound like me when I used to be vegan. Good luck on your journey.  I hope it lasts.

[Windappreciator]

@mivafofa Well what coincidence! I thought that you sound a like me when used to be a carnist! I hope everything works out for you. Insincerity leaves an important impact on the course of ones life.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Windappreciator

[mivafofa]

@Windappreciator Except I actually am sincere.  I do hope it works out for you and that it lasts. 

[Windappreciator]

@mivafofa It will don't worry about it.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Windappreciator

[Tetcher2]

What I don't understand is if meat eating is "okay" then why is murder such a big thing ? If you murder a human it's just +1 to the 70B animals murdered yearly.. it's just a legal matter basically but the whole lives spanning karma thing is bullshit

[blueplasma]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Also, you misunderstand Love. Since God is Love, murder is Love too. You cannot use the fact of Love to justify any action, because every action is Love.

I agree every action is love, but in the absolute sense. In the relative sense how can murder or rape be considered love? Isn't it a fact that as long as we are in the human form we are in the relative space.

[Michael569]

@blueplasma once you have presented an argument of the animal suffering and the person is willing to accept those consequences by eating animal food nevertheless, your job is done. Nothing else you say makes any point or validity and just endlessly further attacking people shows only lack of compassion, understanding and personal development. 90% of vegans fail to understand this. It is your personal ethical choices but don't shove it down the mouth of other people. Show the same sort of empathy and kindness you have for animals to fellow human beings and maybe once they are ready they will be able to consider your arguments. 

Not everyone can be vegan, it does not work for some people and you need to be open minded enough to accept that and let go 

 

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, blueplasma said:

I agree every action is love, but in the absolute sense. In the relative sense how can murder or rape be considered love? Isn't it a fact that as long as we are in the human form we are in the relative space.

Did I not say to go vegan if you can?

Minimize suffering as much as reasonable and possible for you. Be ware of turning veganism into a dogma.

[Twega]

9 hours ago, kieranperez said:

In California though all the stuff you just mentioned is actually illegal so you’re making a mute point.

No. All cows are artificially inseminated to ramp up dairy production. This is standard practice. Plus, animals and dairy especially, have natural hormones present in them. & Rest assured, it isn't testosterone.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Twega

[Twega]

9 hours ago, kieranperez said:

Homie have you heard of persistence hunting of animals that went on for tens of thousands of years and maybe even hundreds? There is no conclusive bulletproof evidence or case of what exactly human being were eating when it came to the fatty sources nutrition that enhanced the very size of our brains but it was a mix of meat vegetables. This case about how we were only “meant to eat fruits and vegetables” is utter hogwash. Human beings have been relying on meat for thousands of years as well as fruits and vegetables. 

@kieranperez  I mean this with no disrespect, man. But you're mistaken and have no idea what you're talking about. Cooking food is what researchers think is the cause of the increased brain size, and plant foods are more altered by cooking than meat. Yes, of course, humans hunted meat. As I said, we are opportunistic eaters. We ate plants not for hundreds of thousands, but for fucking millions of years. Like I said, we are descended from apes, and they did not hunt.

Familiarize yourself with the current research and revise your opinion. You can go straight into the evidence(found in the description) use SciHub to open it, if you think they are biased or whatever.

Edited May 27, 2021 by Twega