Soonhei (Member of this community) killed himself to experience Conscious Death. :-(

[Scholar]

1 minute ago, RMQualtrough said:

In either case I also do not think objective truth matters much... Just ask someone who hammers that subjective experience is irrelevant to go stick their hand in a hornet's nest. After all pain isn't real right?! They won't. Why? Because it fkn hurts! But then for some reason, when it comes to things other than physical pain, everyone suddenly dismisses subjective experience.

Because to you all of this is nothing but intellectual masturbation. If you actually were to take this path seriously, you would notice that it would start being the case that putting your hands in the hornest nest wouldn't be problematic to you at all. Connor Murphy got hair replacement without anesthesia to prove the point that to him every experience was "Good".

 

You are doing intellectual gymnastics here.

[Eren Eeager]

@SoonHei He had a misunderstanding that he is going to complete the journey of life by physically taking his life. And this is something Leo never supported. I also contemplated this thing many times, but always reached the conclusion that it is wrong to do that. Don't worry Sunny was never lost. He will just reappear in a different form and as a different Human. At least he did it peacefully. I wish you all find peace and acceptance,

sorry for your loss. 

Edited May 19, 2021 by Eren Eeager

[SoonHei]

@SoonHei For some reason I can't upload any more as there is a 153Kb limit..?

Pasting here:

NAHM Replied: May 1

You know I have the utmost respect for authentic questions...

Yes, absolutely. Very generally speaking the forum imo has a rare mix of psychedelic bias and deep misunderstanding. Not saying anything’s wrong with that. I like it, it’s more interesting. But there is a pretty complete lack of distinction which will takes years if ever to right itself so to speak. That’ll be contingent on a top down ownership and course-righting of deflection, projection, name calling, and boastful undermining via the conflation of absolute & relative, as it suits. 

I find faith to be only grey, but I don’t mean that to minimize it whatsoever. Generally, I find faith impossible to define, but I feel ‘the opposite of complaining’ points well.

Generally, when someone:

a) makes a dreamboard

b) discovers how much “how” thinking and doership is present in experience

and

c) let’s go of b

they’ll going to be waking up and simultaneously creating the life they most desire, and self discovering quickly via loa. 

Also, be compassionate to the cause and that which funds it (forum wise). There is no perfect way, and LP course, YouTube, Patreon way is as respectable as is possible. 

Imagine if everyone on the forum compared how amazing & abundant their life is from articulating what they want, expressing earnestly, and having complete surrender & faith in the universe being what they are dreaming up... instead of memories of a past trip which doesn’t exist and is precisely how they are veiling themselves from this / consciousness / now. 

---

SoonHei Member

Replied: May 2

Thank you! As always ?

?❤️?

Yes the psychedelic way is very much favored and understandably so, as Leo's videos talk about it and it's his party/forum after all, so naturally that will be the center.

 

Very key thing, to let go of "b)"

Indeed 

 

Thanks ??

[4201]

6 minutes ago, Scholar said:

It's Leo's lack of wisdom and social isolation. If he wants to teach he should get in person experience and get the feedback he clearly needs to see.

Leo has been completely dogmatic about the way he teaches since years now, all under the umbrella of it being his style and him wanting to not compromise the "Truth".

So you think whether or not people choose suicide is a matter of how the information is presented instead of it being presented? In your previous message you said "Don't tell this anyone".

[WaveInTheOcean]

The reason why death (most of the time, especially if you have a decent life with decent opportunities) is so silly, is because it - ultimately speaking - changes nothing.

That/he/she which thinks he/she can be killed/die/reborn/go somewhere/trip IS already death.

Life = dead = life = dead = ....

The dualistic view of life & death as opposites is an egoic, selfish, false, illusory view. In Truth life&death is identical. Completely identical.

[Breakingthewall]

This has nothing to do with spirituality, it has to do with avoiding responsibility, avoiding the truth, looking for an escape route. Neither nahm nor anyone is responsible for anything, only the person who jumped off the bridge. just hinting at it is trying to blame people for something terrible. If that person did not mind leaving his wife and children alone and did not want to face life, that is not the responsibility of anyone except his

[SgtPepper]

@Scholar

If a person is whole, and coming from a place of wholeness - Suicide will not be the answer nor will rape nor will replacing hair without anesthesia. 

With all due respect, I do believe SoonHei was dealing with mental illness in some form.

One of the most valuable supports I have is a therapist and I highly recommend everyone connect in person to someone who can display wholeness.

[ivankiss]

This one is for you, buddy...

Farewell. Much love and respect.

 

[Scholar]

5 minutes ago, 4201 said:

So you think whether or not people choose suicide is a matter of how the information is presented instead of it being presented? In your previous message you said "Don't tell this anyone".

I think you have to go back and carefully re-read what I wrote. Some information should not be given out like Leo is doing it and also in the way he is doing it. He is doing deeper deconstruction that Spiritual Teachers will do in person, where they can constantly monitor and adjust the trajectory of the person.

If you want to go deep, you cannot do it in a robot way. You can't do it like Leo is trying to do it, at his home talking to a camera and just telling everyone exactly how it is. That's like so bizarrely silly it's mindblowing to me that it's not obvious.

 

3 minutes ago, SgtPepper said:

@Scholar

If a person is whole, and coming from a place of wholeness - Suicide will not be the answer nor will rape nor will replacing hair without anesthesia. 

With all due respect, I do believe SoonHei was dealing with mental illness in some form.

One of the most valuable supports I have is a therapist and I highly recommend everyone connect in person to someone who can display wholeness.

This literally doesn't change anything. But again, just keep on shifting responsibility as far away from Leo and yourself as you can. That's the attitude the spiritual  community needs right now.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Scholar

[RMQualtrough]

Just now, Scholar said:

Because to you all of this is nothing but intellectual masturbation. If you actually were to take this path seriously, you would notice that it would start being the case that putting your hands in the hornest nest wouldn't be problematic to you at all. Connor Murphy got hair replacement without anesthesia to prove the point that to him every experience was "Good".

 

You are doing intellectual gymnastics here.

I've never cared about the path, this is merely intellectual to me. It's a philosophy I adopted after psychedelic use and then subsequent logical consideration. I do genuinely and truly believe it is most logically accurate, and have had mystical experiences, but my interest ends at understanding.

I think others go the other way round... I became nondual because I had experience which pointed to it and I became curious. I had no choice but to believe what I do... Others instead look for a "path" to improve their lives or w.e. and believe the things in the same way someone may believe a religion... I did not even know what nonduality was until I searched "monist religions" after a DMT trip.

Connor is intensely mentally ill. He claims to have been taken hostage by the government. Not even one claim he ever makes is trustworthy, and if he did do some wack shit, then oh well we all know he is literally crazy.

Someone mentally balanced like Leo does not go on camera shoving his hand in wasp nests. That is madman stuff.

[Dodo]

6 minutes ago, RMQualtrough said:

I've never cared about the path, this is merely intellectual to me. It's a philosophy I adopted after psychedelic use and then subsequent logical consideration. I do genuinely and truly believe it is most logically accurate, and have had mystical experiences, but my interest ends at understanding.

I think others go the other way round... I became nondual because I had experience which pointed to it and I became curious. I had no choice but to believe what I do... Others instead look for a "path" to improve their lives or w.e. and believe the things in the same way someone may believe a religion... I did not even know what nonduality was until I searched "monist religions" after a DMT trip.

Connor is intensely mentally ill. He claims to have been taken hostage by the government. Not even one claim he ever makes is trustworthy, and if he did do some wack shit, then oh well we all know he is literally crazy.

Someone mentally balanced like Leo does not go on camera shoving his hand in wasp nests. That is madman stuff.

That I can believe. I've had similar experiences and there are forces that can do things like that, trust me... The rabbit hole is deep... You call it madman, but he experienced it... What if something out of the ordinary happens to you and then nobody would believe you... But it did happen, clear as day... I've seen and communicated with entities that could read my mind and were translating via some gadgets to get my identity and where I am from, because I wouldn't speak.... Later on, one of the guys there told me that "Everyone here works for the government, don't trust them, even the good ones, they are the worst". Hehe weird 

Edited May 19, 2021 by Dodo

[Windappreciator]

To be honest,

Scholar has one point here.

It would do the forum good if many of you guys would crank up the nodge on morality and responsibility and sensitivity.

Hardly many of you been in solid stage green.

[4201]

5 minutes ago, Scholar said:

Some information should not be given out like Leo is doing it and also in the way he is doing it. He is doing deeper deconstruction that Spiritual Teachers will do in person, where they can constantly monitor and adjust the trajectory of the person.

If you want to go deep, you cannot do it in a robot way. You can't do it like Leo is trying to do it, at his home talking to a camera and just telling everyone exactly how it is. That's like so bizarrely silly it's mindblowing to me that it's not obvious.

I do think that your criticism of Leo would help him deconstruct the mind of anyone more effectively, but I disagree that his current technique leads to any amount of increased rate of suicide. It clearly reaches more people all at once, but I don't see the link between that and suicide.

[James123]

This is an egoistic movement, which mean is someone who is thinking about that jumping on the bridge and doing it. Path of the spirituality is realization of that there is no such a thing as thinker. So when you realize that there will be you to suicede. Suiciding is based on purpose, path on enlightenment is letting go of the all purpose. Sorry for your but it has nothing to do with spirituality. Additionally, people in this form DO NOT TAKE PSYCHEDELICS, WHICH WILL MAKE YOU BE A GOD, OR LOVE, GOING SOME BETTER PLACE, Or BEING INFINITE. ENLIGHTENMENT HAS NOTHING TO WITH ANY OF THAT. Your entire expectations will be destroyed when enlightenment happens. Psychedelics are just an illusion. Not even close to truth. Enlightenment is letting go the person who take psychedelics, all experiences , which are daily or under influence of psychedelics. You let go entire universe thats it. 

Edited May 19, 2021 by James123

[SgtPepper]

.

Edited May 19, 2021 by SgtPepper

[Dodo]

1 minute ago, 4201 said:

I do think that your criticism of Leo would help him deconstruct the mind of anyone more effectively, but I disagree that his current technique leads to any amount of increased rate of suicide. It clearly reaches more people all at once, but I don't see the link between that and suicide.

I believe there is actually a link. I had attempted a suicide long time ago, because I was actually fine with the idea of moving on. I was not afraid of death, took the rat poison and laid there, only for my mother to come in and find out what happened, then took me to the hospital... Leos stuff are very radical and can be misunderstood and misused. I wouldn't blame him, because he can't control how others would perceive an insight that he's had, which might very well be true. 

[karkaore]

Stop it already, will you?

Dude jumped off a bridge. Can you please, for once, shut the fuck up?

You guys make me wanna vomit.

[ivankiss]

31 minutes ago, SoonHei said:

@ivankiss Yes. Thanks for saying this. It is hard for me to understand why and how a smart guy like Sunny got so lost in these mental ideas and really understood this life to be a "Dream" that he could wake up out of. Imagine someone who is perhaps not "as smart" for the lack of a better word. If they start taking this stuff literally, they can easily take steps like this.

PLEASE PLEASE clarify this for everyone you talk to. Disclaimers are good but get ignored. Please make it a point to clarify within your conversations that this life is not a dream that you can just end it consciously by hurting your body in any way. You guys know how to say it best...

We have a long life ahead of us living without Sunny... I just don't want this to happen to anyone else. Please!

 

 

I am crying buckets right now. I feel your loss so deeply. It struck me out of nowhere. I did not know Sunny in real life, nor have talked to him too often here... But the few moments that we shared were all filled with love, respect, joy and wonder. It was indeed...dreamy.

I cannot even begin to imagine your pain. Words simply do no justice here.

Sunny thought us all a very important lesson.

Let's hope we learn.

 

[Scholar]

2 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I believe there is actually a link. I had attempted a suicide long time ago, because I was actually fine with the idea of moving on. I was not afraid of death, took the rat poison and laid there, only for my mother to come in and find out what happened, then took me to the hospital... Leos stuff are very radical and can be misunderstood and misused. I wouldn't blame him, because he can't control how others would perceive an insight that he's had, which might very well be true. 

But this idea of blame is completely silly. This isn't about blame, this is about responsibility and compassion. Leo can adjust his behave. Him spouting that he is God and reality is a dream, and morality unreal, in the way he does that, it's completely unnecessary.

 

Leo loves being right, that's fundamentally why he likes talking about all of this. He loves being intellectual, he loves telling you how it is. That's the primary reason why he does communicate this stuff in the way he does. It has nothing to do with some sort of grand strategy of wanting to be the most effective teacher.

If he wanted to be effective, he would have long ago found a way to test his teachings with solid feedback. The best way to do this is if you do it in person.

 

He can very much control to a degree how his ideas will be received, it would be absurd to claim otherwise.

[RMQualtrough]

10 minutes ago, Dodo said:

That I can believe. I've had similar experiences and there are forces that can do things like that, trust me... The rabbit hole is deep... You call it madman, but he experienced it... What if something out of the ordinary happens to you and then nobody would believe you... But it did happen, clear as day... I've seen and communicated with entities that could read my mind and were translating via some gadgets to get my identity and where I am from, because I wouldn't speak.... Later on, one of the guys there told me that "Everyone here works for the government, don't trust them, even the good ones, they are the worst". Hehe weird 

He also says he is a 5th dimensional alien lifeform, that he is the literal second coming of Christ, and all sorts. Have you even seen how unhinged and ill he is?

He has been sectioned for psychosis already.