Why there is "stuff"?

[snowyowl]

@Someone here yeah, in other words, what is distinction made of? When you say, 'that is a thing', or 'that is empty space, nothing', is it real or imagined in thought? Don't believe me, observe yourself. Can you even actually find the distinction inherent in this whole thread, what is real, what is imaginary? How about that tree or that car? 

[Someone here]

21 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Water is magic and can forget on purpose, and believe appearance can be separation when it isn’t. 

 

So it's just pure magic? You are basically saying it is what it is and no one really knows

[Someone here]

17 minutes ago, snowyowl said:

@Someone here yeah, in other words, what is distinction made of? When you say, 'that is a thing', or 'that is empty space, nothing', is it real or imagined in thought? Don't believe me, observe yourself. Can you even actually find the distinction inherent in this whole thread, what is real, what is imaginary? How about that tree or that car? 

I wouldn't say a distinction is purely mind created.. It is definitely inherent in things themselves. For example you don't project or imagine the difference between a hot and a cold drink. You can actually feel the difference between the two. 

However the distinction between somethingness and nothingness seems unclear to me. Also distinction between real and imaginary seems like a mental projection (thinking of dreams as an example).  

[Nahm]

31 minutes ago, Someone here said:

So it's just pure magic?

The water was not an analogy for an it’s. 

Quote

You are basically saying it is what it is and no one really knows

No. That would look like it is what it is and no one really knows. Nuance is more of a love making, whereas you’re just saying fuck it. 

[Someone here]

@Nahm  didn't know that being vague on purpose and speaking word salads is a nuance. 

Don't be annoyed that I keep coming up with the same crap all the time. Because it's gonna continue 

 

 

 

[Nahm]

19 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Nahm  didn't know that being vague on purpose and speaking word salads is a nuance. 

Don't be annoyed that I keep coming up with the same crap all the time. Because it's gonna continue 

Translation: Fuck it. 

That it doesn’t fit your current black & white paradox doesn’t make a me which is vague, it makes it useful. Contemplation, even for seconds, will always be a response. Never a reaction. 

If the path is not fun, interesting, and exciting, you’re not on the path.

’Things’ is a distinction btw. A parallel supplement for ‘stuff’. 

[snowyowl]

"I wouldn't say a distinction is purely mind created.. It is definitely inherent in things themselves. For example you don't project or imagine the difference between a hot and a cold drink. You can actually feel the difference between the two."

In this example the difference is in the feeling after the drink has interacted with your body and created a reaction. Does the difference exist before the interaction? Maybe it's like Schrodinger's cat, just a possibility not an actual thing. 

"However the distinction between somethingness and nothingness seems unclear to me. Also distinction between real and imaginary seems like a mental projection (thinking of dreams as an example)." 

Me too, what's it like when the mental projecting takes a rest and the distinction collapses? If it really doesn't matter whether This is real or imaginary, like when there's no survival threat to you, it's great, you can let go and be free. 

Edited May 10, 2021 by snowyowl

[Someone here]

@Nahm @Nahm OK let's stop trying to outsmart each other. 

I honestly and as usual not sure what you are on about lol.. 

Will give you last chance (?) to clarify what you mean in the water and ice example. Tell me water is analogous to what and how do you explain the existence of the physical stuff we see around. 

 

[Inliytened1]

On 5/7/2021 at 3:08 PM, Someone here said:

So why did God bother to say "let there be light"? 

It's because it's possible.  Because there cannot not be stuff.  There is no limitations on anything.  Form bursts from Formlessness because of the lack of limitation.   Every possibility is free to actualize.

 Try not having thoughts for a while. 

[Mason Riggle]

@Someone here it seems to me that what you are asking is, 'why is reality how it is, rather than some other way?'.   (or, for the 'real is imaginary' crowd, we might ask, 'why does reality seem how it seems, rather than seeming some other way, even though it makes no difference whether or not reality is how it is, or only seems that way)

I'm not sure there's a satisfactory answer to this question.  It's kind of like asking, 'why does the color red look to me how red looks to me, rather than some other way?'   

Why don't we have 5 arms? Why is pooping a thing that came to be? Why does it take a sperm and an egg to make a new human? What's up with hair?

When taken from the perspective of 'why are things how they are rather than some other way?', everything is a mystery and a-logical.  

Why is the Universe structured in such a way that you even understand this sentence? Who knows? 

It's the limits of language and logic which produce answer like you've gotten.. 'the Universe is how it is, because that's how it wants to be'.. 'it is how it is, because if it wasn't it wouldn't be'.. etc.. 

Why is there 'stuff'? Why not?? 

[Nahm]

25 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Nahm @Nahm OK let's stop trying to outsmart each other. 

That’s just how you’re framing it up, hadn’t occurred to me. 

25 minutes ago, Someone here said:

I honestly and as usual not sure what you are on about lol.. 

Stop thinking about me then and focus on what’s being said. 

25 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Will give you last chance (?) to clarify what you mean in the water and ice example. Tell me water is analogous to what and how do you explain the existence of the physical stuff we see around. 

Yes, the water is analogous for what. Notice a certain habit... “let’s stop trying to outsmart each other”... “not sure what you are on about”...”we see around”. There is a belief experience is on behalf of two, such as “we see”. But is it seen there is no direct actual experience of this...that it is an assumption...? 

[Someone here]

23 minutes ago, Mason Riggle said:

When taken from the perspective of 'why are things how they are rather than some other way?', everything is a mystery and a-logical.  

Why is the Universe structured in such a way that you even understand this sentence? Who knows? 

Got it. So basically no body fucking knows? 

@Inliytened1 where did the possibilities come from? You could think of alternative being an empty formlessness without any potential. 

16 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Yes, the water is analogous for what. Notice a certain habit... “let’s stop trying to outsmart each other”... “not sure what you are on about”...”we see around”. There is a belief experience is on behalf of two, such as “we see”. But is it seen there is no direct actual experience of this...that it is an assumption...? 

Well look.. It's both two and not two. That's the mindfuck of it.  For example you can say there is no experiencer experiencing experience. Experience is one undevided whole. But on the other hand you can locate apparent twoness and boundaries. If you go look at the mirror.. "you" will see two separate eyes. They are united by the same filed of experience yet they are devided and separate nonetheless. 

[Inliytened1]

2 minutes ago, Someone here said:

 

@Inliytened1 where did the possibilities come from? You could think of alternative being an empty formlessness without any potential. 

 

Where did Infinity come from?  Itself.  

Yes you can have an empty formlessness .

And you as Infinity can remain in that forever...until you have an idea....

 

[Shin]

4 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Where did Infinity come from?  Itself.  

Yes you can have an empty formlessness .

And you as Infinity can remain in that forever...until you have an idea....

 

So many ideas, I'm a genius  

[Fran11]

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yes you can have an empty formlessness .

And you as Infinity can remain in that forever...until you have an idea....

Emptiness has no boundaries and therefore it is unstable.

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Shin said:

So many ideas, I'm a genius  

[mandyjw]

@Someone here All intelligence is your intelligence, intelligence isn't owned by anyone so it's not two. Ironically someone can't teach you a thing unless you feel and resonate that it's also your intelligence. All learning is a dissolution of teacher and student, like ice melting into water. 

[Inliytened1]

4 minutes ago, Fran11 said:

Emptiness has no boundaries and therefore it is unstable.

Indeed

[Mason Riggle]

17 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Got it. So basically no body fucking knows? 

Yep

[Someone here]

It's comforting to see how clueless everyone is.