I resonate a lot with Jordan Petersons take on feminism - What am I missing?

[lmfao]

@Ry4n Have you watched Neon Genesis Evangelion by any chance? My friend gave me a fun interpretation of the End of Evangelion film, if you've seen it. 

[Derek White]

34 minutes ago, Emerald said:

If Feminists are making this “equality of outcome” argument all over the place, then you should have no issue screen-shotting me some evidence that I don’t have to watch a bunch of anti-feminist videos to find. 

Maybe you should watch those antifeminist videos or just people who criticize the left.

I don't save these things on my computer when I come across them, I ignore them and move on. 

Okay here's one, Justin Trudeau's 50-50 women to men split cabinet. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnWJ-l5aRLA&ab_channel=CBCNews%3ATheNational

https://theconversation.com/trudeaus-new-cabinet-gender-parity-because-its-2019-or-due-to-competence-126646

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-trudeau-liberal-government-cabinet-1.3304590 

[Ry4n]

@Carl-Richard Humanities studies pushing the idea that the west is a patriarchy, I'm more so talking about overall PC rhetoric, it shows up in many different ways. Related to my first example another school told 12-13 year olds to apologise to their female classmates for being oppressors. It's one thing to tell a 17 year old that, but a 12 year old? I would label that as full on abuse to children.

10 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

How many universities exactly?

Exactly 33.565 universities. 

[Ry4n]

7 minutes ago, lmfao said:

@Ry4n Have you watched Neon Genesis Evangelion by any chance? My friend gave me a fun interpretation of the End of Evangelion film, if you've seen it. 

nah but sounds interesting

[Derek White]

12 minutes ago, Emerald said:

I didn’t get this perspective from Spiral Dynamics. I heard about SD years after I happened upon this feminine/masculine perspective and had many insights about it. And it is an accurate name to call it, as the roots of it is archetypal and across many cultures. 

I didn't say it was inaccurate or accurate. I just don't like it. Opens door for fights between men and women. Something neutral/secular is less divisive.

Edited May 3, 2021 by Derek White

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Ry4n said:

I'm more so talking about overall PC rhetoric, it shows up in many different ways.

Then that is something different than what you were talking about initially.

 

1 hour ago, Ry4n said:

Humanities studies pushing the idea that the west is a patriarchy

You have to elaborate on why you think that is problematic. "Patriarchy" is not this moralizing term that says something like "all men are evil". It's a pretty dry descriptive term: society is and has always been dominated by men (generally speaking). Why is that a problematic statement?

Edited May 3, 2021 by Carl-Richard

[SamC]

4 hours ago, lmfao said:

@SamC Supposing that you even wish to use this framework of SD for your growth, I think you're better forgetting about politics if it leads to confusion for you. Politics is messy with collectives, different groups, perceiving threats to yourself, vague and meaningless generalisations. Perhaps better flushed down a toilet?

Past all the minutia of what you've said, my gut is this. You're not being direct about your problems, you're dancing around something instead. Bending over backwards in self doubt. Dithering fool. And I know so because I do the same thing. 

@lmfao Can you elaborate?

 

[Surfingthewave]

@SamC

You resonate with JP because perhaps like JP you are a priveledged male who has never experienced sexism. 

Do you know what it feels like to not be allowed access to a library because you are a woman? 

Do you know what what it feels like to not be allowed to vote because you are a woman?

Do you know what it feels like to not be promoted in a job because you are a woman? 

Do you know what it feels like to not be able to open a bank account because you are a woman? 

Do you know what it feels like to be paid less than a man for the same job because you are a woman? 

Do you know what it feels like to be expected to give up your career because you have a child? 

Do you know what it feels like to not feel safe walking down the street because you are a woman? 

You don't because you are a man. 

Perhaps you should study a class on where feminism has come from, the history of oppression for women and you may have a different perspective. 

 

 

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by Surfingthewave

[Shin]

1 hour ago, Surfingthewave said:

@SamC

Do you know what it feels like to not feel safe walking down the street because you are a woman? 

 

In a women's head they could be raped at any moment in those kind of situations.

This is no joke for them.

Get out of your western privileged white male's worldview guys,

You have it

SO EASY

Edited May 3, 2021 by Shin

[SamC]

34 minutes ago, Surfingthewave said:

@SamC

You resonate with JP because perhaps like JP you are a priveledged male who has never experienced sexism. 

Do you know what it feels like to not be allowed access to a library because you are a woman? 

Do you know what what it feels like to not be allowed to vote because you are a woman?

Do you know what it feels like to not be promoted in a job because you are a woman? 

Do you know what it feels like to not be able to open a bank account because you are a woman? 

Do you know what it feels like to be paid less than a man for the same job because you are a woman? 

Do you know what it feels like to be expected to give up your career because you have a child? 

Do you know what it feels like to not feel safe walking down the street because you are a woman? 

You don't because you are a man. 

Perhaps you should study a class on where feminism has come from, the history of oppression for women and you may have a different perspective. 

 

 

 

@Surfingthewave

For sure.

Are you open to elaborate on the things that you've suffered from the patriarchy and repression of the feminine?

[Surfingthewave]

@SamC

I have experienced sexism and discrimination in the workplace, I have experienced feelings of being unsafe when walking down the street and I have also experienced discrimination because I date women (that's more homophobia however). 

Based on the many replies you have been given on this thread how will you be reframing your position on feminism? 

Edited May 3, 2021 by Surfingthewave

[SamC]

 

Quote

Based on the many replies you have been given on this thread how will you be reframing your position on feminism? 

@Surfingthewave It doesn't work like that. The reason why I can't stand feminism is because I repress my anima and have a victim mentality + put the feminine on a pedestal.

I see something in feminism and stage green that I hate within myself which tells me that the wounds that woman feel are the same mirrored wound that I feel, but reversed.

What I can say however, is that I see that connection between me and all females a lot more clearly and that I should give myself a lot of kudos for taking steps forward in healing my relationship to the feminine energy.

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by SamC

[Etherial Cat]

3 minutes ago, SamC said:

 

@Surfingthewave It doesn't work like that. The reason why I can't stand feminism is because I repress my anima and have a victim mentality + put the feminine on a pedestal.

I see something in feminism and stage green that I hate within myself which tells me that the wounds that woman feel are the same mirrored wound that I feel, but reversed.

 

This is exactly why we are all in need for feminism.

You are also victim of the oppression of the feminine. 

The reason why it is repressed within you, is because it is repressed within society... and vice versa. It's a vicious circle.

The unfolding of the feminine energy starts within ourself, but reviving it is difficult because we've lost touch with what it is. It has become foreign. And what I have found out for myself, is that it is like learning a new language. But not one that is commonly spoken, more like an ancient one that has been forgotten by most. 

23 minutes ago, SamC said:

What I can say however, is that I see that connection a lot more clearly and that I should give myself a lot of kudos for taking steps forward in healing my relationship to the feminine energy.

I think you are doing really great. Being aware of this is quite exceptional to be honest. So big kudos, indeed! ???

[SamC]

1 hour ago, Etherial Cat said:

This is exactly why we are all in need for feminism.

You are also victim of the oppression of the feminine. 

The reason why it is repressed within you, is because it is repressed within society... and vice versa. It's a vicious circle.

The unfolding of the feminine energy starts within ourself, but reviving it is difficult because we've lost touch with what it is. It has become foreign. And what I have found out for myself, is that it is like learning a new language. But not one that is commonly spoken, more like an ancient one that has been forgotten by most. 

I think you are doing really great. Being aware of this is quite exceptional to be honest. So big kudos, indeed! ???

Thank you! @Etherial Cat

I have noticed that you're exceptionally adapt at noticing and acknowledging other people's good doings and intentions and seeing their light. That's such a rare quality that deserves a lot of more attention and love in today's society. So here ya go

Keep❤seeing❤people - that's what our society needs more of.

 

 

 

[Etherial Cat]

14 minutes ago, SamC said:

Thank you! @Etherial Cat

I have noticed that you're exceptionally adapt at noticing and acknowledging other people's good doings and intentions and seeing their light. That's such a rare quality that deserves a lot of more attention and love in today's society. So here ya go

Keep❤seeing❤people - that's what our society needs more of.

Thank you a lot for this compliment @SamC. <3 

[Emerald]

8 hours ago, Derek White said:

I didn't say it was inaccurate or accurate. I just don't like it. Opens door for fights between men and women. Something neutral/secular is less divisive.

But it's also less accurate if you put it in secular terms. And it's core to the whole thing to understand that it does derive from masculine/feminine polarity as these are the building blocks in all of reality. 

[Surfingthewave]

9 hours ago, SamC said:

 

@Surfingthewave It doesn't work like that. The reason why I can't stand feminism is because I repress my anima and have a victim mentality + put the feminine on a pedestal.

 

So it's not really about your views about feminism and more to do with unconscious/shadow work you are doing? 

Also the thing you "can't stand" is a movement of reforms for the equality of women dating hundreds of years. Women have died in the name of feminism. 

Be aware that the anima you describe is a psychological construct.

It's good you're making steps to heal/get in touch with the feminine within you but be careful of projecting your trauma onto others /oppressed groups and labelling it as something else. I've done it myself. Just an observation. 

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by Surfingthewave

[SamC]

12 hours ago, Surfingthewave said:

So it's not really about your views about feminism and more to do with unconscious/shadow work you are doing? 

@Surfingthewave No you don't get it. It is both.. my relationship to the hurt and repressed feminie perspective within is the same relationship I have to the hurt feminine perspective outside.

In order to fully understand feminism I need to heal the feminie repression wound I have and vice versa

Quote

It's good you're making steps to heal/get in touch with the feminine within you but be careful of projecting your trauma onto others /oppressed groups and labelling it as something else. Just an observation. 

 

Your observation is wrong. I never projected anything. If anything, I acknowledged that the same hurt I feel is the same hurt you feel but you don't want to accept that so you project that I am the one projecting my trauma, while it is you denying that we are both hurt by the same repression of the feminine energy on a structure meta level.

 

Edited May 4, 2021 by SamC

[Derek White]

8 hours ago, Emerald said:

But it's also less accurate if you put it in secular terms. And it's core to the whole thing to understand that it does derive from masculine/feminine polarity as these are the building blocks in all of reality. 

You made these up, like boogeyman. What is masculinity and feminity, a set of traits? Values? A feeling? Is swearing masculine or feminine, what about working?

It’s the same as categories in fantasy. Your masculinity and femininity is like saying “be more like Gryffindor or be more like water benders” you can invent other inities too

It’s a self biased framing at that, you have defined everything bad and survival oriented as masculine, stage red, blue and orange; and everything good and holy as feminine, stage green and above. Female biased completely. Open the door for women to feel superior to men, when in reality I see just as many stage blue and orange women as men. 

You take your perspective so seriously, as if it’s objective reality. It’s just one perspective you made up.

Also, see the Trudeau example. 

 

[Surfingthewave]

2 hours ago, SamC said:

@Surfingthewave 

I have to the hurt feminine perspective outside.

In order to fully understand feminism I need to heal the feminie repression wound I have 

Why do you have this hurt?