Is it ethical to give a pet a orgasm?

[Leo Gura]

41 minutes ago, 4201 said:

but at least they don't have to do work for us, we house them for free and they just have to be nice. I imagine the life of a dog or a cat is not that stressful, at least not comparable to being a human slave in the 1700s.

Okay, so how about you become my pet? You won't have to do any work. I will feed you gruel and you can sleep on my couch. I will cut off your balls and take you out for walks on a leash.

Deal?

41 minutes ago, 4201 said:

They don't even have the concept of being a slave or not.

They don't have a concept of being raped either.

41 minutes ago, 4201 said:

At the end of the day our cats and dogs are attached to us.

Stockholm syndrome, google it

[Preety_India]

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Okay, so how about you become my pet? You won't have to do any work. I will feed you gruel and you can sleep on my couch. I will cut off your balls and take you out for walks on a leash.

Deal?

They don't have a concept of being raped either.

Stockholm syndrome, google it

I think I agree with you now. Your elaborate explanation makes sense. 

In a way we make them codependent on us. Making someone codependent is also a form of abuse especially when they cannot communicate how they feel. 

Well I don't have pets now. I used to as a kid.. So I guess it's a good thing I don't have pets anymore. 

 

[Lyubov]

3 hours ago, Nahm said:

Your dog does not want to have sex with you. It’s not thinking. You have to embrace paradox. 

you clearly have never met my neighbor's dog that will literally hump every leg it can get a hold of.

on a slightly related note, this section of the forum just keeps getting weirder and weirder lmao

[Lyubov]

also god did not intend for regular cross species sex in his grand design besides for the will of some odd humans to be exercised. otherwise he would of allowed Mr.Hands to survive after willingly getting fucked by a horse...

[4201]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Okay, so how about you become my pet? You won't have to do any work. I will feed you gruel and you can sleep on my couch. I will cut off your balls and take you out for walks on a leash.

Deal?

I think I'd prefer that than being homeless though. After a while of taking me on walks with a leash you might get tired of holding the leash as you'll see I'm not dumb enough to run into cars. The thing is, we go on walks for the animal, not for the owner as the animal needs to move. I do agree it's not nice for an animal to live cramped in a tiny apartment and that's the only reason why I don't currently have pets.

Sure I am attached to the idea of reproduction but if I had already lost it I would no longer be attached to it nor suffer it. Maybe it's not humaine to cut the genitals off of our pets but that's a different discussion from having pets in the first place.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

They don't have a concept of being raped either.

They don't need the concept of being raped to dislike being touched in a certain way. Slavery is a concept, in itself it's not painful unless judged as painful. The poor life conditions behind that concept are often what's painful. Of course those more basic concepts of being touched in a way they don't want is still concept but I think it's concept simple enough for even them to judge as painful, in their non-linguistic manner.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Stockholm syndrome, google it

If pets weren't attached to us you would never find your dog back when you lose it and you would permanently lose your cat upon letting it go outside. Dogs are most willing to flee but mostly out of excitment and they seem to be willing to come back after a while.

Cats and dogs sure are loving animals. Our treatment to them may not be entirely fair and I think we can progress with more animal rights but still, I think you need a good relationship with a dog. You have no idea how well they can cheer you up 

 

Edited April 28, 2021 by 4201

[4201]

3 hours ago, Nahm said:

Your dog does not want to have sex with you. It’s not thinking. You have to embrace paradox. 

Are you saying even other humans don't think, it's all just god that thinks or animals don't think?

[Preety_India]

50 minutes ago, 4201 said:

Slavery is a concept, in itself it's not painful unless judged as painful.

That statement is one of the worst I've heard so far. 

 

[Megan Alecia]

@integral no. 

[intotheblack]

7 hours ago, integral said:

Does my dog want to have sex with me? 

[Preety_India]

@intotheblack I'm getting sick. 

[4201]

32 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

That statement is one of the worst I've heard so far. 

Anything out of context can be terrible. The fact people are labelled as slave or not does not define their living conditions nor their happiness. This is no excuse to make people into slaves, everyone should have freedom. But we cannot just conclude animals feel pain because if they were humans their rights would be the same as the one of a slave. Since animals do not understand ownership of things nor ownership of themselves by humans they cannot suffer the idea that "oh my god I'm a slave" as opposed to humans. They can only suffer their life conditions, which of course should be as good as possible in the best society.

 

Edited April 28, 2021 by 4201

[Leo Gura]

@4201 Babies don't have a concept of rape. How far do you dare to take your logic? 

Ahhh... the joys of philosophical musing.

[4201]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@4201 Babies don't have a concept of rape. How far do you dare to take your logic? 

It's the same. Babies aren't hurt by the idea of them being raped (although this will form trauma in the future), they are hurt by the actual physical actions done to them. This is the same point with slavery. It's not having the "slave status" that hurts, it's being treated like shit and stuff.

Edited April 28, 2021 by 4201

[Leo Gura]

Just now, 4201 said:

It's not having the "slave status" that hurts, it's being treated like shit and stuff.

Obviously, but to lose your freedom is to be treated like shit.

[4201]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

Obviously, but to lose your freedom is to be treated like shit.

In the human world yes in like 99.9999% of the time. But for a dog, is the street better than a cozy home and a loving owner? At least I think not, but I cannot ask a dog.

[diamondpenguin]

@4201

3 hours ago, 4201 said:

We were chilling and dogs and cat tagged along because they were useful to hunting and killing pest. It wasn't like we enslaved them at first, we had a symbiotic relationship. Now it kinda degenerated into consumerism but at least they don't have to do work for us, we house them for free and they just have to be nice. I imagine the life of a dog or a cat is not that stressful, at least not comparable to being a human slave in the 1700s. They don't even have the concept of being a slave or not.

At the end of the day our cats and dogs are attached to us. It's not like releasing them in the wild would make them more happy. Is it ethical to no longer breed them? Is it intrisically painful for them to live with us? We can give them more rights but animals cannot respect our right since they don't have the concept of rights. Honestly, I think our relationship with dogs and cats are a pretty good deal. Having a dog is generally a fun experience for both the person and the dog as long as there is no animal abuse.

Playing the innocent victim card are you? Your saying that just because they cant feel the suffering of their enslavement that it's fine. By that logic if I numbed your arm full of anesthetic and punched it till it's broken that's fine because you cant feel the suffering. Just like they say babies cant feel pain so they cut off part of their dickskin and they grow up enraged at the world.

Pets= enslavement 

People are EVIL

[Phyllis Wagner]

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Obviously, but to lose your freedom is to be treated like shit.

If a human were treated like a dog, then yes. Freedom is relative. Let's say some aliens hinder us from leaving earth, most would not give a shit because they wouldn't want to leave anyway. A domesticated dog would barely survive in the wild. Don't think they would give a shit about that kind of  freedom. 

[4201]

11 minutes ago, diamondpenguin said:

@4201

Playing the innocent victim card are you? Your saying that just because they cant feel the suffering of their enslavement that it's fine. By that logic if I numbed your arm full of anesthetic and punched it till it's broken that's fine because you cant feel the suffering. Just like they say babies cant feel pain so they cut off part of their dickskin and they grow up enraged at the world.

Pets= enslavement 

People are EVIL

They don't just "not feel it", it's just not a thing to them.

Right now your mind "could" be a simulation some alien people are doing for fun and they "own" you. You could possibly be their slave yet there is nothing to really prove or disprove this idea. Does it bother you? A cat doesn't think you even own him.

I don't oppose to pain because of the sensation it gives me, I like my arm and I wouldn't want it to get damaged. Likewise an animal also likes its body and doesn't want it to be damaged. Yet their "slave status" is imagined only by humans and it cannot be damaged, because it does not exists.

Edited April 28, 2021 by 4201

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, 4201 said:

But for a dog,

So then what's wrong with fingering your dog's butthole?

Right and wrong are whatever you imagine them to be. They always were. The rest is stories you tell yourself.

[TheDao]

Dogs mix good with people. I find the slavery analogy too much. In nature wolfs(dog likes) move in pacts, the most just follow the leader. This is the way they survive. So a dog naturally finds it ok to have a leading person. He constantly wants to follow and be with a human/dog. He is really happy with me and others.

How dogs are fed up is better than in older days. Its way more with positive reward.  Kids are way more treated with all sorts of rules and are a long day in a small class.

Ok he is on a leash for his safety and protection, but when its safe he is free. Some dogs even don't need a leash they just want to follow you.

In Turkey dogs are free on the streets. But I feel sad for such dogs. They dont have the safety and protection and some masculine idiot can treat him/her bad. I dont think they have it much better. I can feel my dog is happy. The dog gets way more massages than I do and lots of attention. 

 

Edited April 28, 2021 by TheDao