Bashar On Psychedelics

[mandyjw]

1 minute ago, Forestluv said:

A natural internal DMT boost would be like snorkeling and a substance DMT boost would be like scuba diving.

One can explore some amazing places while snorkeling, yet it isn't the same as deep ocean scuba diving. The human body cannot reach those depths without an oxygen tank. 

If you believe you're a human body, and that states are dependent on that body, THAT belief is your governor, not the body. 

[Nahm]

55 minutes ago, James123 said:

Many body builder who use steroids, if they stop using them, within 2 months the appearance of the body will be worst than who is doing lifting naturally

Rings so true. Close friend of mine from high school got into that. You’re spot on, after a few months, medically speaking he had to stop and he bottomed out so bad he actually killed himself. 

[Tim R]

3 hours ago, m0hsen said:

I strongly feel like I'm having a conversation with a materialist, scientific-minded person! ?

@m0hsen Don't worry, you're not.

Leo just gave you a perfect example. You will never get to look like Ronnie Coleman by using your will/discipline or any bodybuilding technique if you're a 100lbs woman, it simply won't happen. Neither will you grow yourself to be 15 ft tall. Neither will you Increase your IQ to 350. Neither will you grow a 6th finger on your left hand. Neither will you fly by flapping with your arms as quick as you can.

And neither will you compel your pineal gland to produce NN or 5MeO in the 10-40 milligram range. It's a physiological impossibility..

And if I am to believe Leo, you as God set yourself that limit. 

This has nothing to do with being open-minded. This has nothing to do with being a dogmatic materialist or dogmatic scientist. But for god sake, keep a certain level of mental hygiene in here (sorry, I'm not trying to be confrontational or anything)...

threadlock probably comes in any minute now?

[Hello from Russia]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Think of it like this: anyone can go to the gym and put on muscle. Everyone's body can naturally create testosterone -- even women! But you will never naturally achieve this look:

Your body cannot produce that much natural testosterone. And to tell newbies that it can is utterly irresponsible and misleading.

No gym technique will give you that look. The only way to get that look is to inject testosterone.

If you insist on going "all natural" -- fine. But you will not be as conscious as one who takes psychedelics. Not even close.

You are like a woman thinking you can be Ronnie Coleman while drinking your soy as long as you hit the gym hard enough. No!

Shinzen Young did 40 years of professional meditation. I can be more conscious than him in 15 minutes. That is the reality of how this works. You can make all the rationalizations you want, but the brute reality remains.

We used to fight over who has the biggest dick, but now we fight who is the most woke and conscious. I kinda like it, haha

[James123]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

Rings so true. Close friend of mine from high school got into that. You’re spot on, after a few months, medically speaking he had to stop and he bottomed out so bad he actually killed himself. 

After boosting the ego, if the things doesn’t go the way that ego wants, almost impossible to stop it. As you said, the situation leaded to suicide. 

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Shinzen Young did 40 years of professional meditation. I can be more conscious than him in 15 minutes.

Lol. ? 

[lmfao]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

If you believe you're a human body, and that states are dependent on that body, THAT belief is your governor, not the body. 

I think with these discussions the bottom line often just becomes "do the best you can". What else is it besides of the question of "can I reach that high?" "can I be happy?"

Discussion still interesting though. 

Edited April 23, 2021 by lmfao

[mandyjw]

23 minutes ago, lmfao said:

I think with these discussions the bottom line often just becomes "do the best you can". With the discussions still being interesting in of in themselves though. 

I never liked that though, "do the best you can". After a cross country race I'd ask myself, "did I do the best I could?" and no I didn't ever do the best I could, even if I puked my guts up after the race. I could always convince myself that I could have run harder, I could have run so hard I couldn't even walk back on the bus to go home or compete in next weeks race. I don't regret from those days of competitive running not doing the best I could. If I regret anything it's not enjoying the whole experience more than I allowed myself to. 

Consciousness is not a judgment looking back at itself. A thing looking back at itself in judgement will always find itself falling short because it has to split the already wholeness of itself in order to do just that. In its intuitive remembering that it is actually Whole, it finds itself lacking. It's a hilarious strange loop. The problem is itself the solution. 

It's the "difference" between self consciousness and Self consciousness. 

Edited April 23, 2021 by mandyjw

[lmfao]

22 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

I never liked that though, "do the best you can". After a cross country race I'd ask myself, "did I do the best I could?" and no I didn't ever do the best I could, even if I puked my guts up after the race. I could always convince myself that I could have run harder, I could have run so hard I couldn't even walk back on the bus to go home or compete in next weeks race.

Ahaha, that makes a lot of sense. Yeah....

22 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

I don't regret from those days of competitive running not doing the best I could. If I regret anything it's not enjoying the whole experience more than I allowed myself to. 

Yep, that's basically the only decent regret to have. 

22 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Consciousness is not a judgment looking back at itself. A thing looking back at itself in judgement will always find itself falling short because it has to split the already wholeness of itself in order to do just that. In its intuitive remembering that it is actually Whole, it finds itself lacking. It's a hilarious strange loop. The problem is itself the solution. 

Before even a word of the judgement has been spoken, the movement or framing to speak it IS itself already the judgement, and a "misperception" at that.
Insert words about inherent self referential nature, tautology, strange loop,........etc

Edited April 23, 2021 by lmfao

[Nahm]

@James123

Yeah, it was really heartbreaking. He was such a great, really loving and beautiful guy. That was readily seen by all, which made for a deeply disturbing funeral. My closer friend, of the friend circle if you will, was also using steroids and he broke down walking up to that funeral parlor. He never made it in, just couldn’t pull it together. But he never used steroids again. 

Funny light for a Mike Tyson quote on psychedelics...”they make you a pussy”.  Lol, honestly, love that he dropped the martyrdom, but man did I appreciate watching a Tyson fight, short as they were. Should’ve been given an Oscar. 

@lmfao Very nice! 

[kray]

@Phyllis Wagner Reminds me of what Alan Watts used to say, "If you get the message, hang up the phone".

[Forestluv]

3 hours ago, mandyjw said:

If you believe you're a human body, and that states are dependent on that body, THAT belief is your governor, not the body. 

Of course there is a 'domain' that lacks birth, bodies, categories of states, death etc.  

Within the domain I spoke, we could do a test: someone can deep sea dive with an O2 tank and then again without an O2 tank - and see if that influences state. My prediction is that it would have an influence. Unfortunately, the diver without the O2 tank would "die".

As the "human body" undergoes asphyxia and cardiac arrest, we could say there is no human body or state dependent on that body without the belief there is a human body and state dependent on that body. A drowning dog wouldn't have those beliefs. A rock sitting on the ocean floor doesn't have those beliefs. Yet we could also say that state is influenced by environment and the human body. There is a domain in which there is a distinction between eating a tuna sandwich and drowning to death. As well, there is a domain in which there is no distinction between the state of eating a tuna sandwich and drowning to death. I simply spoke of the former. 

every thing 'within' One Everything is inter-connected.  There is One whole as well as components integrated together within that systemic whole.  

[Enlightenment]

9 hours ago, m0hsen said:

An advanced yogi is not a human anymore.

No advanced yogi will stay conscious after propofol infusion

[mandyjw]

1 hour ago, Forestluv said:

A test of this would be to deep sea dive with an O2 tank and then again without an O2 tank - and see if that influences state. My prediction is that it would have an influence. Unfortunately, the diver without the O2 tank would die.   

Well, in our exploration "psychological death" is sort of the objective, not the avoided possible outcome of the exploration.  Or rather, it's the thing we already suspect but wish to verify. Like Rupert Spira's analogy of the asshole tyrant who lives upstairs that you're a servant to. You've never seen him and you spend years serving a master who doesn't even exist, but you're too terrified of him and too busy doing his bidding to question his demands or to go up there and even confirm his very existence. The exploration, the going up the stairs to confront the asshole seems terrifying, but there's absolutely no risk whatsoever, because he doesn't exist. 

1 hour ago, Forestluv said:

every thing 'within' One Everything is inter-connected.  There is One whole as well as components integrated together within that systemic whole.  

Connection is a reflection of non-separation. However (again, stealing Rupert's analogies ), the screen has no relationship or connection with the character, as well as being intimately one with it and allowing it to be. Your TV screen doesn't fall in love with the character Noah from The Notebook and keep Ryan Gosling's face on display in the corner for the next month or two while you're trying to watch the weather report. Although, a TV like that might be kinda fun... 

Edited April 23, 2021 by mandyjw

[James123]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

 

@James123

Yeah, it was really heartbreaking. He was such a great, really loving and beautiful guy. That was readily seen by all, which made for a deeply disturbing funeral. My closer friend, of the friend circle if you will, was also using steroids and he broke down walking up to that funeral parlor. He never made it in, just couldn’t pull it together. But he never used steroids again. 

 

 

Antidepressants, steroids and even psychedelics changes the person in a really different way thats why they have impact on people of the short term. Everyone must be the person who they really are. Of course psychedelics can help to people realize what they really are, however at the same time psychedelics can change the person behavior is the way that behaving unnaturally, being under affect of anything does not help to people to be who they really are. Only way to be what you are is, clear, empty mind. And so called body and person directly behave the way that they really are. 

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

Funny light for a Mike Tyson quote on psychedelics...”they make you a pussy”.  Lol, honestly, love that he dropped the martyrdom, but man did I appreciate watching a Tyson fight, short as they were. Should’ve been given an Oscar. 

Definitely. Lol . ? Furious fighter. because thats what he is. 

[Nahm]

@James123

? Beautifully said man. 

[TheSelf]

1 hour ago, Enlightenment said:

No advanced yogi will stay conscious after propofol infusion

an interesting story about Swami Ganapati Saraswati:

Quote

The great yogi preserved a habitual silence. In spite of his round face and huge, barrel-like stomach, Trailanga ate only occasionally. After weeks without food, he would break his fast with potfuls of clobbered milk offered to him by devotees. A skeptic once determined to expose Trailanga as a charlatan. A large bucket of calcium-lime mixture, used in whitewashing walls, was placed before the swami.
"Master", the materialist said, in mock reverence, "I have brought you some clobbered milk. Please drink it."
Trailanga unhesitatingly drank, to the last drop, the quarts of burning lime. In a few minutes the evildoer fell to the ground in agony.
"Help, Swami, help!" he cried. "I am on fire! Forgive my wicked test!"
The great yogi broke his habitual silence. "Scoffer," he said, "you did not realize when you offered me poison that my life is one with your own. Except for my knowledge that God is present in my stomach, as in every atom of creation, the lime would have killed me. Now that you know the divine meaning of boomerang, never again play tricks on anyone."
The sinner, healed by Trailanga's words, slunk feebly away.
The reversal of pain was not a result of the master's will but of the operation of the law of justice that upholds creation's farthest swinging orb.

it's not the supernatural abilities of these beings which are the most interesting thing for me, but the actual evolution of them through the science of yoga which also unimagines any rules or limitations for them.

Edited April 23, 2021 by m0hsen

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

Well, in our exploration "psychological death" is sort of the objective, not the avoided possible outcome of the exploration.  

That is a great exploration and objective to have. Yet that's not what I was exploring nor an objective in what I was exploring. 

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

it's the thing we already suspect but wish to verify. Like Rupert Spira's analogy of the asshole tyrant who lives upstairs that you're a servant to. You've never seen him and you spend years serving a master who doesn't even exist, but you're too terrified of him and too busy doing his bidding to question his demands or to go up there and even confirm his very existence. The exploration, the going up the stairs to confront the asshole seems terrifying, but there's absolutely no risk whatsoever, because he doesn't exist. 

Again, that is awesome stuff to explore with tons of insights. Exploring oceans and forests are both awesome.

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

Connection is a reflection of non-separation. However (again, stealing Rupert's analogies ), the screen has no relationship or connection with the character, as well as being intimately one with it and allowing it to be. 

This seems to add in another point of view to:

There is One whole as well as components integrated together within that systemic whole.  

The way I interpret is an addition that there is no connection between components (screen and character) which is also true. 

Saying that the screen and character are intimately one has a distinction of separation (intimately one is distinct from non-intimately one). Yet I like using degrees as a paintbrush and this would be an artistic use of degrees. . . .I love the creation that there is a subtle, intimate degree of separation between screen and character and screen allows character to be. To me, that is beautiful and loving. 

For me, miscommunication seems to arise when one person is speaking of one facet of the diamond and another person is speaking of another facet of the diamond and they don't see each is a facet of the same diamond. 

[James123]

50 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@James123

? Beautifully said man. 

❤️???✊

[mandyjw]

30 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

For me, miscommunication seems to arise when one person is speaking of one facet of the diamond and another person is speaking of another facet of the diamond and they don't see each is a facet of the same diamond. 

Ok, so what we think we are exploring when we take psychedelics is... what? Awareness? Our own psyche? If we explore a THING, it makes sense that we need a thing to explore a THING with. So if we take psychedelics to know ourselves, ("know thyself") we cannot bring in the belief that we are a separate mind, brain, body, who needs a thing to explore itself with. Are we made of matter?

Do I matter?

Awareness knows itself. 

If we miss that psychedelics are a teacher, an aid to connect us with our own Source that we already are, like Bashar is saying, we're going to have marry the teacher, handcuff ourselves to them and go out Romeo and Juliet style when they die, unless we see the teacher as a WINDOW into what we already Are. 

So my real question is, why on earth would you want to continue to believe that psychedelic allow access to "something" or "some state" that cannot be reached without them? You are so utterly powerful that you are can create that belief and that belief will show the evidence of itself to you. You create your own matrix, so why build that wall in the first place? Do you think we can get Mexico to pay for it? I mean even if it IS free, I still don't think it's a great idea. 

Edited April 23, 2021 by mandyjw

[Phyllis Wagner]

@Leo Gura what is your opinion on why bashar makes these claims in the video?

 

Tbh I think you make some good points I also don't think its really possible to achive this.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Phyllis Wagner