Does Success Hurt Woman's Dating Chances

[Preety_India]

2 minutes ago, Emerald said:

And what I meant by "being on the same wavelength" relative to work, means that he does his very best at what he does. He doesn't cut corners. And that it's important to him to feel a sense of contribution.

Yes exactly this. 

 

[Raptorsin7]

34 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

Why do you think that a woman should tailor her needs and goals around what you find interesting and attractive?

I'm not a saying woman should do anything. I'm stating my preferences in a partner. I'm free to desire whatever I want in a partner. I will not be shamed, bullied, and guilted into changing my opinions and preferences.

36 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

Why can't she do what she wants and seek her purpose, because seeking a purpose is a higher goal than anything else in life, and I don't mean career here, I mean a life purpose, it's the highest aspiration a person has, and why should that be discarded in lieu of romantic attraction, and what exactly are the benefits of attracting a man, meanwhile keeping the self deprived of higher aspirations, how exactly is this a better trade off vis-à-vis doing what fulfills her passion internally and spiritually and finding a partner who shares her endeavors and takes her to a higher trajectory of growth, because not only is she strong and independent this way, a strong mother who can use her measure of success, no matter how small and use it to guide her children and thus raise a better generation for tomorrow and finding love and passion in collective endeavors with her partner?

There are many woman who have pursued their own goals and purposes to great effect. 

I think I could make a great partner some day and I want what I want, if anyone has counter ideals and goals then so be it.

[Emerald]

2 hours ago, Arcangelo said:

Yes 100% It's called Hypergamy.

The more educated the woman the less men she's got to choose from.

I told my step sister:

-You want a husband and a family?

-Yes

-Then don't go to college, stay like you are.

 

This is bad advice... even based on your own premise around marriage and family.

Setting aside the fact that, if she followed your advice, she would potentially be stopping herself from individuating. If I put all the concerns for her personal development off the table, it's really not a good strategy to find a congruent and committed partner.

Most successful men who are looking for a healthy relationship will be looking for an equally educated partner who shares their values.

And if he's not looking for a healthy relationship with his intellectual equal, then he's not good husband material. Meaning, he will likely be immature, flaky, non-committal, having a tendency to cheat, etc.

Also many people meet their significant other in college. Lots of people even joke that many women go to college to get their "MRS" degree. And that's because this is a super common dynamic where you meet a like-minded person, perhaps even studying the same subject as you, and the relationship develops into a marriage. 

Most college educated men will get married to college educated women. It's relatively uncommon to have it otherwise.

Also as a bit of personal experience, my level of education and success have never stood in the way of my capacity to attract a partner who is very committed to me. 

[Preety_India]

9 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

. I'm free to desire whatever I want in a partner. I will not be shamed, bullied, and guilted into changing my opinions and preferences.

Nobody is shaming into changing your opinions and preferences, however the way you put it 

A woman in her 20's can spend 10 years climbing the corporate ladder and becoming a successful self sufficient person, but when it comes to finding a relationship it won't enhance her value in the ways many woman believe it will.

it feels like you're the one shaming all women for their looks and age. Just like you have preferences they too have preferences for both career and dating and life. 

Why should they be shamed for  believing in their ambitions and ideals?

 

[Raptorsin7]

3 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

Why should they be shamed for  believing in their ambitions and ideals?

I'm not shaming them, i'm expressing my preference and value in what I want in a partner. I value looks and character more than success and ambition.

I'm not shaming successful and ambitious woman. I don't have to find those traits desirable 

[Preety_India]

5 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I'm not shaming them, i'm expressing my preference and value in what I want in a partner. I value looks and character more than success and ambition.

I'm not shaming successful and ambitious woman. I don't have to find those traits desirable 

24 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

. I'm free to desire whatever I want in a partner. I will not be shamed, bullied, and guilted into changing my opinions and preferences.

Now you try to put it like it's your personal preference but just a while ago you were generalizing that all men want it this way. I don't think that many men think like you. And most men that I met had absolutely no problem with me being successful so maybe you're just projecting your own preferences on all men and I wouldn't trust the men on this forum to be a statistical survey because a lot of men outside of this forum have very different opinions than what I read here generally.

 

Edited April 22, 2021 by Preety_India

[Raptorsin7]

2 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

Now you try to put it like it's your personal preference but just a while ago you were generalizing that all men want it this way.

I don't think i'm atypical for a young western man. I could be wrong maybe i'm unique and men don't value woman the way I do. 

Hopefully you're right it will make it easier for me to find a partner in the future haha

[Arcangelo]

I did say that to her, but I was 75% joking. No one would ever take that advice seriously, however that's the reality: If you are a woman your pool shrinks the more educated you are, it is a directly proportional relationship.

1 hour ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Personally I would find it attractive if my partner went to a good school and studying something interesting 

Yeah me too.

 

Fun topic.

[Raptorsin7]

@Arcangelo Thanks for your input arc

[Arcangelo]

10 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

If it makes you feel better I'm 25 I live with my parents and I basically have the life style of a 15 year old, except I work 4 days a week at a dead end job. I'm not exactly a catch Haha

Yo Rap. I win:

                If it makes you fell better I am 41 living with my dad and I basically have the life style of a 16 year old ( I didn't smoke weed until I was 16), except I work 6 days a week at ''McDonald's'' . I'm not exactly a catch Haha

 

 

Arc

[Preety_India]

58 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I don't think i'm atypical for a young western man. I could be wrong maybe i'm unique and men don't value woman the way I do. 

Hopefully you're right it will make it easier for me to find a partner in the future haha

Welcome to the forum. 

 

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Emerald said:

Setting aside the fact that, if she followed your advice, she would potentially be stopping herself from individuating. If I put all the concerns for her personal development off the table, it's really not a good strategy to find a congruent and committed partner.

As well, she could be entering an asymmetric power dynamic in which she is financially dependent on the guy. Relationships seem wonderful around marriage time. Before marriage, no one is like “This is a toxic relationship. I will marry him, suffer abuse for five years, get screwed over in divorce court and live in poverty. 

Even though things seem rosy during marriage time, the reality is things often turn sour. And if a woman is financially dependent on her husband, lacks education and skills - she lacks options. This allows him to be more controlling and abusive. It’s super hard for her to leave the relationship and he knows it. 

I think this is one of the subconscious resistances some men have against gender equality, equal education, pay etc. It empowers women and some men don’t like losing power they e had over women.

[Preety_India]

9 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

Even though things seem rosy during marriage time, the reality is things often turn sour. And if a woman is financially dependent on her husband, lacks education and skills - she lacks options. This allows him to be more controlling and abusive. It’s super hard for her to leave the relationship and he knows it. 

Yea nobody brought up this point. Thanks for bringing this up. 

 

 

[Emerald]

14 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

As well, she could be entering an asymmetric power dynamic in which she is financially dependent on the guy. Relationships seem wonderful around marriage time. Before marriage, no one is like “This is a toxic relationship. I will marry him, suffer abuse for five years, get screwed over in divorce court and live in poverty. 

Even though things seem rosy during marriage time, the reality is things often turn sour. And if a woman is financially dependent on her husband, lacks education and skills - she lacks options. This allows him to be more controlling and abusive. It’s super hard for her to leave the relationship and he knows it. 

I think this is one of the subconscious resistances some men have against gender equality, equal education, pay etc. It empowers women and some men don’t like losing power they e had over women.

Yeah, it definitely does set the stage for things like this to happen. 

It's not good advice all around. It's advice for women that caters only to men... and specifically men who are threatened by women who don't diminish themselves.

And men who fall into that category are very low-quality partners who feel so insecure in themselves that they feel weak if their woman is strong. 

So, if you want a strong relationship... your best bet is to work on yourself and grow yourself as an individual. When you do this, you'll attract a higher quality partner. And that higher quality partner will be a wonderful addition to an already fulfilling life. 

[Preety_India]

8 minutes ago, Emerald said:

It's not good advice all around. It's advice for women that caters only to men... and specifically men who are threatened by women who don't diminish themselves.

And men who fall into that category are very low-quality partners who feel so insecure in themselves that they feel weak if their woman is strong. 

That's the point I was trying to make. It's impossible to have a society where women are discouraged from progressing on the grounds that they won't find partners or have slim chances. 

It probably serves the agenda of low quality men. 

 

[Raptorsin7]

6 minutes ago, Emerald said:

It's not good advice all around. It's advice for women that caters only to men... and specifically men who are threatened by women who don't diminish themselves.

@Emerald @Forestluv It's not just about men being threatened by successful woman. There are a lot of costs associated with becoming a financially independent person in a first world country, for the vast majority of people it will take great sacrifice to become successful.

I would find it very desirable for a woman who is willing to value family over her own career prospects so I can pursue financial success. You may view that as me being intimated by a successful woman, but from my pov that's not what's happening. 

There's a reason there aren't two presidents, or two commanders of an army. In almost all cases power will shift asymmetrically in one direction. 

[Preety_India]

@Raptorsin7 but a marriage needs two powerful people and not an asymmetric situation. 

 

[Byun Sean]

i mean its up to the woman who she dates and money is not the only way a man can provide value.

 

It's possible that a woman in this situation falls in love with a man that has less money than her and they negotiate a financial situation that is 

fair and equal for the both of them so there is no gray area or arguments about the woman paying for everything or vice versa.

 

In the end saying women should not pursue success because they won't be available to more men is not good advice.

Women should pursue their dreams in their careers and which ever partner they pick should respect that.

 

On top of that if being successful in this way makes a woman higher value she can increase her odds of attracting the attention of a higher value man.

Being successful and pursuing ones dreams and purpose through career is not just about money. It also shows strength in character.

 

 

[Forestluv]

12 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

@Emerald @Forestluv 

I would find it very desirable for a woman who is willing to value family over her own career prospects so I can pursue financial success. You may view that as me being intimated by a successful woman, but from my pov that's not what's happening. 

There's a reason there aren't two presidents, or two commanders of an army. In almost all cases power will shift asymmetrically in one direction. 

That sounds like a traditional orientation. There are plenty of traditional homes in which the woman is a homemaker of a family and things are healthy. 

Yet it’s just not true that both people can’t have successful careers. A couple can work together and make it happen. Lots of people won’t find it fulfilling to simply be a homemaker. They will want to reach their potential in some area and express themself. Cooking, doing laundry and changing diapers everyday won’t cut it.

[Raptorsin7]

3 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

but a marriage needs two powerful people and not an asymmetric situation. 

Maybe for some men, but personally I have no interest in a powerful woman for marriage