Deconstructing the illusory self

[James123]

@Breakingthewall how do you know that these are sentences and you are exist, in the universe? You learned this stuff from so called humans how can you trust the language? So called Human made? Just go in front of the mirror and think, is there anything there? Or try to find yourself in so called body, if you are the body, when so called body dies, you die, but body is here? So is there anybody and any body?

You are already what you are and where you are as always been, however identification with the thoughts makes you detached from the source, so actually there is no such a thing as thought, and when this realization happens realization happens that nothing has ever happened. You actually cant even think or know what is thinking. Not even dreaming, writing, learning or reading and began. 

Edited April 24, 2021 by James123

[Breakingthewall]

@James123 absolutely agree. what we perceive is appearance, it is not real. Even we are only appearance. if the mind stops the appearance fades and remains ... what? what exists and always has been, the only thing there is, what we are, alone. but is that nothing?. I only had some glimpses so i couldn't say

[WaveInTheOcean]

23 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

@James123 absolutely agree. what we perceive is appearance, it is not real. 

can anything real be perceived?

[James123]

35 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

@James123 absolutely agree. what we perceive is appearance, it is not real. Even we are only appearance. if the mind stops the appearance fades and remains ... what? what exists and always has been, the only thing there is, what we are, alone. but is that nothing?. I only had some glimpses so i couldn't say

Even “nothing” is something you named and labeled. So if you take an example so called deep sleep, thoughtlessness, or before birth, thats what being nothing. And the main reason why no mind meditation contemplating, because when you go deep enough within thoughtlessness, you (ego) vanishes, and real You, stay as nothing, as so called sleeping. When you experience this during the day , thoughtlessness you (ego) vanishes, it will be exactly as sleeping, which is just being, nothing. However, in order have realization this, long hours of meditation, dedication is must. Mind doesn’t leave easily. However, when it is gone, sky is clear. No thoughts or not being identified with thoughts provide that nothing has ever happened. Not even a blink. It is actually easy, whatever the monkey mind says is not there, so what is left, it is You. 

[Breakingthewall]

48 minutes ago, WaveInTheOcean said:

can anything real be perceived?

Well, one would have to ask what is perceiving. Maybe more than perceived, realized

@James123 True, in the silence is the answer and it cannot be communicated

[The0Self]

4 hours ago, James123 said:

Even “nothing” is something you named and labeled. So if you take an example so called deep sleep, thoughtlessness, or before birth, thats what being nothing. And the main reason why no mind meditation contemplating, because when you go deep enough within thoughtlessness, you (ego) vanishes, and real You, stay as nothing, as so called sleeping. When you experience this during the day , thoughtlessness you (ego) vanishes, it will be exactly as sleeping, which is just being, nothing. However, in order have realization this, long hours of meditation, dedication is must. Mind doesn’t leave easily. However, when it is gone, sky is clear. No thoughts or not being identified with thoughts provide that nothing has ever happened. Not even a blink. It is actually easy, whatever the monkey mind says is not there, so what is left, it is You. 

^^ This

There can be a distortion with thinking that appearance and knowing are the same. The knowing that is not real is the knowing “I know that’s true.” Not the appearance, which no-one makes no judgements upon.

[James123]

3 hours ago, The0Self said:

The knowing that is not real is the knowing “I know that’s true.” Not the appearance, which no-one makes no judgements upon.

There is no one to know. It is not knowing, shutting off the monkey mind. 

Not even saying “this”. Because still pointing out to something, showing a direction. 

Edited April 25, 2021 by James123

[Eternal Unity]

1 minute ago, James123 said:

There is no one to know. It is not knowing, shutting off the monkey mind. 

Not even saying “this”. Because still pointing out to something, showing a direction. 

True.

[WaveInTheOcean]

9 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Well, one would have to ask what is perceiving. Maybe more than perceived, realized

@James123

The perceiver is the perceived.

If someone insists on it being real, I will show them it is truly unreal.

If someone insists on it being unreal, I will show them it is truly real.

☯️☯️☯️

?❤️✨?????

Rest in openness.

In not-knowing.

Then go from there.

Ask: what would Love do and feel your heart

???

Edited April 25, 2021 by WaveInTheOcean

[Brittany]

On 4/23/2021 at 3:58 AM, WaveInTheOcean said:

What I am interested in is the "best way" to communicate truth//point to truth, to a normal stage orange person. Even though I'm aware all souls need to hear something different. 

But I think the best way to speak to a stage orange guy, is to take their level of consciousness/their perspective/"the ground they are standing on" and then turn it on its head; show them the paradoxes that arises when you take their belief system/logic to the extreme!

I think, thus, it is by far best -- along the way at least -- to speak to him in a way that includes both the perspective of 'something' & of 'nothing' and not just parrot one of the "stories" ( ;-) ).

If you tell to a normal stage orange guy that is inquiring into spirituality: "there is no self, so there is nothing to drop, nothing to get to, nothing to achieve", I don't think it will help him much.

Stage Orange is a dream. LOL

But even dualistically/relatively speaking , the "no-self" community has transformed a lot recently.

People like Emerson from Nothing Media is trying to bring non-duality to the Stage Orange/Yellow audience. They've done a lot to make non-duality appealing to the ego.

And many of Anna Brown's videos went viral because she was really skilled at using Instagram, which drew in a ton of Stage Orange people. Before she turned off her comments on the youtube videos, it was a bunch of confused Stage Orange people - I don't know how they stumbled on her videos. haha

Jim Newman recently was on the Sam Harris podcast which brought a ton of confused Stage Orange people to his channel. haha

Also, have you heard of Andreas Müller? He is like a Rupert Spira for the "no-self" community. His words are like a sharp knife. Very quick witted and original well-thought out responses.

Also, non-duality teachers recently are emphasizing a more AJATA-based message. (which I included an image about from Robert Wolf's book "Emptiness". I don't remember such an emphasis on AJATA in the past. This makes the message even clearer to the Western-mind.

These are some of my dualistic/relative observations of recent changes in the "no-self" community. haha