Transcending desires.

[Someone here]

@Carl-Richard @Epikur

 I don't care about embracing anything anymore.

Im just tired of word games and concepts. I have had depersonalization and used to obsess over those things which made my sense of reality more thickle and slippery. Feeling i have no purpose sucks and ruins your whole life.

 It is impossible to find the answer yet we are trapped in a constant stream of never ending seeking. Even leo can't stop seeking because he is still in the dream believing he is achieving something serious. what a fuck...

Well i guess im alive so only choice is to start living now. 

[Reciprocality]

The expectation of intrinsic meaning is met with the knowing of its non-real properties, it seems you speak of Camus "Absurd".

Funny thing is, that we will manifest actions inbedded in our values to the day we die anyway, in this sense you can become trapped in a mind and body which you following your post do not identify with.

Question now is whether the realization of non-real properties of meaning comes from that very same body or if it is deeper then the body and mind, if it is deeper then it is continual, and can not be removed and neither will it expect the material world nor the mind to construct real meaning, and this is where i believe our truest nature can express the very same love which made due for anything at all by material conception.

I have not reached this place, but i believe it is the only TRUE ethic, the one intrinsic meaning, that of selflessness.

 

It can be validified as deeper then the mind and body if it acts selflessly, by definition. Because action is only possible from values it has values, and because it can not be divided those values are true.

Edited April 20, 2021 by Reciprocality

[Reciprocality]

The seeming paradox ofcourse is that the same entity which created existence is reached when creating TRUE values (selflessness), entailing the idea that the universe has intrinsic values aswell. For it were the cause to both, and whether or not the universe has its non-valued property entangled with beings within it or not they both are equaly without intrinsic values from the discovery of the absurd.

So why would there be anything at all? Well without it god does not know his power fully, and without it he can never be qurious for its conclusion. quriosity thus will ofcourse is a prerequisite for creativity and creation.

This conclusion can be the discovery of truth trough the material which were only to be effected from the truth.

Only some gobbledygook, but do entertain it. : )

[lmfao]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

Well i guess im alive so only choice is to start living now. 

I guess so as well lol. In a nihilism here as well, and I suppose I just say "well I'm alive so may as well just let this play it's course". 

I have the strong desire though for truth and freedom from suffering, even though it looks impossible to me. Getting high states of consciousness used to feel so easy for me...now with so much biology and mental health changes I don't think it happens easily now. Nonetheless though, that's still the intention.

In trying to make that intense commitment or intention, I come across my old habits and egoic re-enforcements that distract me and stop me going all the way in. Or rather, it's like my unconscious contents come up, and I become more aggressive as my ego backlashes from my attempts to go deep. So I almost feel like I'm oscillating between the extremes of "selfishness" and "selflessness", not understanding what I am, and trying to understand both sides. 

Quote

I wasn't into this work for not suffering, I was here to improve.. now that I see there is nothing to improve.. what's left inside me ?

Maybe there's "nothing to do" or "nowhere to be", but maybe your perception of whatever "it" is isn't unbounded and free yet. 

Edited April 20, 2021 by lmfao

[blackchair]

serve humanity in some form

[Carl-Richard]

If you're joyful, you can't help yourself but to express that joy somehow. That can come off as "oh he is so motivated, striving, passionate, determined" but you're really just very joyful. If you're not motivated by lack, cultivate some joy in your life, not for the sake of motivation, but for the sake of joy.

Edited April 21, 2021 by Carl-Richard

[Someone here]

Yeah why don't i just drop all of this non duality nonsense.. forget about it and go live my life to the fullest without fear. See.. I can't.. because free will is just an illusion. This does not mean passivity.. it doesn't lock you into a particular experience where you now have to be a certain way and give everything else up. This is what the non dual bullshitters on here and teachers are talking about.. but there are absolutely no rules. THIS is not about anything.. it is not about being good. . It is not about being peaceful..it is not about being better than the average Joe that has no idea what the fuck non duality is,..it is freeeeedom. I feel like the main motivation for many is how they will be special and better than those "ignorant normal folks".. spirituality is merely about being better for most. This gives that need nothing.. and it leaves you with nothing.

Edited April 21, 2021 by Someone here

[Epikur]

11 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Yeah why don't i just drop all of this non duality nonsense.. forget about it and go live my life to the fullest without fear. See.. I can't.. because free will is just an illusion. This does not mean passivity.. it doesn't lock you into a particular experience where you now have to be a certain way and give everything else up. This is what the non dual bullshitters on here and teachers are talking about.. but there are absolutely no rules. THIS is not about anything.. it is not about being good. . It is not about being peaceful..it is not about being better than the average Joe that has no idea what the fuck non duality is,..it is freeeeedom. I feel like the main motivation for many is how they will be special and better than those "ignorant normal folks".. spirituality is merely about being better for most. This gives that need nothing.. and it leaves you with nothing.

You don't have to go full in. You can make your own spin. Non duality is to some degree what many philosophers talked about that life is an illusion but then you have to go back to life and created some space for yourself to fill in creatively. 

Anyway to get real I find 'Epikur' quite a down to earth philosopher, coach. He won't disappoint you much. He won't insult your intelligence.
 

 

[Mason Riggle]

@Someone here

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

I can't.. because free will is just an illusion.

It's the 'free' part that's the 'illusion'.   What will, will.  

There is nothing for 'you to do' because 'you' are not something that 'does things', 'you' are something that is occurring, exactly how you will. 

What is there for my organism to do that it's not already doing by itself?  Thinking? Being? Growing? 

[Someone here]

2 hours ago, Mason Riggle said:

@Someone here

It's the 'free' part that's the 'illusion'.   What will, will.  

There is nothing for 'you to do' because 'you' are not something that 'does things', 'you' are something that is occurring, exactly how you will. 

What is there for my organism to do that it's not already doing by itself?  Thinking? Being? Growing? 

There is no "i".. I can conceptually understand that. 

However.. that sense of "i" gives rise to the experience that then becomes "my life" as if i am experiencing something. Ad it "all of this" is happening to an "i". 

When You come to understand that the "i" is an illusion.. you also understand that you can not really know really if there is still an "i" there. 

So what you do? You say: "OK.. since i understand that.. I have to find a way to dissolve the " i".. then i can know the truth for what it is". And this is what you do.. you use psychedelics to achieve this.  And other methods. But 'nobody ' knows that. As Jim Newman said.

When you do psychedelics.. you have that experience. You see things for what they really are. Then your "i" comes back. And of course thinks he knows what it was seen. 

Somebody says: "This was absolutely terrifying". Leo prefers to say: "This was absolutely fantastic". 

But you see.. this is a duality. This is just an interpretation that the  "i" imposes on that experience. 

So when you come back.. you think you know what you saw. But of course you don't. What you saw was meaningless. 

It is not there for anybody. It just is. 

It is not wonderful.. unconditional love. an incredible intelligent design. It is has not a greater scheme. It is not a bigger picture. It is not even meaningless. It just is. It can't be described. 

Now why are you all guys giving such meaning to those kind of experiences? 

Why does leo talk about all this "wonderfull" things.. which can be all a fairy tale? 

The way i see it.. is that when you die, it's done. Never has really happened. Nothing needs to happen.And nobody will understand this.

It Just is. For no one. 

Leo keeps saying that this work is not for you.. It's not for your survival.

Sorry I'm just ranting and rambling here but.. 

 

 

[Mason Riggle]

11 minutes ago, Someone here said:

It Just is. For no one. 

 

yep

"It's Always Now"

Edited April 21, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[Someone here]

It's because we are under the illusion that there is a goal.. the goal is real. In that illusion there is a constant movement away from THIS. . It is a perpetual denying of this just being. The movement away from this makes it appear real and seem like there is something to achieve or get.. in order to achieve fulfillment. The fullfilment is never satisfied permanently.. only through quick fixes.. which actually is the satisfaction of fulfilling/feeding the energy of needing.. for a moment. When this is only real and you deny the unreality that this is too.you are off balance and unsatisfied.

[Guest EmptyVase]

On 20.4.2021 at 3:11 PM, Someone here said:

As I said when desire is achieved It actually multiply.. It increases.

Ever noticed the upward motion of this? After having exhausted a desire, you want something which makes you feel better.

From what I'm reading, it seems like you've exhausted whatever ideas you've had in your head. Maybe your feeling is telling you to move on and follow the upward motion?

On 20.4.2021 at 3:11 PM, Someone here said:

And you you are left with empty hands always. 

Ahh what a relief. Feels good to carry no baggage.

[Reciprocality]

8 hours ago, Someone here said:

The way i see it.. is that when you die, it's done. Never has really happened. Nothing needs to happen.And nobody will understand this.

It Just is. For no one. 

Leo keeps saying that this work is not for you.. It's not for your survival.

@Someone here I did respond once, and i will do so once more. 

 "Never has really happened", this is like saying "something is eternal" and "anyonce is plausible", is this what you mean?

You say "Nothing needs to happen" a. do you take necessity out of all emergence and being (either present or continual)? Or b. do you say that there must once be nothing happening whereby 1. no other thing can ever happen again? or 2. something may occur once more?

If the former (a) then do you not think there must be another thing then necessity which made due for existence? Is it will, is it love or what is it?

Whatever it is, do you not think it is emergent confined to the nothingness you refer to as death? 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Reciprocality

[Someone here]

@EmptyVase

19 hours ago, EmptyVase said:

Ever noticed the upward motion of this? After having exhausted a desire, you want something which makes you feel better. 

Me thinks if you experimented with what hunger actually is.. you might find its resistance to doing the work needed to get full.. rather than the lack of fullness itself.

If you're walking to the shops to buy food.. there aint suffering right in the midst of the pure doing the walking to the shops. Theres only suffering when you stop doing what will make you full(shop being closed). 

So instead of viewing desire as something that has to be quenched.. you can view it as a signal or reminder to maximize whatever it takes to get into that pure doing state. Then its fully quenched until that changes.

Sometimes the doing feels so good that the result aint worth it in the end. Sometimes what you desired wasnt the lobster but the jog to the shops.. sometimes what you desired is the growth from the doing, rather then the result from the doing. Sometimes you'll discover that thinking a desire will only be quenched once you manifest it causes suffering and a whole load of problems like fear you'll never manifest it, getting upset when results dont go your way.. toxic pickup mentality.. toxic work culture.. etc whereas if you reframed it to realizing the doing = the quenching and satisfaction itself.. those myrad of problems dissolve.

[Someone here]

17 hours ago, Reciprocality said:

Never has really happened", this is like saying "something is eternal" and "anyonce is plausible", is this what you mean?

I mean when yo die its light off forever. So it will be as if you never even existed. That makes all your striving In life futile. 

17 hours ago, Reciprocality said:

You say "Nothing needs to happen" a. do you take necessity out of all emergence and being (either present or continual)? Or b. do you say that there must once be nothing happening whereby 1. no other thing can ever happen again? or 2. something may occur once more?

No I'm saying nothing needs to happen In Order for you to be satisfied. Because you will never be satisfied with "things" because they are finite and limited and you go on chasing them forever and you never satisfy your desire. 

You never escape desire while in an embodied form and maybe even never escape it beyond that. You merely change from one desire to another. My solution to tackling lower desires that might be detrimental to you is to taste the elegance of the highest experience or realization. Then you will naturally focus on that.. and your life will have more net positivity than negativity. Of course the highest experience isn’t some heroin high. It’s God. Experience God.. and you will want to experience more. This will slowly reduce your desires for everything else. I can’t even give a shit about playing video games when I literally used almost every free moment of my teenage years playing games. Making money doesn’t interest me nearly as much. The same can be said for sex and everything else. They have all become secondary or even lower on the priority list. 

17 hours ago, Reciprocality said:

If the former (a) then do you not think there must be another thing then necessity which made due for existence? Is it will, is it love or what is it?

Whatever it is, do you not think it is emergent confined to the nothingness you refer to as death? 

I have no answers to those metaphysical questions. I don't claim to know that.  All I know and I'm aware of is that all there is.. Is the present moment. This experience right now is all of reality. And it has no explanation and no previous causes. It's 100 % mystical. I've contemplated and deeply deconstructed reality to the point where I'm beginning to be on the cusp of loosing control and going insane. So don't bare with me if you like lol 

Edited April 22, 2021 by Someone here

[Dodo]

On 20/04/2021 at 11:36 PM, Someone here said:

@Carl-Richard @Epikur

 I don't care about embracing anything anymore.

Im just tired of word games and concepts. I have had depersonalization and used to obsess over those things which made my sense of reality more thickle and slippery. Feeling i have no purpose sucks and ruins your whole life.

 It is impossible to find the answer yet we are trapped in a constant stream of never ending seeking. Even leo can't stop seeking because he is still in the dream believing he is achieving something serious. what a fuck...

Well i guess im alive so only choice is to start living now. 

The world is free of meaning so we can give it any meaning that we choose. Your meaning could be to raise the vibration of the planet/Galaxy/Universe/Multiverse in all directions of time, space and in all non-directions of no-time and no-space, forever and ever Amen! 

By the way, there could be something that not a lot of people/beings know, like whether the things we say and do here on our earthly lives matter for creating a world beyond this one. Like seeing this life as you being a seed and every small thing you do is a seed, which will sprout in eternity. Your small actions today might be something incredible in eternity.

Now that's some meaning! Imagine you will live forever in the tree that you are right now the seed of. 

 

[Someone here]

@Dodo yea I don't buy this..

2 hours ago, Dodo said:

Now that's some meaning! Imagine you will live forever in the tree that you are right now the seed of. 

 

When you're dead you're dead and that's it. Probably. Or we don't know. I'm stuck in nihilism. not in some psychotic manic depression right now my anxiety is actually relatively low and I'm very calm/even if you were to see me talk or behave in real life. But this terror is still there. I'm staring at death. Complete impermanence. Staring at the complete futility and absolute meaninglessness of everything. It's not going anywhere.. it's not doing anything. There's no goals..no ambitionsmm ..no hope..it's just this. The meaninglessness.. The fact that the meaninglessness is absolutely irrefutable. Pointless. The step ahead is complete self annihilation and the fear holds me back. It involves sacrificing everything . Absolutely everything. My sanity... my connection to my family.. but most of all me me me . 

 

[BlackMaze]

@Someone here yes but meaninglessness is also meaningless. I don't blame you though. It took me many years of suffering to just return to "normal". I think the only problem is that we take things too seriously. I'm just going to enjoy life i don't care about serious insights. Why even play a game if you can't have fun? 

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

@Dodo yea I don't buy this..

When you're dead you're dead and that's it. Probably. Or we don't know. I'm stuck in nihilism. not in some psychotic manic depression right now my anxiety is actually relatively low and I'm very calm/even if you were to see me talk or behave in real life. But this terror is still there. I'm staring at death. Complete impermanence. Staring at the complete futility and absolute meaninglessness of everything. It's not going anywhere.. it's not doing anything. There's no goals..no ambitionsmm ..no hope..it's just this. The meaninglessness.. The fact that the meaninglessness is absolutely irrefutable. Pointless. The step ahead is complete self annihilation and the fear holds me back. It involves sacrificing everything . Absolutely everything. My sanity... my connection to my family.. but most of all me me me . 

 

When you're dead you're dead?! Then why are you not dead right now... There is eternity of "time" before you were born and eternity of "time" after you die. You are so convinced that in this eternity you have never existed before and in the eternity after you will never exist again? That seems to me like a very slim chance! hehe. Things get crazy when infinity is involved... Our lives are small seeds bro! They have a lot of meaning, we are building heaven and hell with our actions and intentions (I believe). 

Edited April 22, 2021 by Dodo