Getting My Covid Vaccine

[Mannyb]

@Opo Where I live it’s not an assumption, I literally don’t know anyone who’s suffered such things.
If I knew even at least a couple that still wouldn’t be alarming. 

India has such poor sanitary conditions, I’m sending them lots of love & prayers!

You’re assuming these folks in India are healthy but that’s more than questionable. They have almost no quality of life (be it air, water, food...) and many suffer from malnutrition..

So that’s still not a good reason to take the vaccine. Specially when in my country, most prison inmates who live in horrible conditions were asymptomatic. 

You have tho made a good case for the vaccination of Indians who were already living in poor conditions and vulnerable.

[Opo]

@Mannyb Is looking at people around you an accurate way of judging risk? 

[Opo]

6 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

@OpoYou’re assuming these folks in India are healthy but that’s more than questionable. They have almost no quality of life (be it air, water, food...) and many suffer from malnutrition..

Indians being immune to viruses is a stereotype. 

I'm not saying it's 100% true but they don't have weak immunities. 

[Mannyb]

20 minutes ago, Opo said:

@Mannyb Is looking at people around you an accurate way of judging risk? 

Why not? Why is TV and media better when we’ve been lied to for so long? If people around you start getting really sick your behavior will be influenced by it. 
 

 

17 minutes ago, Opo said:

Indians being immune to viruses is a stereotype. 

I'm not saying it's 100% true but they don't have weak immunities. 

I’m saying the exact opposite lol They are far from immune, their system is compromised by their environment is what I’m saying. How do you know they don’t have weak immunities when every thing points in the opposite direction? 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Mannyb

[Consept]

31 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

Where I live it’s not an assumption, I literally don’t know anyone who’s suffered such things.
If I knew even at least a couple that still wouldn’t be alarming. 

I think this is possibly the weakest argument I've heard and keep hearing. 

By your logic if you don't know anyone with cancer then cancer isn't a valid issue and we should stop researching into it. 

[Opo]

22 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

Why not? Why is TV and media better when we’ve been lied to for so long? If people around you start getting really sick your behavior will be influenced by it. 

What if your friends died in a car crash? 

Would you never go in a car again? 

Or would you suddenly say just because people around me died doesn't mean that all cars are unsafe. 

22 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

I’m saying the exact opposite lol They are far from immune, their system is compromised by their environment is what I’m saying. How do you know they don’t have weak immunities when every thing points in the opposite direction? 

Yes and I'm saying the opposite. 

Could you please tell me everything. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Opo

[Mannyb]

16 minutes ago, Consept said:

I think this is possibly the weakest argument I've heard and keep hearing. 

By your logic if you don't know anyone with cancer then cancer isn't a valid issue and we should stop researching into it. 

I won’t judge your argument unlike what you’ve just done, but please explain to me how cancer is contagious. 

[Mannyb]

16 minutes ago, Opo said:

What if your friends died in a car crash? 

Would you never go in a car again? 

Or would you suddenly say just because people around me died doesn't mean that all cars are unsafe. 

Yes and I'm saying the opposite. 

Could you please tell me everything. 

Since when are car crashes contagious? lol cmon man And if all of a sudden a lot of people around me start dying in car crashes I’d probably feel quite unsafe in a car, that’s completely understandable, you would too. 

Being unhealthy compromises your immune system, doesn’t matter if you’re saying the opposite. 
And what “everything” do you want me to tell you? 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Mannyb

[Opo]

15 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

Since when are car crashes contagious? lol cmon man And if all of a sudden a lot of people around me start dying in car crashes I’d probably feel quite unsafe in a car, that’s completely understandable, you would too. 

Who's talking about contagion? 

We were talking about how accurate are the ways we use to come to our conclusions. 

Not just feel but how can you enter a car if the chances of death are so big?

15 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

Being unhealthy compromises your immune system, doesn’t matter if you’re saying the opposite. 

Lol when did I say the opposite? 

16 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

And what “everything” do you want me to tell you? 

"How do you know they don’t have weak immunities when every thing points in the opposite direction?" 

[Consept]

1 hour ago, Mannyb said:

Where I live it’s not an assumption, I literally don’t know anyone who’s suffered such things.
If I knew even at least a couple that still wouldn’t be alarming. 

It's not about whether cancer is contagious, your argument (correct me if I'm wrong) is that part of the reason you don't think covid is an issue or at least as much of an issue as has been made out, is because in your experience of people in your town and proximity they haven't had the negative effects that have been outlined by other commentators. 

So what I'm saying, is using your logic that if you don't see anyone in your vicinity with certain effects from a condition, I could in theory make the same argument that I haven't seen anyone with cancer so therefore cancer is not an issue. I'm sure you don't need me to say you can change out cancer for any condition. A better example might be I don't know anyone with malaria so therefore there shouldn't be a need for a vaccine in Africa, maybe it isn't really that bad because I haven't seen it personally. 

It's not a personal attack on you, it's just a very poor argument. 

[Mannyb]

6 minutes ago, Opo said:

Who's talking about contagion? 

We were talking about how accurate are the ways we use to come to our conclusions. 

Not just feel but how can you enter a car if the chances of death are so big?

Lol when did I say the opposite? 

"How do you know they don’t have weak immunities when every thing points in the opposite direction?" 

I’m talking about contagion, that’s how Covid seems to spread. Maybe you were talking about coming to conclusions but not myself, assuming yet again ? 

By everything I already told you what I mean, their living standards or lack thereof. Making them immunocompromised and thus good potential candidates for vaccinations.

[Tetcher]

5 minutes ago, Consept said:

It's not about whether cancer is contagious, your argument (correct me if I'm wrong) is that part of the reason you don't think covid is an issue or at least as much of an issue as has been made out, is because in your experience of people in your town and proximity they haven't had the negative effects that have been outlined by other commentators. 

So what I'm saying, is using your logic that if you don't see anyone in your vicinity with certain effects from a condition, I could in theory make the same argument that I haven't seen anyone with cancer so therefore cancer is not an issue. I'm sure you don't need me to say you can change out cancer for any condition. A better example might be I don't know anyone with malaria so therefore there shouldn't be a need for a vaccine in Africa, maybe it isn't really that bad because I haven't seen it personally. 

It's not a personal attack on you, it's just a very poor argument. 

It's not necessarily a bad argument from an individual perspective. He doesn't know anyone with malaria, it doesn't concern him much then who would you be to step in his life, talk about it a lot and push him to make malaria a big thing in his life ?

[Mannyb]

9 minutes ago, Consept said:

It's not about whether cancer is contagious, your argument (correct me if I'm wrong) is that part of the reason you don't think covid is an issue or at least as much of an issue as has been made out, is because in your experience of people in your town and proximity they haven't had the negative effects that have been outlined by other commentators. 

So what I'm saying, is using your logic that if you don't see anyone in your vicinity with certain effects from a condition, I could in theory make the same argument that I haven't seen anyone with cancer so therefore cancer is not an issue. I'm sure you don't need me to say you can change out cancer for any condition. A better example might be I don't know anyone with malaria so therefore there shouldn't be a need for a vaccine in Africa, maybe it isn't really that bad because I haven't seen it personally. 

It's not a personal attack on you, it's just a very poor argument. 

Lol How is it a poor argument to base my behavior on my lived experience?

[Opo]

1 minute ago, Mannyb said:

Lol How is it a poor argument to base my behavior on my lived experience?

Read my comments about car crashes and where it leads. 

[Mannyb]

@Tetcher ?? 

[Consept]

46 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

Lol How is it a poor argument to base my behavior on my lived experience?

It's a poor argument for a couple reasons. Let's say everyone took up your logic and let's say covid is as serious as is being made out. Using your logic only those directly affected would take it seriously or take any precautions, that means when it first started and say only a few million people had it, by the rest of the population not taking it seriously it means that it will spread quicker and become more serious in terms of hospitals being backed up, as well as deaths, illness etc. Which means your logic will always lead to the situation being worse. 

The other thing is let's say you had a disease and this disease affected 5% of the population. It was disease that can seriously impact your life. Would it make sense to you if people doubted that the disease existed or was as severe as you, who has the disease claim? Because of this doubt there isn't funding for research and people who maybe carry it asymptomatically refuse to take any precautions or even get tested, simply because they don't know anyone that has it. 

As humans we are all connected as much as you think youre completely individual it just doesn't play out like that. It's like one branch of the tree saying 'the tree getting cut down doesn't affect me because I'm not getting cut down' 

[Mannyb]

@Consept Your “Let’s say” is not based on reality, it’s just you hypothesizing. 

And as humans we share our being so I’m not saying I’m completely individual, quite the contrary, again an assumption. 

I thought I could get a conversation going but it’s just hypotheses and assumptions.

If you want to start talking about reality let me know otherwise I’m out and we can agree to disagree. 
 

[Tetcher]

10 minutes ago, Consept said:

It's a poor argument for a couple reasons. Let's say everyone took up your logic and let's say covid is as serious as is being made out. Using your logic only those directly affected would take it seriously or take any precautions, that means when it first started and say only a few million people had it, by the rest of the population not taking it seriously it means that it will spread quicker and become more serious in terms of hospitals being backed up, as well as deaths, illness etc. Which means your logic will always lead to the situation being worse. 

The other thing is let's say you had a disease and this disease affected 5% of the population. It was disease that can seriously impact your life. Would it make sense to you if people doubted that the disease existed or was as severe as you, who has the disease claim? Because of this doubt there isn't funding for research and people who maybe carry it asymptomatically refuse to take any precautions or even get tested, simply because they don't know anyone that has it. 

As humans we are all connected as much as you think youre completely individual it just doesn't play out like that. It's like one branch of the tree saying 'the tree getting cut down doesn't affect me because I'm not getting cut down' 

You're like nice guys, you want to out debate another human being into doing what you want or what you think is right. And the more he doesn't care the more you dive into mental constructs and extrapolations. Interestingly I didn't see you do that to Leo Gura who chickened out of the vaccine in this very thread, which would tend to show a somewhat of a power dynamic at play, namely you don't dare to do to Leo what you're doing to Mannyb.

[Consept]

6 minutes ago, Tetcher said:

You're like nice guys, you want to out debate another human being into doing what you want or what you think is right. And the more he doesn't care the more you dive into mental constructs and extrapolations. Interestingly I didn't see you do that to Leo Gura who chickened out of the vaccine in this very thread, which would tend to show a somewhat of a power dynamic at play, namely you don't dare to do to Leo what you're doing to Mannyb.

Well no, I haven't actually stated my position in this conversation. I'm just saying it's faulty logic, but I notice that there hasn't been an actual reply that focuses on my points from either of you, its just the usual attack on character or criticising the use of examples lol that's a new one. 

Also it's a long thread and I haven't seen what you said Leo saying, but just because it's Leo it wouldn't stop me from addressing it, I've disagreed with plenty he's said before. So I'm not sure what you're advocating for, are you saying faulty logic shouldn't be questioned? 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Consept

[Mannyb]

@Consept How’s it faulty? Where’s the attack and who’s being attacked? Why do you feel attacked?
I just wanted to talk about our reality and not go into “what if” and “let’s say”.
Do you want to control how others reply to you? 

Here explain this following logic & tell me if it’s faulty. Elon Musk doesn’t want to get the vaccine, why? A billionaire who put a car in space and has access to a lot of privileged info is choosing not to get vaccinated. He believes like myself, for now, that the elderly and immunocompromised should get it. What’s so bad about that reasoning? 
 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Mannyb