Pentagon Confirms New UFO Video

[DocWatts]

21 minutes ago, Gregp said:

@DocWatts The problem for me is not that my worldview would change so massively. The thing is there just isn't good proof. Those spots on a radar which works with AI are not convincing. 

I'm of a similar mind that nothing conclusive has been proven, but I do recognize that it's at least a possiblity (even if it's not necessarily the most likely explanation).

While I've yet to be fully convinced, I think that aliens are actually less unlikely than some of the alternative explanations that have been proposed (such as the idea that some nation or military has technology that's massively more advanced than anything that currently exists, and has somehow kept hidden from the rest of the world).

Both hard skeptics and hard believers are mistaken in my view, which is that aliens are a plausible interpretation for at least some of these events, but not one that's supported by conclusive evidence (at least so far).

Edited June 2, 2021 by DocWatts

[dlof]

2 hours ago, 4201 said:

None of this is evidence though. If you have extra evidence that UFOs are aliens feel free to post it in this thread. All of the blabla that comes with it has no value, either the evidence speaks for itself or not.

And here we've come back full-circle to the value of credible witness testimony again. 

Again, witness testimony has enough weight to sentence someone to death in a court of law, it's not something to just ignore.

[Consilience]

1 hour ago, DocWatts said:

As an aside, I find it endlessly Interesting how one of the visionary scientists whose discoveries paved the way for quantum mechanics (namely the photoelectric effect and brownian motion) could never come to fully accept the eventual implications of his discoveries.

The additional irony being that Einstein's Relativity Theory was itself built upon the work of previous scientists (such as Max Planck) who themselves wouldn't or couldn't accept the implications of their own discoveries.

Agreed! 

[DocWatts]

4 minutes ago, dlof said:

And here we've come back full-circle to the value of credible witness testimony again. 

Again, witness testimony has enough weight to sentence someone to death in a court of law, it's not something to just ignore.

Our legal system (at least in the US) has sentenced plenty of innocent people based on mistaken eyewitness testimony (that was later overturned by DNA evidence), so I'm not so sure that the methods of the Legal System is what you want to be using as a Benchmark for Truth.

[dlof]

27 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

Our legal system (at least in the US) has sentenced plenty of innocent people based on mistaken eyewitness testimony (that was later overturned by DNA evidence), so I'm not so sure that the methods of the Legal System is what you want to be using as a Benchmark for Truth.

It's a good foundation, it's a system where the stakes are huge and credible witness testimony has a lot of weight. The numbers matter as well, two eye witnesses vs hundreds makes a big difference. Nothing is infallible, I'm sure you understand that science gets things wrong sometimes as well.

My point which I consistently need to hammer home here is that witness testimony is not something you just ignore. Some people are hung up on the idea of scientists needing to confirm everything like they are the final arbitrators of what's going on in the world. What scientists? A biologist? A physicist? A mathematician? An astrophysicist?

Things happen and sometimes all we have are people's testimony to confirm it. How do we know that Caesar crossed the Rubicon in 49 BC? Written records, testimony... not scientists on their hands and knees carbon dating footprints or something. How do we know we should trust those written records? Because of credible witness testimony, how they line up with other written records and so on. Our understanding of the world and history is built on this stuff.

If you have all the evidence lined up for UFO's and aliens and you have to make a conclusive decision on whether it's real or not, you'd need to think like a lawyer or a judge. Just being a biologist probably won't help you, or just being an astrophysicist probably won't help you either. But you could get their opinions on certain narrow things where they have their expertise if that helps in any way.

These hundreds of witnesses, are they lying? What's their motive, these four people who passed several lie detector tests and all saw the same thing.. are they lying or telling the truth? Think like someone's life is at stake and you have to make a decision based on the evidence. So you want to be as close to certainty as you can be. Now you've got several ex-military personnel saying they saw UFO's disable a missile silo with lasers. Hundreds of witness testimony, group sightings and abductions, military encounters etc. You might even call in Paul Hellyer ex-defence minister of Canada who's saying that upon reviewing the evidence he's certain several species are visiting the earth (see the video on previous page) or the former Israeli Space Security chief who says we're being visited. You weigh it all up and you come to a conclusion based on all the evidence at hand as if someone's life was at stake. What's the likely conclusion.

Edited June 2, 2021 by dlof

[DocWatts]

3 hours ago, dlof said:

My point which I consistently need to hammer home here is that witness testimony is not something you just ignore. Some people are hung up on the idea of scientists needing to confirm everything like they are the final arbitrators of what's going on in the world. What scientists? A biologist? A physicist? A mathematician? An astrophysicist?

I would never argue that eyewitness testimony is worthless, but it does have serious limitations as a methodology for validating empirical claims that lie far outside of most people's lived experience.

Is eyewitness testimony useful for more mundane things such as a recalled conversation, or the make and model of a car that pulled away from a building? Sure.

But for bizarre things that completely outside of normal everyday experience, do I trust most people to be able to correctly interpret whatever the hell it is that they think they're seeing? Not so much.

Now I am willing to give more of a benefit of the doubt to people like David Fravor who at least have several years of expertise that's directly relevant to their claim, and is part of the reason I'm not completely dismissive of the alien hypothesis. If nothing else, it at least demonstrates that there's something worth looking in to. 

Of course Scientific investigation has limitations as well, but it's a much better methodology for making sense of these types of claims than just taking people at their word.

If the conclusions that were being made from eyewitness testimony were much more modest in their ontological claims, most reasonable people wouldn't have a problem with it, ie: "There have been sightings of many strange areal phenomena over the last 50 years that could be interpreted as aliens."

Even if eyewitness testimony could tell us beyond a shadow of a doubt that we were dealing with is alien technology, we would still want to know what these objects actually are, what they're doing here, how, etc. Which would warrant further investigation using other methodologies.

Edited June 3, 2021 by DocWatts

[Blackhawk]

2 hours ago, dlof said:

And here we've come back full-circle to the value of credible witness testimony again. 

Again, witness testimony has enough weight to sentence someone to death in a court of law, it's not something to just ignore.

In that case also Bigfoot, Loch Ness monster, tooth fairy, etc. exists.

There's no limit to what people claim to have seen.

[Shin]

3 minutes ago, Blackhawk said:

In that case also Bigfoot, Loch Ness monster, tooth fairy, etc. exists.

There's no limit to what people claim to have seen.

They all exist.

[Blackhawk]

12 minutes ago, Shin said:

They all exist.

Okey dokey.

[Opo]

https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/nqj4o4/birds_satellites_plane_and_ufo_that_changes/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

 

[Shin]

3 hours ago, Peter Miklis said:

@Leo Gura Those could very well be nazi's that survived the WW2. They were also developing this type of technology? maybe the base in Arctica is real after all

Who knows ?

Did you go to arctica ? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 Hail Hydra  

[Victor van Rijn]

Do you know this farsight initiative? They explore all kinds of topics based on remote viewing abilities:
 

 

[Victor van Rijn]

More on this topic by Bentinho:
 

 

 

a

Edited June 3, 2021 by Victor van Rijn

[Shin]

On 6/2/2021 at 5:02 PM, 4201 said:

Maybe I'm totally wrong and the "opposite pole" you describe are actually triggered by "UFO evidence" and this evidence shatters their worldview but IMO, the fact Leo and so many others are so eager to believe in aliens after seeing UFO footage is much more "triggering" for some.

For many Leo is a role model and it's a bit like discovering your role model is a flat earther. The dude you've been listening to videos for ages, the dude who got you into meditation and changed your life. Yes the same dude looks at blurry pentagon footage and is already 100% convinced those are evidence of aliens, refuses to provide further proof and calls anyone who disagree with him "dense".

I think this is a factor but also the frustration of people being naive and buying into theories so fast. It's easy to judge other people for doing that when you already dislike yourself for doing the same in other areas of life. "Ah if only I wasn't so naive and didn't buy into every bullshit story my mind creates!" this can make a lot of struggle that is then projected outward to other people who buy into cheap stories online.

At the end of the day nobody would cry if those UFOs were actually confirmed to be aliens. Nobody would "suffer a shattered worldview". I don't think anyone actually cares about defending that no-alien worldview it's much more about the meta-POV of "Do I believe cheap stories? Am I able to admit I don't know?".

Yeah the fact that Leo so vehemently tells us that Aliens are there and we are fools to not see that is a bit weird.

If he had direct experience or studied the field and dig quite a lot that's understandable that for him it makes no doubt, but for most people who didn't it's the same as being a flat earther like you said.

Now I'm not saying there is actually enough proofs if you dig deep enough, that's just a point I'm making.

Another points to consider, maybe Aliens don't use or are made of the same things like we do, and I don't mean that just as new physical materials to be found out there in the universe, I mean literally not physical, like they transcended physically entirely.

Which may be a reason for how their ships moves (and maybe there are not ships, but aliens directly), and also another reason for why we can't actually take good pictures of them, cause they can modify the perceptions of other "lower beings" and materials see things.

They could also come from other dimensions, which could explain again why we can't track them down, cause they can simply go back to this other dimensional plane with ease.

I had so much more to say, I should have wrote it down a few days ago lol

 

[HelpMeImanUnenlighte]

Note: it could be a distraction from real problems. We're heading into high inflation and uncharted territory. Why would the pentagon release this if they didn't know what it was?

[HelpMeImanUnenlighte]

On 4/17/2021 at 5:44 AM, Leo Gura said:

It only seems too vast to a narrow mind.

The problem isn't the evidence, it's your closedness to it.

Quote

Some things are not explained by your philosophy...

~ Shakespeare

[4201]

1 hour ago, HelpMeImanUnenlighte said:

Note: it could be a distraction from real problems. We're heading into high inflation and uncharted territory. Why would the pentagon release this if they didn't know what it was?

The GOP knows their only way to reelection is to crank the conspiracy theories to the max. They prob used some lobbying...

[Opo]

 

13 minutes ago, 4201 said:

The GOP knows their only way to reelection is to crank the conspiracy theories to the max. They prob used some lobbying...

If you're gonna believe all this just start believing in aliens and be done with it. 

[4201]

14 minutes ago, Opo said:

 

If you're gonna believe all this just start believing in aliens and be done with it. 

It sure is far fetched hahaha, I wouldn't say I believe it but it's an entertaining idea. I'm curious what they will come up with in 2024. I don't think they can win again with Trump so what are they going to try? They are very funded so it's not like they won't try anything.

[Opo]

7 minutes ago, 4201 said:

It sure is far fetched hahaha, I wouldn't say I believe it but it's an entertaining idea. I'm curious what they will come up with in 2024. I don't think they can win again with Trump so what are they going to try? They are very funded so it's not like they won't try anything.

Actually Democrats got more money this election. 

Hard to predict 2024 if he can he'll try but idn how will people react. What I would give if everyone just ignored him...  

It's possible that he runs for the speaker of the house in 2022.