What if it is absolutely effortless and easy to BE The Truth NOW?

[Someone here]

@Gesundheit there is both physical and psychological aspects to suffering. 

33 minutes ago, allislove said:

@Someone here

To have sickness there should be reality inside which it manifests. That reality is never disturbed. And that reality is the only reality, your true nature.

Whatever dude. I disagree. 

[Gesundheit]

10 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Gesundheit there is both physical and psychological aspects to suffering. 

Of course.

The same way you can harm yourself physically and feel pain, you can harm yourself psychologically and suffer. The difference is that with psychological harm, you cause it to yourself unconsciously without even knowing, and sometimes suffering becomes prominent only after years of self-harm. So, in order to heal, you'd have to uncover the real causes of your suffering, which is done through awareness and enlightenment work. This is not to say that all suffering can be removed 100%, or that suffering doesn't exist, but that most suffering is self-created and can be removed.

[allislove]

3 hours ago, Someone here said:

Whatever dude. I disagree. 

Why do you stay in prison when the door is so wide open?
Move outside the tangle of fear-thinking.
The entrance door to the sanctuary is inside you. 

Rumi

[RedLine]

4 hours ago, Someone here said:

 

No. Suffering is physical. 

 

That is pain, not suffering.

[Mason Riggle]

I like to think of 'suffering/desire' as attachment to the notion that things should be different than how they are.   I see suffering/desire as a necessary part of 'being', without which there would be no cause for change. Everything would be static, and unchanging. 

How would you desire to eat, if you never suffered from hunger? 

Edited April 2, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[Someone here]

Pain IS suffering. 

Stop making that silly distinction between the two. 

[Consilience]

5 hours ago, Gesundheit said:

@Consilience

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/bed-sores/symptoms-causes/syc-20355893

I've never once had any of these types of symptoms, nor have I ever met or heard of meditators getting these types of symptoms from meditation. This type of thing is for extremely frail and immobile individuals. Like dude look at these risk factors:

"Your risk of developing bedsores is higher if you have difficulty moving and can't change position easily while seated or in bed. Risk factors include:

Immobility. This might be due to poor health, spinal cord injury and other causes.

Incontinence. Skin becomes more vulnerable with extended exposure to urine and stool.

Lack of sensory perception. Spinal cord injuries, neurological disorders and other conditions can result in a loss of sensation. An inability to feel pain or discomfort can result in not being aware of warning signs and the need to change position.

Poor nutrition and hydration. People need enough fluids, calories, protein, vitamins and minerals in their daily diets to maintain healthy skin and prevent the breakdown of tissues.

Medical conditions affecting blood flow. Health problems that can affect blood flow, such as diabetes and vascular disease, can increase the risk of tissue damage such as bedsores."

None of this is linked to high level meditators lol. 

This would be like me claiming high protein diets are dangerous and then referencing research on diabetics on dialysis as evidence. Two very different populations. 

The fact is, if you're healthy, and active, sitting down without moving for a couple of hours is fine for the body assuming you're also moving, exercising, practicing yoga, etc. And again, this is something the body can adapt to - physical pliancy is a real phenomena for meditators. 

Shinzen Young, for example, has done loads of SDS sitting; he's fine. Moreover, SDS is a classic zen practice and there are many zen practitioners who have spend years doing this type of training without these types of symptoms. The people who hurt themselves are those who aren't listening to their bodies and push beyond their limitations. 

[Consilience]

5 hours ago, Someone here said:

What is SDS? 

Strong Determination Sitting

You sit with the intention of not moving for an allotted amount of time. The only other rule is do not hurt the body. This rule is a higher priority than your intention to not move.

[Gianna]

"Who are you if you cannot think" - @soularlight 

I love this!!! Thank you for sharing. 

[Gianna]

1 hour ago, Consilience said:

Strong Determination Sitting

You sit with the intention of not moving for an allotted amount of time. The only other rule is do not hurt the body. This rule is a higher priority than your intention to not move.

Okay, I did not know this rule about SDS. I have literally sat for 45 minutes straight while my leg was asleep and did not move– pretty painful!! LOL! 

[Gianna]

1 hour ago, Mason Riggle said:

I like to think of 'suffering/desire' as attachment to the notion that things should be different than how they are.   I see suffering/desire as a necessary part of 'being', without which there would be no cause for change. Everything would be static, and unchanging. 

How would you desire to eat, if you never suffered from hunger? 

This is great! 

[Gesundheit]

@Consilience

9 hours ago, Consilience said:

The fact is, if you're healthy, and active, sitting down without moving for a couple of hours is fine for the body assuming you're also moving, exercising, practicing yoga, etc. And again, this is something the body can adapt to - physical pliancy is a real phenomena for meditators. 

Shinzen Young, for example, has done loads of SDS sitting; he's fine. Moreover, SDS is a classic zen practice and there are many zen practitioners who have spend years doing this type of training without these types of symptoms. The people who hurt themselves are those who aren't listening to their bodies and push beyond their limitations. 

Yes, SDS is a brute force technique, and it's risky, so it shouldn't be a long-term technique and should be done rather minimalistically and carefully. That's why I rarely meditate in a sitting position. Most of my meditation practice is done while walking.

Also, no one can say zen practitioners don't have any symptoms unless they have done some research and studies into them. It's just wise to be informed and careful, and we agree on this.

[soularlight]

On 4/1/2021 at 1:51 PM, Gesundheit said:

I don't think effortlessness equals happiness. Maybe OP does, in which case they would be deluded, imo.

Who are you to say who is deluded or not? Who are you talking about any way? Do you know me? Do you know my experience? Perhaps effortlessness equals happiness for me, and perhaps that is my direct experience. Am I deluded because I am happy effortlessely?

I wish you love, peace and freedom. I wish you effortless happiness. I wish you all the good. I really do. You are myself, after all. 

Edited April 3, 2021 by soularlight

[Gesundheit]

17 minutes ago, soularlight said:

Who are you to say who is deluded or not? Who are you talking about any way? Do you know me? Do you know my experience? Perhaps effortlessness equals happiness for me, and perhaps that is my direct experience. Am I deluded because I am happy effortlessely?

I wish you love, peace and freedom. I wish you effortless happiness. I wish you all the good. I really do. You are myself, after all. 

I am a reasonable human being. I don't know you or your experience, neither do I need to. I just know that suffering is inevitable in any living form. So, anyone who claims otherwise is deluded or lying. Nothing personal against you, but you're yet to have some rude awakenings. I'll see you in hell.

1 minute ago, soularlight said:

Perhaps effortlessness equals happiness for me, and perhaps that is my direct experience. Am I deluded because I am happy effortlessely?

You are deluded because you care about my opinion of your insight, so that supports my initial thought that you are deluded about your insight.

[soularlight]

24 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

I am a reasonable human being. I don't know you or your experience, neither do I need to. I just know that suffering is inevitable in any living form. So, anyone who claims otherwise is deluded or lying. Nothing personal against you, but you're yet to have some rude awakenings. I'll see you in hell.

You are deluded because you care about my opinion of your insight, so that supports my initial thought that you are deluded about your insight.

Really, I am not carrying any weight from what you have said. It is just not true to me. My heart is saying that the idea you are sharing is false and not in alignment with my Inner Being. I am discerning between your words and who you are. Who you are is not this message that you have written, and therefore I am not really taking it seriously. You are beautiful.