Impermanence

[Nahm]

 

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infinite dance.  This doesn't quite sit well with me.

I know right. Feels a little ‘off’. What if ‘dance’ = appearance?  If eternal infinite intelligence were appearing as experience, and in appearing, forgets that it is eternal infinite intelligence, there could certainly be the experience of finite thought, and time, and thoughts like permanent, impermanent, real, unreal, void, nothing, etc. 

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Of course the concepts are just scaffolding, but the scaffolding helps to bump steer in the right direction towards realization.

Seems like you’re going in the right inquiry direction imo. I’d suggest less argue sentiment, or framing in the approach, and a more self inquiring orientation. 

[snowyowl]

On 19/03/2021 at 4:52 PM, Flyboy said:

I'm simply pointing out that "impermanence" as a categorical absolute seems overstated to me, as even the word "impermanence" is itself a concept and idea that MUST by definition be less than IT.

You're perfectly right of course, but for different reasons   Thing is, the Buddhist 'lists' are shorthand to help you remember the headlines of the teachings, but they're more nuanced when you look at the detail. The full teaching is (from Wikipedia page on Three Marks of Existence): 

sabbe saṅkhārā aniccā — "all saṅkhāras (conditioned things) are impermanent"
sabbe saṅkhārā dukkhā — "all saṅkhāras are unsatisfactory"
sabbe dhammā anattā — "all dharmas (conditioned or unconditioned things) are not self"

So unconditioned things can be permanent, according to Buddhists. Conditioned, to me, means something like subject to the law of cause and effect, operating through time. In that case, this truth of impermanence is a kind of truism, saying that time-bound things are impermanent! At least if I've understood this right. How to realise the unconditioned - that's the real work. 

Edited March 20, 2021 by snowyowl

[Mu_]

@Flyboy   If the word impermanence and what its signifying is keeping you locked in a debate if even that is true and if so, can someone prove it, my advice to you would be to let it go, its ultimately not important. 

The flavor of the soup that Buddhism and awakening is pointing is whats important, not the ques, words and pointers used to help the mind drop such desires such as attachment or wanting to keep something longer then is physically possible.  Again, the words are just meant to awaken that magical Aha.  If you get to focused and combative around it, its lost its usefulness.

[Jodistrict]

Tibetan Buddhism has a tradition of debating Buddhist logic.  It would be interesting to get the answer of a Tibetan Buddhist monk.  A  Zen Master will just hit you over the head with a stick.  That works too.

[Inliytened1]

Just now, Jodistrict said:

Tibetan Buddhism has a tradition of debating Buddhist logic.  It would be interesting to get the answer of a Tibetan Buddhist monk.  A  Zen Master will just hit you over the head with a stick.  That works too.

Don't glorify Buddhism it's a trap.  If you become Infinity there is no need to resort to a so called monk.