How Do You Know What You Desire?

[DimmedBulb]

I have a hard time understanding my own emotions and thoughts, as well as recognizing where they come from (external or internal). What ways are there to know what it is I want for myself? Is fear making me apathetic enough to not see it?

[abrakamowse]

@DimmedBulb  I think in that link I posted at the bottom of this, it's explained better than anything I can post here, take a look...

 

http://www.buddhanet.net/4noble12.htm

Edited October 17, 2016 by abrakamowse

[DimmedBulb]

@abrakamowse "It is not about identifying with desires in any way; it’s about recognizing desire."

I don't get the difference between the two.

[abrakamowse]

 

3 hours ago, DimmedBulb said:

@abrakamowse "It is not about identifying with desires in any way; it’s about recognizing desire."

I don't get the difference between the two.

When you have a feeling or desire, let's say you have the desire of becoming a millionaire or you want to be the best poker player of the world.

If you identify with the desire, you will say "I am the best poker player of the world" or "I am a millionaire". By identifying with the desire you will act accordingly to what you have in mind it represent "the best poker player in the world".

But, if you just recognize that becoming the great poker player is a desire, and just that. You will act more freely. Not constrained to what you think you have to do to be "the best poker player". You just observe the desire, recognize it and take it or leave it.

If you feel identified with the desire, the desire will become "you".

I don't know if I am explaining myself clearly. In practice you will notice the difference, when you begin to observe your behavior and patterns in your personality. Recognizing is like "observing" your desires.

Edited October 18, 2016 by abrakamowse

[DimmedBulb]

@abrakamowse So it becomes less prescriptive, for lack of a better word, if you recognize it as opposed to identify with it?

[abrakamowse]

2 minutes ago, DimmedBulb said:

@abrakamowse So it becomes less prescriptive, for lack of a better word, if you recognize it as opposed to identify with it?

It loses power... you feel like the desire is not "you"... or yours... so, you can decide better how to act. You can do nothing if you don't want to.

When you are identified with it, you will go after it unconsciously.

[DimmedBulb]

@abrakamowse And unconsciousness is bad, from what I've been told by Buddha.

"Heedfulness is the Deathless path,
heedlessness, the path to death.
Those who are heedful do not die,
heedless are like the dead."

It's rather difficult to fathom, especially because I'm new to Buddhist philosophy.

[Nathalie]

@DimmedBulb why do you want to see a difference beetwen both? I my opinion there is none, I think everything is outside and inside so to speak.. If you dig deep, you remarke that every single wish you have is conditioned by the world you're living in, familly, friends, publicity, school,  each kind of relationship etc..

Once you realize that "your" desires are just a conditioning and not a part of you, and begin to question it (like you do), you get step by step more free. Peace and real freedom are absolutly desireless. If you reach this state, you are able to enjoy what happens to you (what ever it is) and to release it over and over again..

therefore Heedlessness is a kind of dead right now (because you don't realise that life is happening)

and Heedfulness is life right now, no future, no past and so logically no desire

Does it make sense for you?

 

 

Edited October 18, 2016 by MartineF

[abrakamowse]

@DimmedBulb  We are unconscious now , but we "think" we are not. I had a glimpse of what it is to be enlightened, an epiphany some time ago. And the difference is exactly like Buddha says, we are dead now (dead - like).

Life is in mindfulness, in no desire, in pure love, but... you have to stop desiring to achieve it. If you desire enlightenment, that is a trap. You won't achieve it and if you stop desiring so you get enlightened is a trap too. Because there's still desire.

I know is confuse but that's how it is and that's why is so difficult to attain. There's really nothing to attain. It's a big paradox, the only thing you can do is to calm your mind and it the shift to enlightenment will happen by itself, without a "you".

[YoungSeeker]

It feels like a lot of our desires are coming from the outside. That's what I believed for a long time. It seems true. Society tells us we need family, nice car, nice house, money, tells that you need to be a good person... But if you really think about it then you'll realize that it's coming from your own mind. The mind is assigning meaning to everything. If you saw an ad and they told you to buy this and that you'll think that this desire came from the outside. But there's no real meaning in the product they promoted in this ad. Your mind gives the meaning to it and tells you: "Go and buy shit".

[DimmedBulb]

@MartineF I think it's a very scary idea.

@abrakamowse It's extremely confusing and that's only the theory.

@YoungSeeker This is why competition is stupid. It makes people think rewards are the goal and that without them we can't be happy. So much neurosis is being fed from the first moment you set foot in a school.

[Frogfucius]

 

@DimmedBulb I would say the only thing we truly desire is to eliminate the attachment to desired outcomes, which is a desire itself, so PARADOX!!! The elimination of needing any particular outcome or circumstance = permanent happiness. We all want happiness, right? Isn’t that what the human game is about?

As long as we desire something, how can we be happy? I can say for certain in my own experience, every time I got something I desired – a video game, money, a good job, a pay raise, good grades in university education, a nice car, sex, food, alcohol, and so forth – it has never made me sustainably happy. It will give me pleasure for a time, but after a few days, weeks, and so forth, I’m back to being my unfulfilled self. Things are back to being out of my control, I’m back to being the victim. I fucking hate it.

I think to truly be happy, I need to just go with the flow of life, and completely eliminate my attachment to any outcome. I can still enjoy pleasures, but I don’t NEED them. That’s very hard to do, especially for someone who has played victim their whole life like me. I need to go with the current of life, and stop fucking fighting it.

[DimmedBulb]

@Frogfucius If I'd look at all the stuff I don't have constantly, I'd be unhappy permanently. You can't fight poison with poison, even if it helps in the short run.

[Nathalie]

@DimmedBulb

14 hours ago, DimmedBulb said:

I think it's a very scary idea

The idea.. maybe, but the journey, one undertakes to letting all this silly stuff drop, is really exciting and liberating

[abrakamowse]

“Make no mistake about it – enlightenment is a destructive process. It has nothing to do with becoming better or being happier. Enlightenment is the crumbling away of untruth. It’s seeing through the facade of pretense. It’s the complete eradication of everything we imagined to be true.”  –Adyashanti

[DimmedBulb]

55 minutes ago, abrakamowse said:

“Make no mistake about it – enlightenment is a destructive process. It has nothing to do with becoming better or being happier. Enlightenment is the crumbling away of untruth. It’s seeing through the facade of pretense. It’s the complete eradication of everything we imagined to be true.”  –Adyashanti

I'm gonna go cry in a corner now.

The moment I wrote that previous sentence, I realized I'm not in the future, so the fear and crying as a response suits me no purpose. I seem to be learning.

[abrakamowse]

15 minutes ago, DimmedBulb said:

I'm gonna go cry in a corner now.

The moment I wrote that previous sentence, I realized I'm not in the future, so the fear and crying as a response suits me no purpose. I seem to be learning.

Cool... :-)

[Nathalie]

20 hours ago, DimmedBulb said:

The moment I wrote that previous sentence, I realized I'm not in the future, so the fear and crying as a response suits me no purpose. I seem to be learning.

see what I mean with exciting?