What is everyone scared of, why won't you liberate yourself of suffering and fear?

[Leo Nordin]

I've been meaning to ask this question for a long time. Many of you here on this forum has had some sort of awakenings but what is stopping you from liberation, are you not conscious of the will of life? 

I would like to know what is stopping you who reads this and what is your plan to do about it.

It seams to me that on this furum realization is not the most difficult but it's the going out there in the world which seems to be. But not to many talk about it, instead most are just on intellectual dissection and analysis of matter, time, who we are and what we are to do, truth etc. 

To me it seems everyone takes only small steps in development towards this. Though is that enough for you, the whole thing we are trying to do is speed up your evolvement, why are people (you) afraid of completely liberating yourself from all this suffering? 

[AdamR95]

@Leo Nordin the path is the goal

otherwise we can just kill ourself and that would be it.

[Mason Riggle]

“We thought of life by analogy with a journey, a pilgrimage, which had a serious purpose at the end, and the thing was to get to that end, success or whatever it is, maybe heaven after you’re dead. But we missed the point the whole way along. It was a musical thing and you were supposed to sing or to dance while the music was being played.”

"When we make music we don't do it in order to reach a certain point, such as the end of the composition. 

If that were so, the best conductors would be those who played fastest. And there would be composers who only wrote finales. People would go to a concert just to hear one crackling chord… Because that’s the end!

Same way with dancing. You don’t aim at a particular spot in the room because that’s where you will arrive. The whole point of the dancing is the dance."

― Alan Watts

Edited March 15, 2021 by Mason Riggle

[BlackMaze]

Because it's fucking scary. Because in some cases my survival will not be the highest priority. I want to experience a good life and to do that i need to have some ego and be a devil at least a bit. I'm not ready to be a saint. I am not ready to completely let go of my ego. Imagine that you have a shotgun and a lion wants to eat you. What if you care so much about the lion that you don't shoot it and let it eat you? This would be the completely egoless state in my mind and of course probably noone is there. But think about it. What if you care so much about the whole that you sacrifice your life? 

[Leo Nordin]

13 minutes ago, AdamR95 said:

@Leo Nordin the path is the goal

otherwise we can just kill ourself and that would be it.

I don't believe all of life is suffering. I would say suffering is that which takes from your life, if all activities are that way to you very well there is no problem dying. 

Adam why are you (if you are) afraid to live to the outmost will of your life? 

Also on another note many realised beings has killed themselves upon realisation... I have heard from Sadhguru that that is why most yogis die so young. 

[LastThursday]

23 minutes ago, Leo Nordin said:

but what is stopping you from liberation, are you not conscious of the will of life? 

Because liberation is just a word.

What's the opposite of liberation? Enslavement, restriction, rules, taboo, morality, law, respect, standards, love. It's not so clear that liberation is good.

If I were completely liberated, I could walk around naked in the streets killing people and not care at all. I could end up in prison for years and not care at all about being abused every day - that would be true liberation from suffering. You wouldn't mind at all scraping a living on the streets.

So being liberated involves treading a careful path and cherry picking how you want to be liberated. Survival and common decency are hard to let go of.

[Leo Nordin]

15 minutes ago, BlackMaze said:

Because it's fucking scary. Because in some cases my survival will not be the highest priority. I want to experience a good life and to do that i need to have some ego and be a devil at least a bit. I'm not ready to be a saint. I am not ready to completely let go of my ego. Imagine that you have a shotgun and a lion wants to eat you. What if you care so much about the lion that you don't shoot it and let it eat you? This would be the completely egoless state in my mind and of course probably noone is there. But think about it. What if you care so much about the whole that you sacrifice your life? 

That is exactly what all gurus want you to do. If the situation comes you made a conscious choice not to kill the lion and to be killed instead, isn't that a very beautiful choice you made. For me being ego less is the easiest and most rewarding way to live. The reason I don't live ego less yet is because I chose the hard, full of suffering, ego etc way just to prepare for my future a little bit more, thanks for telling me what you are afraid of. 

If you would like to explain more what you are really afraid of please do. 

[AdamR95]

25 minutes ago, Leo Nordin said:

I don't believe all of life is suffering. I would say suffering is that which takes from your life, if all activities are that way to you very well there is no problem dying. 

Adam why are you (if you are) afraid to live to the outmost will of your life? 

Also on another note many realised beings has killed themselves upon realisation... I have heard from Sadhguru that that is why most yogis die so young. 

realisation and life is just another duality

nirvana is right here right now

Edited March 15, 2021 by AdamR95

[BlackMaze]

@Leo Nordin basically what i just said. That i will put the well being of others above myself. It is beautiful but at the same time you others can get advantage of you and being empathetic towards everyone is heavy. It can take it's toll on you. Eliminating the suffering of the world is beautiful but very hard. I am also aftaid of huge ego backlashes. 

[Leo Nordin]

23 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

Because liberation is just a word.

What's the opposite of liberation? Enslavement, restriction, rules, taboo, morality, law, respect, standards, love. It's not so clear that liberation is good.

If I were completely liberated, I could walk around naked in the streets killing people and not care at all. I could end up in prison for years and not care at all about being abused every day - that would be true liberation from suffering. You wouldn't mind at all scraping a living on the streets.

So being liberated involves treading a careful path and cherry picking how you want to be liberated. Survival and common decency are hard to let go of.

Yeah I didn't mean this kind of liberation... Excuse me for my bad phrasing. 

[LastThursday]

@Leo Nordin no worries it's cool. But are you talking about liberation from physical suffering or just mental suffering or what?

[Megan Alecia]

Themselves.

[Leo Nordin]

12 minutes ago, AdamR95 said:

realisation and life is just another duality

nirvana is right here right now

Yes. 

Though I don't understand what you are trying to communicate here..?

13 minutes ago, BlackMaze said:

@Leo Nordin basically what i just said. That i will put the well being of others above myself. It is beautiful but at the same time you others can get advantage of you and being empathetic towards everyone is heavy. It can take it's toll on you. Eliminating the suffering of the world is beautiful but very hard. I am also aftaid of huge ego backlashes. 

I am talking about eliminating the suffering of your own world, not anyone else... I don't get why you would suffer yourself to help someone else suffer less, that seems stupid. If you actually wanted to help them you wouldn't suffer doing it.

Ego backslashes is just an idea. I think that is the least you should be worrying about. Aren't you just projecting the future and ideas about it. Though I am doing the same but that is my problem...

Anyways good luck. 

[Javfly33]

Because most of us we are not Conscious that we are God 99% of the time. So the ego runs the show. 

The solution is simple: Awake yourself as God more and more times and time so you Reclaim your power back.

[BlackMaze]

23 minutes ago, Leo Nordin said:

I am talking about eliminating the suffering of your own world, not anyone else... I don't get why you would suffer yourself to help someone else suffer less, that seems stupid. If you actually wanted to help them you wouldn't suffer doing it.

Ego backslashes is just an idea. I think that is the least you should be worrying about. Aren't you just projecting the future and ideas about it. Though I am doing the same but that is my problem...

Anyways good luck. 

This is isn' t stupid if you see the others as yourself. If you really eliminated your suffering this is how you would see the world. It is not just an idea. Not everyone is ready to let go of ego. If you stop being concious for whatever reason the backlash can be really strong. 

[Leo Nordin]

56 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

@Leo Nordin no worries it's cool. But are you talking about liberation from physical suffering or just mental suffering or what?

Actually I am talking about suffering caused by ego. Or to clarify I am talking about living your desires in an inclusive and conscious way without attachment or fear. Or to clarify even more because apparently I suck at communication, I mean the way of living which J krishnamurti, Ug krishnamurti, Osho talks about. 

Are you afraid of living that way, why won't you live that way, is what I wonder @LastThursday. 

[Snader]

Fear

[Leo Nordin]

27 minutes ago, BlackMaze said:

This is isn' t stupid if you see the others as yourself. If you really eliminated your suffering this is how you would see the world. It is not just an idea. Not everyone is ready to let go of ego. If you stop being concious for whatever reason the backlash can be really strong. 

I didn't really mean it the way I think you interpreted me when I said eliminate suffering. I meant if you desired to help someone I wouldn't call the consequences suffering because if you do what you desire the most every second of your life then I wouldn't call the consequences of that mentally nor physically suffering. That is why I said the opposite would be stupid, helping people because of some other reason than pure desire. 

I don't quite understand because it is just an idea to me. I haven't seen anyone have ego backlashes either, did Shiva, Krishna, Adiyogi, Buddha, Sadhguru, J krishnamurti, Ug krishnamurti, Osho have ego backlashes after realisation? I get that if you aren't realised you may do the wrong things experiencially and therefore get an ego backlash, but isn't that just because you didn't know what you where doing when you tried to remove ego...? Also I totally get that you need to prepare yourself if you have loads of ideas about stuff, delusions, ego etc but that should dissappear rapidly after awakening? Just to put it out there I don't know what ego actually is. 

 

 

[Leo Nordin]

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

Because most of us we are not Conscious that we are God 99% of the time. So the ego runs the show. 

The solution is simple: Awake yourself as God more and more times and time so you Reclaim your power back.

Wait, why would most not be concious of something so obvious? Never mind living to the peaks of human capabilities. Do you think most people here live their lives unconsciously? Then I quess their problem may be more of awakening and less of what comes after that. Do you think I got that correctly? 

And because they aren't aware then living to your highest potential is a distant land and trying to reach it would only be in delusion and therefore ego backlashes would happen I quess? @Javfly33 do you really believe it is true that most on this forum is in such an early stage of spiritual development? 

 

11 minutes ago, Snader said:

Fear

Of what? 

 

1 hour ago, Megan Alecia said:

Themselves.

Why? 

[Megan Alecia]

@Leo Nordin Rule no 1: You do not talk about Fight Club.