What's your take on this MRA Chick?

[Keyhole]

I dislike her because she isn't authentic.  I hate having to look at someone talking and know that not a thing they say they will actually be in line with how they really feel.  Women like that are not doing that in order to make men feel better, they are doing it for another entirely different reason, under that guise.

[Danioover9000]

@Roy

14 hours ago, Roy said:

I love learning from channels like this because people like Roma and the movement she represents is perfect examples of how every POV is simply perspectival and partial.

She has a lot of great things to say, and while there are obvious grains of truth in them, it is and ultimately limited and fundamentally biased.

Just by the nature of the content in it's existence is literally dividing the population in half 

Great study case here.

   Yes, her channel is an interesting case study of a partial worldview.

[zeroISinfinity]

Hey guys there is nothing wrong with her. I actually  would love to take her out, on soccer game. 

Finally found da lady for that. 

 

[Emerald]

9 hours ago, Parththakkar12 said:

I see more of this happening in the future because men really do value women who understand them. This is like a huge relief to me, to see that such women exist out in the world.

Looks like the gender-war is ending now!

This type of thing has been going on for a long time. It’s not a new phenomenon. I was doing this 20 years ago way back in 5th grade at age 10-11. 

Girls/women will often hate on other women and pander to boys/men in order to feel more desirable and powerful. 

It’s a coping strategy for internalized misogyny.

So, understand that she actually wants the gender war because she uses it to cope with her traumas.

Her goal is to tell men exactly what they want to hear and to be perceived as an ally in the gender war, so that she can feel valuable by proving to men that she is superior and more desirable compared to other women. 

If there’s no more gender war, she won’t be able to have a medium through which to project out her internalized misogyny onto other women. That means she’d have to face with her own self-hatred.

A woman who hates women, hates herself. So, the only way she can keep herself from realizing that she hates herself is to define herself as being in a different category from all other women. Hence the reason why she tries so hard to be accepted by men and tries so hard to dispossess herself of being perceived in the same light as other women.

So if the gender war weren’t there, she wouldn’t have an outlet to sooth her wounds of self-hatred by manipulating men into giving her praise for being “one of the good ones”.

[Preety_India]

16 minutes ago, Emerald said:

Girls/women will often hate on other women and pander to boys/men in order to feel more desirable and powerful

Totally agree. I tend to cringe at such  women who tend to do that because they let other women down. I call them "pandering women." 

 

[Parththakkar12]

@Emerald It sounded more pro-male to me than anti-female or 'internalized misogyny'. Unless being pro-male is misogynistic, in which case, I don't know what to say. If being pro-male is misogynistic, if you want to take away any form of happiness/approval/genuine understanding a man can get from women, that's just sad.

Edited March 13, 2021 by Parththakkar12

[Jacob Morres]

17 hours ago, Emerald said:

However, men do have many advantages over women in terms of the power structures in society as they have high expectations projected upon them instead of low expectations projected upon them like women do.

i think bringing this up in the same paragraph makes it seem like it marginalizes men's issues...

like: yeah men have these problems... but women have it worse  

but thats not to say i dont agree with most of ur points

Edited March 13, 2021 by Jacob Morres

[Emerald]

15 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

@Emerald It sounded more pro-male to me than anti-female or 'internalized misogyny'. Unless being pro-male is misogynistic, in which case, I don't know what to say. If being pro-male is misogynistic, if you want to take away any form of happiness/approval/genuine understanding a man can get from women, that's just sad.

I just went through and watched some more of her videos and she’s mostly pretty even handed in most videos I’ve seen. These are patterns that can be noticed in society.

That said, I have seen other clips prior where she’s really anti-woman in her perspective and you can notice the pandering much stronger.

But no, being concerned about men’s issues is not misogynistic as long as it’s not done for the sake of invalidating women’s issues. 

[Emerald]

17 minutes ago, Jacob Morres said:

i think bringing this up in the same paragraph makes it seem like it marginalizes men's issues...

like: yeah men have these problems... but women have it worse  

but thats not to say i dont agree with most of ur points

What I’m saying is that men have high expectations projected upon them... which benefits them in terms of societal power structures but disadvantages them in terms of their inner life.

It’s not meant to invalidate the issues men are facing. It’s meant to hint at why men’s issues tend to be overlooked.

People are very focused towards women’s barriers to power as power is viewed as masculine and therefore important.

People are not focused towards men’s barriers to emotional vulnerability because emotions are viewed as feminine and therefore trite.

There is an assumption that men neither need nor want emotional vulnerability because it is viewed as feminine. And the expectation that men dispossess themselves with everything associated with femininity.

This is why lots of men bottle up and repress their feelings as there is an expectation to be strong and powerful all the time.

So, no, not an invalidation at all.

[Parththakkar12]

33 minutes ago, Emerald said:

I just went through and watched some more of her videos and she’s mostly pretty even handed in most videos I’ve seen. These are patterns that can be noticed in society.

That said, I have seen other clips prior where she’s really anti-woman in her perspective and you can notice the pandering much stronger.

But no, being concerned about men’s issues is not misogynistic as long as it’s not done for the sake of invalidating women’s issues. 

Point taken.

As a guy, it can be very demoralizing when all you see in the media is demonization of masculinity. Female criticism completely shatters your confidence and self-esteem. Male self-esteem depends a lot on female approval. Women probably don't know this and most guys won't tell you this because it's not alpha enough and because 'your self-esteem shouldn't depend on external validation, that's weak!!' Precisely. You just told me the reason you aren't being open about this.

Men have a fundamental drive to be protective towards women. Now, when this drive gets expressed in a narcissistic manner, what you see is the patriarchy, women being treated like property in ancient times, etc. The point being, the drive behind the patriarchy isn't inherently evil, it's meant to meet the female need for physical protection. What this entails is that men have a protector aspect of self whose self-esteem entirely depends on the health, well-being and happiness of women. If you're in charge of protecting a woman, you don't get to decide whether you're a good protector or not. She does. That's how this works. This is why her opinion about you will be more important to you as a protector than your own!

Now, in the patriarchy, up until this point, it was all about physical protection. The attitude was 'I'm going to keep you in the house and I'm going to go out, do the hard physical work of winning the bread for the family, you manage the household, so to speak. Don't leave the house because it's too dangerous. There's wild animals, there's other men waiting to steal you from me, etc.' It was narcissistic, not denying that. That's why it didn't work. It was an unconscious attempt that didn't work. It's important to note this though if we want to create a new system that does work.

Edited March 13, 2021 by Parththakkar12

[Emerald]

13 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

Point taken.

As a guy, it can be very demoralizing when all you see in the media is demonization of masculinity. Female criticism completely shatters your confidence and self-esteem. Male self-esteem depends a lot on female approval. Women probably don't know this and most guys won't tell you this because it's not alpha enough and because 'your self-esteem shouldn't depend on external validation, that's weak!!' Precisely. You just told me the reason you aren't being open about this.

Men have a fundamental drive to be protective towards women. Now, when this drive gets expressed in a narcissistic manner, what you see is the patriarchy, women being treated like property in ancient times, etc. The point being, the drive behind the patriarchy isn't inherently evil, it's meant to meet the female need for physical protection. What this entails is that men have a protector aspect of self whose self-esteem entirely depends on the health, well-being and happiness of women.

Now, in the patriarchy, up until this point, it was all about physical protection. The attitude was 'I'm going to keep you in the house and I'm going to go out, do the hard physical work of winning the bread for the family, you manage the household, so to speak. Don't leave the house because it's too dangerous. There's wild animals, there's other men waiting to steal you from me, etc.' It was narcissistic, not denying that. That's why it didn't work. It was an unconscious attempt that didn't work. It's important to note this though if we want to create a new system that does work.

Well, that’s not an accurate representation of what Patriarchy is.

Patriarchy is an agrarian adaptation, largely based in the establishment of the concept of land ownership, paternity, and property rights being passed down the paternal line and the need to control/oppress women and female sexuality to ensure paternity and to have lots of children to be used as soldiers to fend off warring civilizations... or to bear future mothers who will bear and raise more sons to become soldiers to protect the people and further avoid having the land seized and the people killed by warring civilizations.

But that’s a whole other can of worms with a lot of perspectives to dig into. But that’s the reason for the adaptation of patriarchy... which lead symptomatically to an overall suppression of the feminine in both men and women... and an oppression of women’s sovereignty.

But you are correct that men care a lot about what women think of them. Part of that is natural, but part of that is also based in Anima disintegration.

I made a video on the topic...

 

[Jacob Morres]

@Emerald sorry about that i misread that hard

[Emerald]

2 hours ago, Jacob Morres said:

@Emerald sorry about that i misread that hard

No worries ?

[Karmadhi]

I am quite curious to know what is the female's role in the dating process. It feels like all the logistics (planning date, time etc)  and moves making (approach, asking out, flirting, going for kiss, sex etc) and sometimes paying (depends on culture) are done by the guy so what does the girl have to do? Or is her job to put make up to try to look as pretty as possible and that is it? I am geniounly curious to know from the other side.

I swear this is not a sexist angry comment just desire to learn about things from the other side. 

 

Edited March 14, 2021 by Karmadhi

[Loba]

@Karmadhi Initially that is all that she has to do, but the roles equal out over time.

[Peter Miklis]

30 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

I am quite curious to know what is the female's role in the dating process. It feels like all the logistics (planning date, time etc)  and moves making (approach, asking out, flirting, going for kiss, sex etc) and sometimes paying (depends on culture) are done by the guy so what does the girl have to do? Or is her job to put make up to try to look as pretty as possible and that is it? I am geniounly curious to know from the other side.

I swear this is not a sexist angry comment just desire to learn about things from the other side. 

 

I am not a woman, but there are some things apart from looking beautiful that woman can do. For example, if she wants the guy to notice her, she has to give him choosing signals (like hair twirling, looking at him while smiling, trying to get close to him for no reason). Sometimes, if she likes the guy a lot, she can even approach him (happened to me once. When girl does this, it's mostly pretty half-assed approach, she's just trying to get finally noticed). Maybe she can drop subtle hints (like, her parents aren't home, asking what are you doing on weekend, stuff like that).

Everything else has to be done by a man. So, probably like 95%. Just my estimation.

 

[Bando]

23 hours ago, Emerald said:

So, understand that she actually wants the gender war because she uses it to cope with her traumas.

Her goal is to tell men exactly what they want to hear and to be perceived as an ally in the gender war, so that she can feel valuable by proving to men that she is superior and more desirable compared to other women. 

If there’s no more gender war, she won’t be able to have a medium through which to project out her internalized misogyny onto other women. That means she’d have to face with her own self-hatred.

Weird I ran through her channel just to see see what the general gist was and I found this to be true. I noticed my mind slowly getting "triggered" that women could do certain stuff and not get the same type of backlash a man would in their situation. I didn't really feel as if she was "pro-men" but leaned more anti-women.

I can see how some guys watching her videos, especially those who subscribe heavy to Redpill ideology can remain in a paradigm lock as their minds would be too focused on gender wars rather than trying to get a deeper understanding of the issue; very sneaky......

[Karmadhi]

@Loba How does that work?

[Emerald]

3 hours ago, Bando said:

Weird I ran through her channel just to see see what the general gist was and I found this to be true. I noticed my mind slowly getting "triggered" that women could do certain stuff and not get the same type of backlash a man would in their situation. I didn't really feel as if she was "pro-men" but leaned more anti-women.

I can see how some guys watching her videos, especially those who subscribe heavy to Redpill ideology can remain in a paradigm lock as their minds would be too focused on gender wars rather than trying to get a deeper understanding of the issue; very sneaky......

Yeah, I just sense a lot of Shadow motivations behind her desire to cape for men and why it takes that particular tone.

Now, there isn't anything wrong with her pointing out the problems with the way men are oriented to. There are some real issues there.

But because she frames it in a way that's anti-woman/anti-feminist, it implies that root cause of the issue is women... instead of what the actual root cause is which is based in patriarchal notion of what it means to be a man. 

[Loba]

@Karmadhi I have no idea, I was often the one paying in my ltr.  (I'm a chick.)  I didn't have to with most of the other guys I dated, and I was polite so they felt okay with it.  Do you feel like it is more of a problem if it is a bad date?

I guess it is dependent on what direction you want to go in.  So you could, once dating someone exclusively, both write up a plan.  This is who does what, when, where, why, how.  And moving towards mutual goals, stuff like that.  That would balance it.

But during the dating process it does seem like men have to put in more work.  I don't really know what to do about that.  It's expected culturally, so maybe what is missing is that many people no longer date with purpose anymore so in that sense, men having to do more work, pay for things when dating multiple people - this is outdated but we have not caught up with it yet as a society.  Generally expected but no longer needed.

Maybe the solution is that if it is casual, then women should put in an equal amount of work but if you are dating traditionally, like, taking a decent, slow amount of time, then that would make more sense for the guy to pay imo.  We just need to, as a society evolve into that new custom.  But in the meantime, dating will be harder for men and easier for women.

TBH, I had short relationships when in my early 20's and then a long-time on and off again 10 yr relationship that kind of left me feeling burned out, and so I am out of the dating scene.  I don't understand a lot of what you guys do... especially now, like with tinder and online dating profiles and whatever else people do.  It didn't seem so polarized a decade ago.  You just sort of, went out with friends, would meet other mutual friends and if things clicked, that was about it. 
Don't people meet that way nowadays anymore?  From social circles and stuff?  (I know, covid, but before that) 
I guess I would need to know more about modern dating to give a better answer.

I guess, for women, they have to eat well, dress nice, be clean, hair, makeup, work out, be feminine, ect.  I remember putting time into getting ready, like I would make a day out of it, finding the right outfit, makeup, doing my hair nicely - and when a woman is doing this, it is for you.  That woman has you in mind while getting ready for the date, so if you see a woman that has taken time to look good, then they are not just showing up, but that they value you enough to do so.  They could just say "fuckit" and not bother.