Re: Actualized.org: The Dark Side Of Meditation : Spiritual Ego & It's Delusions Vs Enlightenment

[Rali]

5 minutes ago, John Flores said:

@Rali You choose not to think. In my past religion we call that simple minded. Congrats. But there is wisdom beyond your wildest dreams and you can only taste it once you see what reality truly is as it expands to eternity.

 

There is a possibility that the end result of wisdom is nothingness as it stems from the place of emenation, but then you are skipping steps and miss out on the nuggets of beauty that can inspire thousands of egos with rich depth. Once you achieve nothingness with all its finest qualities of infinite chaotic void, drown, die, experience pain beyond your wildest dreams. Then awaken and become God. But if you say nothing is all that is there, then you missed the point of enlightenment.

Think when necessary for functional reasons. Do not filter/distort reality with the limitations that are thoughts/concept/language though. Well, if you are on the path. If you are cool with ego. By all means do you boo.

"emptiness is for and form is emptiness" -heart sutra 

Emptiness being the void, and form the sensory world that is birthed and died within it.

PS Enlightenment has no point. Stop tripping plz haha

[Rali]

You can be content by dropping all ideas. Decrease the suffering of the world by doing so, and then help people if you want.

 

Or be a judgemental douche that pats himself on the back while saying "I am a nice person. I care" while simultaneously doing nothing to help people.

Stop patting yourself on the back my dude, and get off your high midget like horse.

 

Edited October 27, 2016 by Rali

[Prabhaker]

12 hours ago, Rali said:

Understanding enlightenment logically, and chasing it are both pointless.

Enlightenment is goal-less goal. It can't be attained by your efforts, chasing. It doesn't mean no efforts are needed, chasing is pointless. To achieve this point of no-effort you will need a long, long effort. 

[Prabhaker]

13 hours ago, Rali said:

Even though you have state you are not "enlightened"

At least he's honest. There are people who know everything about enlightenment intellectually, pretend to be enlightened. Nobody can defeat them by logic  They are logicians. Logician will always win. Winning by logic does'nt makes anyone enlightened.

Edited October 27, 2016 by Prabhaker

[Rali]

38 minutes ago, Prabhaker said:

Enlightenment is goal-less goal. It can't be attained by your efforts, chasing. It doesn't mean no efforts are needed, chasing is pointless. To achieve this point of no-effort you will need a long, long effort. 

this is true to an extent. Richard Miller said "after 20 years of yoga. I realized I was no better for it" he then said yoga did its job eventually. Made him stop. I personally chased awakening experience after awakening before realizing I was still resisting reality. That I still though x state is better than y state which I knew was not true.

PS Never said Leo is dishonest. He is a seeker though, and a seeker teaching people the path. One who has very strong ideas on enlightenment might lead people astray. 

Edited October 27, 2016 by Rali

[Prabhaker]

@Rali Why do you quote anybody else when you are enlightened ? You have authority to say from your experience. 

[Rali]

@Prabhaker Because he said it wonderfully, and I can not improve upon it, and since he is one of my teachers I let people know that he is the one that verbalized the truth in said manner.

Edited October 27, 2016 by Rali

[Prabhaker]

10 minutes ago, Rali said:

Because he said it wonderfully, and I can not improve upon it, and since he is one of my teachers I let people know that he is the one that verbalized the truth in said manner.

What if he knows everything about enlightenment intellectually, but he is also not enlightened ? 

J. Krishnamurti was teaching everyone that no technique, no effort , no master is needed. He was enlightened still he was wrong. J. Krishnamurti was insisting his whole life that there is no technique for meditation. And the total result was not that millions of people attained to meditation; the total result was that millions of people became convinced that no technique is needed for meditation. But they forgot all about what they were going to do with the obstructions, the hindrances. So they remained intellectually convinced that no technique is needed.

Edited October 27, 2016 by Prabhaker

[Rali]

Fair enough some teachers express the truth in a way that has very little to little impact to the egoic mind. Best example is ug krishnamurti. Love the guy, but his teachings have no effect. 

Same goes for the "you are already enlightened, there is nothing to do camp" To a lesser extent, because while that is ultimately true. It is a pointless thing to say to one who lives, breathes and sleeps in delusion.

Leo for people new to the path is a much better teacher than the ug and the type of teachers mentioned in my previous paragraph. For people already on the path his strong ideas can be detrimental to letting go.

[Prabhaker]

3 minutes ago, Rali said:

For people already on the path his strong ideas can be detrimental to letting go.

People already on the path are enough intelligent, internet forums and videos can't lead them astray.

[ajasatya]

one of the most elucidative teachings is asking people why they're doing all this. most of them won't be able to give an answer.

[Rali]

16 minutes ago, iago iriarte arhatha said:

one of the most elucidative teachings is asking people why they're doing all this. most of them won't be able to give an answer.

Life is a game that has rules. One of the rules is you need money to live. Suffering is not pleasurable helping people get rid of it is something they want. Therefor you can do so and make money.

 

In short I do it to turn it into a career and if I can't I will stop. 

[Prabhaker]

1 minute ago, Rali said:

Life is a game that has rules. One of the rules is you need money to live.

Buddha left his kingdom, didn't earned money. If you have trust , existence takes care.

[Azrael]

14 hours ago, Rali said:

D) Chill out bro. It is not that serious:)

Funnily, you just get this attitude after you had some awakenings. At least this is how it seems to me. In beforehand enlightenment was the most important, serious thing to seek. When it comes down on you, you lose your entire "spiritual persona". All your "I meditate for x years"-beliefs, all your "I had these kind of experiences"-beliefs just drop, because seeking disappeared. For me seeking disappeared even before the shit hit the fan and was really necessarily to get it down. When you want it too bad and then see that there's really nothing you can do and thoroughly give up, it'll come and you'll laugh your ass off silly. It is that not serious. It is God / it / Tao / ... playing the most funny game with you that could be played. You play it with your self and you directed it all of the time. It's that nice. So, very important point to mention. Or at least very helpful to consider. @Rali Good seeing you around here, I wondered how long it would took. I hope for some spiritual warfare in the future or least some fun discusses. Have a good one!

Cheers

[David1]

On 26-10-2016 at 3:19 AM, Emerald Wilkins said:

I would posit that your experiences of ego-loss correlate to the effects of the drug but are not directly caused by the drug, if that makes sense. So, the not being able to function is probably caused by the drugs and not the ego loss, if that makes sense. I experienced mine as a result of experimenting with Ayahuasca. The high was very mild in many ways, as I had most of my normal faculties.

The ego loss i experienced on mushrooms...the onset and the first waves kept getting stronger and stronger i was losing coherent thoughts, it felt like i was dying. Reality shattered like a broken mirror in a million pieces. I had to surrender to it...make peace with the thought i was going to die. It wasn't mild at all for me. I didn't had all my faculties, i couldn't think, let alone speak. My ego completely dissolved.During the long comedown i had halucinations as if my body consisted of huge cubes that shifted in space. I can't even imagine being out on the street or in traffic in that state, it would be a total nightmare. In later experiences, i learned that the surrendering is absolutely nessecarry.Avoid a struggle

 

On 26-10-2016 at 3:19 AM, Emerald Wilkins said:

My self-concept just became less important to me, and it was as though I zoomed out from my sense of self.

My self was gone! There was no boundry between myself and the environment. After a while i regained my abilitie to speak

 

All in all we had a very different experience it seems.

Edited October 27, 2016 by David1

[Bob84]

@Prabhaker Please convince my landlord of that  (no joke)

@Rali Hi dude. Dont spend to much time on here. Our egos demand that you make more videos .

Edited October 27, 2016 by Bob84

[Prabhaker]

3 minutes ago, Bob84 said:

Please convince my landlord of that

Inquire into your relationship with existence, and out of that inquiry, arises trust - not belief, not faith. 

Trust is not a decision on your part. You cannot decide for it. It is really a surrender. My convincing is not going to help.

[ajasatya]

@Rali you noticed the nuance of my comment and asked yourself about your reason for doing all this because you're used to being sincere. that's good. something you've done before, for sure.

i teach because i enjoy teaching. there's no big meaning to it. no altruistic justification. "save all beings"? "helping to extinguish suffering"? fuck all that bodhisattva bullshit. feeling compelled to do whatever is not true spiritual liberation.

reality has it's own ways to wake up to itself through human beings (on this planet). whether i'm part of it or not it doesn't matter. the ego is too ignorant when it comes down to enlightenment as a reality thing doing it's own stuff and using egos as fundamental tools.

in some way, my teachings actually CAUSE a certain amount of suffering and mental confusion. you know the drill.

for a career based on teaching, i recommend mastering either adyashanti's style (calm, slow, patient) or the alan watts' style (funny, entertainer) or both.

love your videos. keep it up.

[BFNK]

It's nice to see modern teachers, students, and the communication between them all at one place. Even if it's at a few places, they all end up being interconnected. I pointed out this thread to Rali on FB and expected to see just that - some extended communication. Be it for comedic purposes, or not, this is an epic time to be alive! 

 

After maybe three years of being a "seeker", I'm slowly starting to feel some progress. A lot of it is owed to people like you, even though for me it started with Echkart Tolle and his book, The Power Of Now, which I am sure everyone here has read before. Everyone keeps saying that this cannot be intellectualized, but it was through intellectualizing that I could try to understand that book. This is why I like Leo's videos in particular, because he does try to explain it from the standpoint of a person inside the Matrix. I can't say who's enlightened, and who is not. I can surely tell you that great actors do exist, and some even get paid for it.

 

Yet, practical advice can be always be tested personally. Everyone determines what is useful for themselves, and everyone can choose what topics to look into. Nothing is forced here. All this fear that "students can be led astray" is not necessary, because being led astray is an important part of the road. You must first know why something doesn't work before you can say that it does not work with certainty. 

 

But don't take my word for it. I am still a student at best, nothing more. I don't think that listening to someone else is wrong if you understand the actions you are taking at least a little bit. And I don't believe that any of this can be taught. It's really chaotic. But, we kind of get better at navigating in the chaos and this is what I would call "progress". 

 

Leo and Rali should certainly keep on making videos. It really doesn't matter who is enlightened. I think spreading the concept and making people interested in the topic is doing enough good on its own. People are, indeed, not stupid. They will find books, they will do some Google searches and they will find a ton of material, from various sources. Even if all of this preparation seems ridiculous, if it helps with the mindset - it's worth it, I would say.

Edited October 27, 2016 by BFNK

[Rali]

@Azrael Thank you man. Will pop up every now and then, but mostly popped up here to respond to leo. Responding to every comment on my channel is already taking up a good chunk of my day haha:)

@Bob84 lol @ tell that to my landlord, and sure thing. Next video should be up in a couple of hours.

@iago iriarte arhatha Agree with most of what you said. Thanks for the love, and will do:) Knowing that you teach as well. If you ever want to collab let me know:)