What happens in deep sleep?

[Gesundheit]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

@Gesundheit

experience. The five senses. Perception of the 3D world.these are Available at the waking state and absent during deep sleep. 

How to you know?

[Someone here]

7 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

How to you know?

From experience. From experience. From experience.!!!! 

[Gesundheit]

11 minutes ago, Someone here said:

From experience. From experience. From experience.!!!! 

What's the relationship between experiencing and knowing?

Edited March 8, 2021 by Gesundheit

[TheSelf]

You don't lose consciousness in deep sleep that's nonsense.

If you could lose consciousness in deep sleep then how come you later in the waking state are able to explain how you experienced it?

You must be there to be able to come back and tell us your story as being "unconscious" right?

Edited March 8, 2021 by m0hsen

[Someone here]

2 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

What's the relationship between experiencing and knowing?

Identical.  To experience something is to know it. To know what pepper taste like.. Is to experience it's taste. 

 

[Someone here]

3 minutes ago, m0hsen said:

You don't lose consciousness in deep sleep that's nonsense.

If you could lose consciousness in deep sleep then how come you later in the waking state are able to explain how you experienced it?

You most be there to be able to come back and tell us your story as being "unconscious" right?

Idk it's trippy. It seems like you are there before you went to bed.. And then there is like a gap and you come up after that. You don't experience the gap. Last thing you remember is before you you went to bed (and if there were dreams in between). 

[TheSelf]

@Someone here Ok, can you say that you're literally gone or become none existence in deep sleep until you reach dream state? 

I can't say that because I'm also able to explain my experience of deep sleep like you, so definitely I'm there.

Edited March 8, 2021 by m0hsen

[Someone here]

13 minutes ago, m0hsen said:

@Someone here Ok, can you say that you're literally gone or become none existence in deep sleep until you reach dream state? 

I can't say that because I'm also able to explain my experience of deep sleep like you, so definitely I'm there.

As I said you are only aware of the gap. After you wake up you realize 8 hours have passed and your last memory is right before you went to bed. So it is like a lack of experience (gap) rather than experience. After all when you do a surgery and they need you to be In coma such that you don't feel anything. So we assume that when a person is sleeping.. He is in a state of no conscious experience. 

[SoonHei]

5 hours ago, Someone here said:

The waking state IS consciousness. Or at least it's illuminated by your consciousness.

you are the bulb - deep sleep, the bulb is there but the light is off

waking state, the bulb is still there but now the light is on

there's just the light bulb which is all there is and illuminates itself

 

or tv screen on with shows starting and ending on it while the screen remains - waking state

turn the tv off, tv screen is still there, no start or end to it. always there. the concept of starting of a show and ending doesn't apply to the screen on and thru which the shows appear. the screen alone IS during the deep sleep

 

notice how the screen or the bulb are always there. unchained. just wearing different masks/colors on top

[TheSelf]

24 minutes ago, Someone here said:

So it is like a lack of experience (gap) rather than experience. After all when you do a surgery and they need you to be In coma such that you don't feel anything. So we assume that when a person is sleeping.. He is in a state of no conscious experience. 

"Lack of experience" or "no conscious experience" is still a experience that you can experience right?

Notice that still you must be there to experience all these experiences.

And during the experiences either deep sleep or dream state, you never say that you're experiencing being unconscious.

You only say something like that in the waking state.

If you were "unconscious" or gone during the dream state, then who is witnessing dream? 

 

 

 

Edited March 8, 2021 by m0hsen

[Gesundheit]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

Identical.  To experience something is to know it. To know what pepper taste like.. Is to experience it's taste.

Have you ever experienced deep sleep? If not, then how do you know it even exists?

[Someone here]

13 minutes ago, SoonHei said:

you are the bulb - deep sleep, the bulb is there but the light is off

waking state, the bulb is still there but now the light is on

there's just the light bulb which is all there is and illuminates itself

 

or tv screen on with shows starting and ending on it while the screen remains - waking state

turn the tv off, tv screen is still there, no start or end to it. always there. the concept of starting of a show and ending doesn't apply to the screen on and thru which the shows appear. the screen alone IS during the deep sleep

 

notice how the screen or the bulb are always there. unchained. just wearing different masks/colors on top

Nice analogies. Which actually prove my point . 

There is no point or 'use' of the bulb when it's off. An off bulb =no bulb. 

35 minutes ago, m0hsen said:

@Someone hereLack of experience" or "no conscious experience" is still a experience that you experience right? 

That's just a word game at this point. lol. They are fundamentally different. 

 

12 minutes ago, m0hsen said:

Notice that still you must be there to experience all these experiences.

And during the experiences either deep sleep or dream state, you never say that you're experiencing being unconscious.

You only say something like that in the waking state.

If you were "unconscious" or gone during the dream state, then who is witnessing dream? 

As I said you only remember the gap after you woke up. You are not conscious during the gap.. And that's why you can't say that you are in the gap while you are In the gap. Only after you wake few hours later.. The world was still there but you didn't witness anything during the period of sleep. Call it 'witnessing not witnessing' makes no difference to the experience. 

 

13 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

Have you ever experienced deep sleep? If not, then how do you know it even exists?

It's a tricky one to answer. But that's only because of the tricky nature of language. Let's not try to outsmart each other's and keep it down to earth. You sleep every night.. So you obviously experience deep sleep. But it's different as I said it's a non-experience.. Rather than an experience. This should make sense to you (obviously you know sleep very well) if wasn't for the barrier of language and smart-assery. 

[SoonHei]

2 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Nice analogies. Which actually prove my point . 

There is no point or 'use' of the bulb when it's off. An off bulb =no bulb.

thanks

i love analogies

 

and an off bulb could be a decor item bruh

but yes, bulb which is off is no "blub"

 

bulb/screen are like blank canvas of the painting

without the painting on it, it's not a painting

but without the canvas, there can be no painting

the "two" are but One

 

can there be heads or tails without a coin?

 

also. know that ultimately the bulb is ever lit and the screen is ever on.

the bulb "off" or the screen "off" never really happens because that isn't a happening so to speak

 

bulb "off" IS what YOU are

You are the canvas on which the painting appears

the canvas doesn't switch between having paint or not

the canvas IS, always IS, the paintings go on changing - screen IS, shows go on changing

 

same as the Sun. it's always shining. there isn't a sun not shining, the shining is what makes the sun, sun

no shine, no sun

 

[Gesundheit]

@Someone here 

4 minutes ago, Someone here said:

You sleep every night.. So you obviously experience deep sleep.

Metaphorically, yes.

"I" sleep, and "you" sleep. This is all a figure of speech that is not meant to be taken literally.

[TheSelf]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

That's just a word game at this point. lol. They are fundamentally different. 

you literally experience these every night. that's why you are here to talk about what it is that you experience, so there's no lack of experience or unconscious experience.

we are talking about our every night experiences exactly because these states are in our experiences, otherwise we were unable to talk about it.

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

As I said you only remember the gap after you woke up. You are not conscious during the gap

if you are not there then how you are able to explain your experiences of the other states?:

Quote

It seems like Perfect nothingness. As if nothing ever happened and never existed. It seems like there is no consciousness during deep sleep.. It's not even dark, black or empty.. It's so much nothing that even the concept of nothing isn't it

 

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

And that's why you can't say that you are in the gap while you are In the gap

See you yourself admit that you are there in these states, but when I described these experiences as just different experiences than waking states, to you it sounded like I'm playing with words.

just because you don't have the analyzing instrument (Mind) in your hand in the other states that doesn't mean you become non-existence!  

Edited March 8, 2021 by m0hsen

[erik8lrl]

God/non-existence. 

[Someone here]

42 minutes ago, m0hsen said:

you literally experience these every night. that's why you are here to talk about what it is that you experience, so there's no lack of experience or unconscious experience.

we are talking about our every night experiences exactly because these states are in our experiences, otherwise we were unable to talk about it.

if you are not there then how you are able to explain your experiences of the other states?:

 

See you yourself admit that you are there in these states, but when I described these experiences as just different experiences than waking states, to you it sounded like I'm playing with words.

just because you don't have the analyzing instrument (Mind) in your hand in the other states that doesn't mean you become non-existence!  

As I said.. You can't say that you are in the gap while you are in gap (meaning you are not there). You can only describe deep sleep after it. And as I said the description (nothing) is not it. 

 

Edited March 8, 2021 by Someone here

[TheSelf]

29 minutes ago, Someone here said:

As I said.. You can't say that you are in the gap while you are in gap (meaning you are not there). 

Bro, We can't continue our discussion if you really deny your own existence in two other states. Just because there's no mind in the other states in your hand that doesn't mean you become non-existence.

Definitely you are there in all states! But in each state with its own different unique experience.

Don't be identified with your mind, be identified with that pure presence in all states, you are that, that pure awareness, knowingness, to witness all that it's imagining in the natural three states.

 

 

Edited March 8, 2021 by m0hsen

[TheSelf]

@Someone here also even in the waking state, you don't constantly say I'm, I'm, I'm, to be, you just naturally are, meaning your existence doesn't depend on the contents of your mind.

So it should be so clear that mind is just a tool or an instrument that we have and nothing more than that.

Edited March 8, 2021 by m0hsen

[ivankiss]

Sleep is for the weak! 

Consciousness never sleeps.