Is Joe Rogan Irresponsible?

[Hardkill]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

That is irrelevant to a discussion of responsibility.

Even, Joe Rogan says that he totally believes in the idea that discipline equals freedom.

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

Even, Joe Rogan says that he totally believes in the idea that discipline equals freedom.

Irrelevant

[Hardkill]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Irrelevant

How so? I am saying that it's so ironic that Joe Rogan totally believes in having structure, rules, and discipline for yourself in order to survive and succeed with what you want, but at the same time seems to believe in the libertarian idea of society not having much regulation, rules, and mandates from the government.

Edited March 11, 2021 by Hardkill

[Tanz]

@Hardkill If you want to bring duality and beyond in it, then something can be many things at once.  There can be many "right" ways to go about problems and situations.  He is equally right in his views as much as anyone who has opposite views than his.  

[Arcangelo]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

That does not make it responsible to do so.

I agree.

[mmKay]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

That is irrelevant to a discussion of responsibility.

I have the freedom to spit in your face. That does not make it responsible to do so.

Not long ago there were riots in Barcelona because they jailed some rapper that was making anti-government rymes. There was a lot of discussion about freedom of speech from different people.

One of the best phrases from the people I heard was :

You wanna take the freedom to rap about terrorism and rape? Do it, but with the freedom of my cock in your mouth. Lmao. Sounds even funnier in Spanish.

And good point as well.

[vladorion]

People should be able to make up their own minds based on the information they receive.

Only giving them one sided information and suppressing the alternative side is basically taking away their right to make their own decisions. It's like saying, "you all are too stupid to make the right decision, so we're going to eliminate any information that is going to make you think".

This is not different than the government deciding that it has the right to tell you what you can or cannot put into your body (drug prohibition).

The same companies that have been telling us how scary drugs are are now telling us how scary this virus is and that vaccines are the only solution. Not surprising so many people don't trust them.

Let's say, these vaccines damage a lot of people's health. Who's going to take responsibility?

 

[Arcangelo]

5 minutes ago, vladorion said:

People should be able to make up their own minds based on the information they receive.

Only giving them one sided information and suppressing the alternative side is basically taking away their right to make their own decisions. It's like saying, "you all are too stupid to make the right decision, so we're going to eliminate any information that is going to make you think".

This is not different than the government deciding that it has the right to tell you what you can or cannot put into your body (drug prohibition).

^Excellent!

[Forestluv]

37 minutes ago, vladorion said:

Only giving them one sided information and suppressing the alternative side is basically taking away their right to make their own decisions. It's like saying, "you all are too stupid to make the right decision, so we're going to eliminate any information that is going to make you think".

Yet many people are this stupid and it harms these people and society.

Millions of people in America believe that the government is overrun by satan-worshipping pedophiles that eat babies. These people have become so distressed in fear that they are harming themselves, their family and society. 

Blanket statements like “one sided information and suppressing the alternative side” gives legitimacy to both sides. Context is super important. There is no legitimate “alternative side” to contexts like whether politicians and media are satan-worshippers cannibalizing babies, whether Jews are using space lasers to create massive forest fires, whether Bill Gates created a bogus vaccine for mind control etc.

Be mindful about making distinctions between legitimate alternative perspectives and batshit crazyness that is harmful to society. Most people do not have critical thinking skills and are vulnerable to being manipulated. And direct lines can be drawn from “information” some people receive that leads them to commit crimes against others. For example, online white supremacy groups and mass murders. Those that have fallen prey have clearly indicated in their manifestos that toxic “information” and the “alternative side” about how ethnic minorities are evil and threatening led them to murder ethnic minorities.

37 minutes ago, vladorion said:

This is not different than the government deciding that it has the right to tell you what you can or cannot put into your body (drug prohibition).

You seem to be taking a hard libertarian position and are dismissing social aspects.

 

 

[Leo Gura]

4 hours ago, vladorion said:

People should be able to make up their own minds based on the information they receive.

Only giving them one sided information and suppressing the alternative side is basically taking away their right to make their own decisions. It's like saying, "you all are too stupid to make the right decision, so we're going to eliminate any information that is going to make you think".

This is not different than the government deciding that it has the right to tell you what you can or cannot put into your body (drug prohibition).

But actually what you don't understand is that humans have NEVER been free to do that. Society has ALWAYS told you what is right and wrong because that is necessary for survival. And it makes no difference if society's right and wrong are true -- society will still restrict you.

When the threat becomes lethal enough, all freedoms become irrelevant. When millions of lives are at stake, your freedom to sit on your coach and play an armchair skeptic conspiracy theorist flies out the window. This is your core problem: you think you have a right to be skeptical, but actually you never had such a right. Your skepticism will be trampled upon as soon as it endangers peoples' lives. You can whine about it all you want, but that will not stop the trampling. Because your whining and ideology is less important than peoples' lives. And it does not matter that you believe that vaccines will cost lives, because the public consensus is against you. So even if you are right, the consensus holds power, not your ideas.

Yes, precisely, people are too stupid to make their own good decisions. Which is why government was invented.

And nowhere is this more obvious than with covid vaccines. People speaking against them are idiots.

What if I'm wrong? Yes, people will die.

But more people will die if you're wrong.

Being wrong cuts in all directions. And survival must take place with many possibilities of being wrong about a great many things. Survival does not stop to wait until we figure out what is absolutely right. Survival demands immediate wise action in the face of great uncertainty.

When a wild dog is charging at you, you don't have time to philosophize about whether he will bite you or lick your face. You must act NOW! And your action better be right or you're dead.

[Preety_India]

Simple simple simple 

If you have freedom, you are granted it with the precondition that you will use it responsibly. 

If you don't use responsibility 

Then your freedom is.......... Taken away. 

Surprise surprise!!! 

 

[Danioover9000]

   All this is making me question my new life purpose, again. So much for trying to provide value, when it goes against the norms of society.

[Parththakkar12]

@Danioover9000 That precisely is the point of Life Purpose! To change those norms, to create new norms that work better than the old ones. That's where the real value lies - beyond the current societal norms. All you have to do is make it profitable for yourself and for your society to change the norm.

[Danioover9000]

@Parththakkar12

1 hour ago, Parththakkar12 said:

@Danioover9000 That precisely is the point of Life Purpose! To change those norms, to create new norms that work better than the old ones. That's where the real value lies - beyond the current societal norms. All you have to do is make it profitable for yourself and for your society to change the norm.

   Wait, I thought life purpose was meant for me to find my deeper values, and provide my values onto society, no matter how small/niche it is, with whatever skillset I have? However, what happens when the impact I'm aiming to have on the world/society I live, the contribution I think I want to give, might get rejected because it's too new, like for example creating a new business or vocation, and most of society rejects it?

   This does make life purpose more individualistic and libertarian, in a way, but that could be wrong, unless it's sometimes the case?

[Leo Gura]

4 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

   All this is making me question my new life purpose, again. So much for trying to provide value, when it goes against the norms of society.

Changing the norms of society is our work.

But this requires lots of wisdom. You can change norms for better or worse. Much worse sometimes.

3 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Parththakkar12

Wait, I thought life purpose was meant for me to find my deeper values, and provide my values onto society, no matter how small/niche it is, with whatever skillset I have? However, what happens when the impact I'm aiming to have on the world/society I live, the contribution I think I want to give, might get rejected because it's too new, like for example creating a new business or vocation, and most of society rejects it?

If you are truly creative and innovative it is basically guaranteed that your work and ideas and creations will be rejected, demonized, ridiculed, and attacked.

The whole point of LP is to become so grounded in your vision that you are not shaken by such ignorant attacks.

Take a look at the work Gandhi or MLK or even Elon Musk. Elon Musk's Telsa was so short-sold by Wall Street traders that they almost forced Tesla into bankrupcy. But Musk's vision won out over their ignorance and look who's laughing now.

The majority of people are fearful, selfish, closedminded, and ignorant. Your job is to show them the way. Take their hand and lead them out from the dark into the light. Of course, as you extend your hand to them, don't be surprised that a few of them will bite you.

[Value]

46 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Changing the norms of society is our work.

But this requires lots of wisdom. You can change norms for better or worse. Much worse sometimes.

If you are truly creative and innovative it is basically guaranteed that your work and ideas and creations will be rejected, demonized, ridiculed, and attacked.

The whole point of LP is to become so grounded in your vision that you are not shaken by such ignorant attacks.

Take a look at the work Gandhi or MLK or even Elon Musk. Elon Musk's Telsa was so short-sold by Wall Street traders that they almost forced Tesla into bankrupcy. But Musk's vision won out over their ignorance and look who's laughing now.

The majority of people are fearful, selfish, closedminded, and ignorant. Your job is to show them the way. Take their hand and lead them out from the dark into the light. Of course, as you extend your hand to them, don't be surprised that a few of them will bite you.

Honestly this comment is profound.

[Tanz]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Changing the norms of society is our work.

But this requires lots of wisdom. You can change norms for better or worse. Much worse sometimes.

If you are truly creative and innovative it is basically guaranteed that your work and ideas and creations will be rejected, demonized, ridiculed, and attacked.

The whole point of LP is to become so grounded in your vision that you are not shaken by such ignorant attacks.

Take a look at the work Gandhi or MLK or even Elon Musk. Elon Musk's Telsa was so short-sold by Wall Street traders that they almost forced Tesla into bankrupcy. But Musk's vision won out over their ignorance and look who's laughing now.

The majority of people are fearful, selfish, closedminded, and ignorant. Your job is to show them the way. Take their hand and lead them out from the dark into the light. Of course, as you extend your hand to them, don't be surprised that a few of them will bite you.

@Husseinisdoingfine Ironically the same people the shorted Telsa is going long, at during the pandemic. A period of mass poverty and death, his company, along with other tech company is receiving the largest transfer of wealth in human history.  

How many of them are going to use their wealth to transform and elevate humanity? (mostly wealth they did not earn but received from insane money injection from the public in the past year)

Edited March 12, 2021 by Tanz

[Leo Gura]

40 minutes ago, Tanz said:

How many of them are going to use their wealth to transform and elevate humanity?

Very few, because someone who's serious about transforming society would not be playing the stock market game to begin with.

(Full disclosure: I do own some stocks as long-term cash storage vehicles)

[Tanz]

@Leo Gura There are not a lot of ways to store your money and have liquidity. Holding onto cash gets slammed by inflation.  Unfortunately, the easiest way is through equities which at the end of the day is a zero sum game-driven vehicle.  Hopefully, in the future, there will be an asset that brings out the better part of human nature.  

[Parththakkar12]

16 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Simple simple simple 

If you have freedom, you are granted it with the precondition that you will use it responsibly. 

If you don't use responsibility 

Then your freedom is.......... Taken away. 

Surprise surprise!!! 

 

Except of course that the definition of 'responsible use of your freedom' is decided by those who 'give you' your freedom. (Who gave them the right to give or take freedom anyways? Freedom is an absolute.) They'll decide that definition according to what serves them the most, not what serves you the most. Simple!

Edited March 12, 2021 by Parththakkar12