Do Most Women Prefer Men With A Big Ego?

[Frogfucius]

It seems to be that way. I don't know. Everything I have learned from dating 'experts' is basically to be the biggest, self-assuring ego you can be, and you'll get lots of women. That seems to be the case.

Women have interest in me initially, but then it fades and they become more interested in friendship, if any type of relationship at all. I'm passive, relatively low energy compared to the big ego guys, very unattached to things. I'm not weak or needy, just unassuming and meek. What I am does not spark sexual passion in women, at least not over the long term.

I don't think I have what it takes to ever maintain a romantic relationship. It's just not in my cards to pretend to be something I'm not. I think the only chance I'll have is with someone who is on the same path I am, and there aren't many out there I come across in ordinary life who are interested in the philosophical and spiritual musings that I am interested in.

I just feel like a steaming pile of dog shit. A failure. I can't maintain what other men can easily. I've tried pickup, I've tried online dating. Nothing has ever worked out. "Action, action, action" just brings me more frustration and doubt.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Frogfucius

[ajasatya]

i had to find my happiness alone. full realization. unconditional love. then i was able to find someone i'd like to be with.

if you're trying to be someone else to find a lover, you'll find a partner for someone else.

why don't you use this opportunity to achieve celibate (no porn, no masturbation, no sex)? you may get in touch with your deepest peace.

[Birdcage]

Women love men who have passion, self esteem and self worth, who know what they are doing, what they want and are sure they will get it. 

From the outside, it looks like a big ego. But actually(you know what it is,since the whole enlightment is about that)

maybe the reason you are meek is because you don't know what you want or just very comfortable with what you have right now which is completely ok. But since you posted, means you are seeking more. 

I can tell you that it is great that you are comfortable inside, but from the outside, we want passion, assertiveness. Not an attitude of 'meh, yea fine, I would like that but if not, then it's ok' We want an attitude of 'here I am, I'm great, i know what i want and i get it' without coming off needy or perverted. 

Hope it makes sense. 

[Birdcage]

Think of it that way; we as women ( sorry for generalizing ) usually buy into the life style, the aura and way of living of men if we want something great and long term. We want to feel secure, protected, desired and be able to confide in the man. 

If the guy is somehow meek, that comes off as weak and deep down we know we can't feel secure inside weakness or carelessness.  

Think of it as that exercise where you stand your back turned and the person behind you has to hold you when you let go. We wouldn't want to let go if the one behind will 'maybe' hold us or hold and then let go when he is tired. 

[Frogfucius]

@Birdcage Thanks for the insights. I'm not a zombie, I still have a personality. I'm still direct and decisive when I need to be. I'm calm and I watch my body language to make sure it isn't submissive. I guess I'm just not a living embodiment of passion and purpose. Never have been. And when I have tried to strum up those things, it may look nice externally, but internally it goes against my fabric, and so I suffer. I'm not comfortable with the notion of faking it until you make it. My authentic 'self' is not one women are magnetic too, and hence why I feel destined to be alone.

9 hours ago, iago iriarte arhatha said:

i had to find my happiness alone. full realization. unconditional love. then i was able to find someone i'd like to be with.

if you're trying to be someone else to find a lover, you'll find a partner for someone else.

why don't you use this opportunity to achieve celibate (no porn, no masturbation, no sex)? you may get in touch with your deepest peace.

Thanks. I'm working on being 100% happy being alone, and I can get there. But then I have this mind-fuck that I'm giving up and running away, because I couldn't make it. It's very challenging.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Frogfucius

[Emerald]

13 hours ago, Frogfucius said:

It seems to be that way. I don't know. Everything I have learned from dating 'experts' is basically to be the biggest, self-assuring ego you can be, and you'll get lots of women. That seems to be the case.

Women have interest in me initially, but then it fades and they become more interested in friendship, if any type of relationship at all. I'm passive, relatively low energy compared to the big ego guys, very unattached to things. I'm not weak or needy, just unassuming and meek. What I am does not spark sexual passion in women, at least not over the long term.

I don't think I have what it takes to ever maintain a romantic relationship. It's just not in my cards to pretend to be something I'm not. I think the only chance I'll have is with someone who is on the same path I am, and there aren't many out there I come across in ordinary life who are interested in the philosophical and spiritual musings that I am interested in.

I just feel like a steaming pile of dog shit. A failure. I can't maintain what other men can easily. I've tried pickup, I've tried online dating. Nothing has ever worked out. "Action, action, action" just brings me more frustration and doubt.

If you're trying to attract a lot of women and have a lot of sex, you'll need to be self-confident and fit the stereotype of the alpha. You can pick up a lot of women looking primarily for attention and a sense of worth through use of their attractiveness and sexuality. The sexual interactions between men trying to fit into the masculine ideal and women trying to fit into the feminine ideal, are primarily based on the confirmation of value and worth. Both sides are trying to mitigate the effects of a deep feeling of baseline inferiority and using the attraction of a person that resembles the opposite ideal to convince themselves that they are indeed worthwhile. If you go down this path, you must become the mirror for a woman's desirability and she must become a mirror for your power. But this is not the game to play for those seeking self-realization. Plus, it becomes as boring and redundant as masturbation after a handful of experiences.

If you're looking for a woman, you just need to be yourself and at that point it's a gamble. As a woman, it's quite uncommon that I find myself genuinely attracted to a man. But when I do get attracted to a man, I'm completely over the moon for him. But it's never because of any particular quality he has. It's simply because he is who he is. I like the whole person because that person makes me feel a certain way. Certainly, there are traits that are deal-breakers. But there are NO traits for me that are deal-makers. So, if no women are interested in you, it's because women tend to orient themselves in a platonic way to every other man but the one that they really really like. And they also tend to put on a platonic facade to the man that they do like. For her, if she's like me, rejection from the man she likes is a big blow, because she probably only likes that one guy and she likes him a lot. It's not as though she could just approach another one that was just as good. So, hiding attraction is very common for women.

[Frogfucius]

1 hour ago, blazed said:

There are all sorts of girls out there, when you're single you seem to focus on negative aspects in your mind like how every girl likes the ego, or the rich guy, or whatever.

Don't settle for types you think you wouldn't enjoy your time with, be picky like everyone else. Eventually you'll find someone and it'll be worth it, it might take 1 month, 1 year or 10 years, just keep doing stuff you enjoy in that time, work on your life, you have a very short lifespan my friend before you go full reset anyway, don't get attached to anything not your partner or yourself, only the moment.

 

Good advice. I am where I am at because of all of my so-called failures in my mind. I realize that the more this goes on, the more it’s meant to make me grow. When the time is ready, a good thing will blossom. The time may never be ready, however, so I’ll just have to accept that. I guess acceptance of the now, regardless of the situation, is what I need to focus on. That’s my inner demon.

 

@Emerald Wilkins Awesome! That opened my eyes quite a bit. Thanks for sharing your insights. Indeed, I’m not hung up on masculinity and being so-called “alpha” like I used to be. In my mind, I am an “alpha” solely because I’m becoming in-tune with my very nature of being. I don’t need to join in the chase of materialistic goods, pound my ego's chest, tell funny stories and be the life of the scene, or draw attention to myself in order to build up the illusion of dominance and charisma. But as someone who would like a relationship, I notice that that’s something I have to be more like in order to attract a woman for dating long-term (whether it's actually sustainable is another question). Otherwise, I’m seen as a low-energy, uninteresting, unattached person. The man who’s core values are consciousness, nature, and zen isn’t the man who has a plethora of dating options, at least not in my specific case.

That’s the paradox I’m facing. Why do I want this? To prove to my ego something, when I’m trying to dismantle my ego? Who am I to trust for what's best for me then, my lower self or higher self? Am I just using this spirituality stuff to mask the unfulfilled, selfish asshole inside? Am I fooling myself? So much struggle...

[Emerald]

50 minutes ago, Frogfucius said:

 

@Emerald Wilkins Awesome! That opened my eyes quite a bit. Thanks for sharing your insights. Indeed, I’m not hung up on masculinity and being so-called “alpha” like I used to be. In my mind, I am an “alpha” solely because I’m becoming in-tune with my very nature of being. I don’t need to join in the chase of materialistic goods, pound my ego's chest, tell funny stories and be the life of the scene, or draw attention to myself in order to build up the illusion of dominance and charisma. But as someone who would like a relationship, I notice that that’s something I have to be more like in order to attract a woman for dating long-term (whether it's actually sustainable is another question). Otherwise, I’m seen as a low-energy, uninteresting, unattached person. The man who’s core values are consciousness, nature, and zen isn’t the man who has a plethora of dating options, at least not in my specific case.

That’s the paradox I’m facing. Why do I want this? To prove to my ego something, when I’m trying to dismantle my ego? Who am I to trust for what's best for me then, my lower self or higher self? Am I just using this spirituality stuff to mask the unfulfilled, selfish asshole inside? Am I fooling myself? So much struggle...

Trust me. There are women out there that would be interested in someone like you. They're maybe less common to come across because your interests and values are a little less common, but they're around. Your feeling of inferiority is only a thought and emotion within your own awareness. You wouldn't feel that way about yourself if you were someone else looking from the outside. It's the identification that's the problem.

I assure you that the idea that you're uninteresting and all those other things are just more ego lies. The ego traffics in self-congratulatory thoughts and self-deprecating thoughts. So, one moment it might say "Look at all these low consciousness people around. Why can't people just be more aware (like me- secretly whispered and quickly repressed and forgotten)." The next moment it might say "I'm so different from everyone else. I'm such a social disaster. I'm like a child in a grown up body." It's always creating the separation and identification and these kinds of statements strengthen the ego attachment.

But I would buck the idea of alpha male altogether, as opposed to rewriting the definition of an alpha male. Whether an alpha male is the chest-thumping strong-man or the one who's in tune with the nature of his being, It's only extra baggage once an identification forms, because you want something from it. It's just another potential attachment that will become more and more difficult to let go of as time passes. Even the idea of becoming authentic could become an attachment.

But the very nature of seeking enlightenment is that seeking enlightenment is an egoic thing. It comes when someone is so unhappy with how things are that they can't stand it anymore. The happy and content don't seek happiness or contentment. Those free of ego don't seek to be free of ego. So, the ego in all its discontentment searches to add value to the self through self-actualization endeavors. Then, in the inevitable failing to add value to the self (as neither self nor value are real), there is a search for truth.  It's only when you let go of searching and the idea that you're inadequate that you can actually finally be where you've always been. This is enlightenment. It's only the ego and belief in its self-deceptions that clouds this from view. From this standpoint, you can see there is nothing wrong. You are not worthless or worthy. You are not significant or insignificant. You just are. And your being has un-shaking validity regardless of whether anyone else sees it or not. So much so that no concept could contain it.

But in the mean time, admit to your ego. Let it do what it does without resistance or judgment. There's nothing wrong there. Just observe it like a science experiment. Try to notice as much as you can without identifying with what you notice. Imagine if you identified with a thunderstorm and were constantly judging it for the rain and the lightning and the dark clouds because you didn't want to be identified with them and you labeled them wrong or bad. You can't stop the ego any more than you can stop a thunderstorm. You have an equal amount of control over either. The only difference is that the ego is an internally based natural process and the thunderstorm is an externally based natural process. But the distinction between internal and external itself is false. So, treat the internal goings-on in a detached way, just as you would viewing a sunset or any other natural phenomenon.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Emerald Wilkins

[aurum]

5 hours ago, Frogfucius said:

Good advice. I am where I am at because of all of my so-called failures in my mind. I realize that the more this goes on, the more it’s meant to make me grow. When the time is ready, a good thing will blossom. The time may never be ready, however, so I’ll just have to accept that. I guess acceptance of the now, regardless of the situation, is what I need to focus on. That’s my inner demon.

 

@Emerald Wilkins Awesome! That opened my eyes quite a bit. Thanks for sharing your insights. Indeed, I’m not hung up on masculinity and being so-called “alpha” like I used to be. In my mind, I am an “alpha” solely because I’m becoming in-tune with my very nature of being. I don’t need to join in the chase of materialistic goods, pound my ego's chest, tell funny stories and be the life of the scene, or draw attention to myself in order to build up the illusion of dominance and charisma. But as someone who would like a relationship, I notice that that’s something I have to be more like in order to attract a woman for dating long-term (whether it's actually sustainable is another question). Otherwise, I’m seen as a low-energy, uninteresting, unattached person. The man who’s core values are consciousness, nature, and zen isn’t the man who has a plethora of dating options, at least not in my specific case.

That’s the paradox I’m facing. Why do I want this? To prove to my ego something, when I’m trying to dismantle my ego? Who am I to trust for what's best for me then, my lower self or higher self? Am I just using this spirituality stuff to mask the unfulfilled, selfish asshole inside? Am I fooling myself? So much struggle...

@Emerald Wilkins gave you some good advice. As a man, your job is to own whatever you are, even if it's some nerd who likes to play World of Warcraft. I'm telling you right now, that guy could be amazing with women. The problem is 1) doesn't think he can and 2) that guy probably never leaves the house to ever meet anybody.

Don't look at trying to get good with women as being "anti-spiritual". I honestly believe anything can be used for spiritual work, even picking up girls. Sure, maybe you'll eventually realize it was all a bunch of bullshit and not worth your time. But that's the point. You have to get to that place where you can let it go, and you usually only will let it go once you have it.

Look at how your beliefs are influencing your future RIGHT NOW. You say that "it's not for you" and that action has gotten you no results. Do you think with those beliefs that you're going to get anywhere? No, you're going to exactly where you are, which is exactly what your ego wants. Stay the same. Don't change.

I call bullshit on guys who want to shit talk pickup because they're "more spiritually evolved". I predict that if we take that same guy, throw him in a nightclub and tell him to approach some girls sober he will either shit his pants or just make excuses about how its "stupid". Because it's scary. It can feel like suicide sometimes because it's such a threat to your ego.

At the end of the day, authenticity will make you attractive to women. But this is like a deep authenticity that should scare the shit out of you because you don't want to reveal those parts of yourself to other people. That's why no one wants to do it and so few guys are actually good with women. In fact, you may noy even know what it means to be authentic because most people are so covered in layers of ego delusion that they need a cleanse before they can even get close.

 

[Frogfucius]

@aurum I hear you. I don't shit talk pick-up, or think I'm holier than thou. The thought in my mind is: Why the fuck do I want this? To stroke my ego? I realize if I chased it day and night, I could improve or get results. I've tried it before, actually. The problem is, even when the women respond well to me, I still feel like a festering piece of shit on the inside. I feel like what I'm chasing is a fraud, and I'm tricking myself into wanting it just to satisfy my ego. I don't care about these girls, I care about my selfish desires. That makes me upset with myself, and the internal battle rages. I wish I was the guy that could rattle my bad feelings off with no problem, and just brush it to the side, become callous and oblivious to these things. But I can't. I question myself and my motives, bringing a sense of unease, and I guess women can pick up on it.

@Emerald Wilkins Yeah, you're right. I'm identifying with these negative thoughts and feelings. I think you nailed it when you said it's a gamble. That's really what it is. There's no guarantee in anything.

[aurum]

5 minutes ago, Frogfucius said:

I don't care about these girls, I care about my selfish desires.

And who told you that is "wrong"?

I understand what you're saying, and you're on point about a lot of things. But realize the game is played in the field AND out. If you want to get good with girls, like really good, you're going to have to handle these inner issues. Do it in congruence with your spiritual practice.

[philosogi]

Another woman's insight: 

Ego is not just what we think of as the "bad" parts of ego. Ego is our whole concept of self as an individual. The idea that you think you're unassuming and meek is an egoic self-identification. Just sayin! 

This woman likes a man who is above all else, present, loves talking about ideas, loves sex, who lovingly challenges, who plays with me psychologically but is not attempting to manipulate me, who is not intimidated but also not contemptuous. But different women like different things. If you share what you're interested in, you'll attract those people who are also interested in it. The jerks and whatever dudes I think you're talking about in your original post are lame and boring. And acting like those dudes are going to get you the quality of woman who is taken in by that BS. 

[David1]

@Frogfucius I agree with philosogi, you say you're not comfortable with 'fake it untill you make it' but that's exactly what you are doing now. What everybody is doing. You are just comfortable with the 'character' you're in now, and it takes alot of effort and discomfort to change that.

 

 

[Orange]

17 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

 

 As a woman, it's quite uncommon that I find myself genuinely attracted to a man. 

This is interesting, a question came up in my mind when I read this, how do you know when you are genuinely attracted to someone ?

[Pav]

-

Edited October 14, 2016 by Mat Pav

[Emerald]

3 hours ago, Orange said:

This is interesting, a question came up in my mind when I read this, how do you know when you are genuinely attracted to someone ?

The guy just lights me up emotionally and it's basically the highlight of my day, just to be around him. And also, he's always on my mind at most points during the day. It's unmistakable when I have a crush. I think most women are this way. That's why women are always talking about the guys they like to their friends. All other guys are just friends or acquaintances... not good or bad. Not unattractive or attractive. Not unworthy. They just aren't THAT guy that has the sparkles around him.

I think men generally have a general attraction to women and if a woman they find pretty is interested in them, they can devil up deeper emotional feelings if she's interested in a relationship. For women, (if they're like I am) the deep attraction has to be there already and it comes on quite randomly like a Cupid's Arrow.

The problem here is that many men believe that women are attracted to men in the same way that men are attracted to women. So, they try to improve themselves and put on a facade because they believe women are attracted to attractive traits and not whole entire people, because men are attracted to attractive traits as opposed to the whole person, at least initially. In the initial stages of attraction, to a woman a man is more than the sum of his parts. In the initial stages of attraction, to a man a woman is exactly the sum of her parts. So, when a woman is unattracted to them or rejects them the first thought is "What's wrong with me?" "For what REASON doesn't she like me?" "How do I make it so that she is attracted to me?" But there is no reason there because it's a completely emotionally based thing... and quite random. It like bubbles up from the subconscious mind at the onset of the attraction.

Now women have the same problem but opposite. Women largely believe (up until reality smacks us in the face and sometimes after) that men are attracted to women in the same way women are attracted to men. So, let's say that I'm attracted to "Jimmy" (made up name :p). So, the sun rises and sets by Jimmy. It's Jimmy Jimmy Jimmy Jimmy Jimmy. Then, Jimmy comes onto me and we get into some sort of romantic altercation. So, I feel like a million bucks because Jimmy seems to feel the same way about me that I do about him. And it's going to be AWESOME! But no!!! Jimmy just thought I had a nice figure and felt horny. He wants nothing more to do with me the next day. And of course, the next day I'm crushed to bits and feel used.

Anyway, if I'm attracted to someone, there could be a smarter, more handsome, more driven, more (fill in the blank) guy, but this guy won't steal my attention away from the one that I'm already attracted to. That said, I do have dealbreakers. There have been times when a man who has the sparkles has lost the sparkles. But there has never been a single trait that a man had to cause the sparkles in the first place.

[Frogfucius]

5 hours ago, David1 said:

@Frogfucius I agree with philosogi, you say you're not comfortable with 'fake it untill you make it' but that's exactly what you are doing now. What everybody is doing. You are just comfortable with the 'character' you're in now, and it takes alot of effort and discomfort to change that.

With the whole “fake it ‘til you make it” thing, that’s true, everyone does it. But it makes me feel bad inside, in all areas, not just dating. But when I am talking to a woman I am interested in, the facade is weighing more heavily on my awareness, and it upsets me. And let’s say I do get my ideal woman. What then? I’d be like a dog chasing a car – once I catch up to it, will I really know what to do with it? Can my persona (and hers; I know it’s not just me with this problem) sustain a genuine, deeper level relationship? Or is it some shallow, surface-level bubble that’s going to pop at the slightest touch? I think @aurum is right. I have to work on my internal and external congruently, otherwise I'm out of balance.

It just sucks. I don't know what the fuck I want, why I want it, or how to get it. I'm lost.

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

The guy just lights me up emotionally and it's basically the highlight of my day, just to be around him. And also, he's always on my mind at most points during the day. It's unmistakable when I have a crush. I think most women are this way. That's why women are always talking about the guys they like to their friends. All other guys are just friends or acquaintances... not good or bad. Not unattractive or attractive. Not unworthy. They just aren't THAT guy that has the sparkles around him.

I think men generally have a general attraction to women and if a woman they find pretty is interested in them, they can devil up deeper emotional feelings if she's interested in a relationship. For women, (if they're like I am) the deep attraction has to be there already and it comes on quite randomly like a Cupid's Arrow.

The problem here is that many men believe that women are attracted to men in the same way that men are attracted to women. So, they try to improve themselves and put on a facade because they believe women are attracted to attractive traits and not whole entire people, because men are attracted to attractive traits as opposed to the whole person, at least initially. In the initial stages of attraction, to a woman a man is more than the sum of his parts. In the initial stages of attraction, to a man a woman is exactly the sum of her parts. So, when a woman is unattracted to them or rejects them the first thought is "What's wrong with me?" "For what REASON doesn't she like me?" "How do I make it so that she is attracted to me?" But there is no reason there because it's a completely emotionally based thing... and quite random. It like bubbles up from the subconscious mind at the onset of the attraction.

Now women have the same problem but opposite. Women largely believe (up until reality smacks us in the face and sometimes after) that men are attracted to women in the same way women are attracted to men. So, let's say that I'm attracted to "Jimmy" (made up name :p). So, the sun rises and sets by Jimmy. It's Jimmy Jimmy Jimmy Jimmy Jimmy. Then, Jimmy comes onto me and we get into some sort of romantic altercation. So, I feel like a million bucks because Jimmy seems to feel the same way about me that I do about him. And it's going to be AWESOME! But no!!! Jimmy just thought I had a nice figure and felt horny. He wants nothing more to do with me the next day. And of course, the next day I'm crushed to bits and feel used.

Anyway, if I'm attracted to someone, there could be a smarter, more handsome, more driven, more (fill in the blank) guy, but this guy won't steal my attention away from the one that I'm already attracted to. That said, I do have dealbreakers. There have been times when a man who has the sparkles has lost the sparkles. But there has never been a single trait that a man had to cause the sparkles in the first place.

Refreshing to hear. But most women i would bet, are not like you.. Are they? My ex seemed to be, but i never felt she had sparkles for me. She never listen to me and always speaks. But she didnt look at other guys, i dont even know why. I even told her, idk why you with me, i wouldnt even date me, im so ugly :D.

[Frogfucius]

@Dodoster Now Emerald, or anyone, please correct me if I'm wrong, because I don't have much experience with relationships, only observations and feedback from women. But I think most women initially go through that “sparkle” stage at a very young age. At that time, it’s more of an innocent thing, and the girl is inexperienced with men and dating. It’s like a drug, and gives the young woman a very big “high”. But most of the time, the guy they’re into is also inexperienced, and also selfish and doesn’t really know what he wants. So he’s liable to burn her in a very big way. And since women are more in-tune with their emotions on average than men are, women then become on guard about blindly falling for some guy again like that. If they do start to feel those feels, they’re definitely more cautious and on guard with the man they’re into. It’s going to take much longer to fall for him than it did maybe when she was younger, because she still has that memory of getting burned. Most women I have dated have told me about that quote unquote "asshole" who burned her in the past, when she was very young.

I think maybe women with a lot of dating experience are more casual about things, and aren’t concerned about taking things too seriously. They kind of go with the flow, more like a guy would. I don’t know, maybe my point of view is skewed.

[aurum]

2 hours ago, Dodoster said:

Refreshing to hear. But most women i would bet, are not like you.. Are they? My ex seemed to be, but i never felt she had sparkles for me. She never listen to me and always speaks. But she didnt look at other guys, i dont even know why. I even told her, idk why you with me, i wouldnt even date me, im so ugly :D.

She is very much like other women. And much like a girl "knows" when she is head over heels for a guy, as a guy you'll know when she really wants you because it's usually very obvious.