What Enlightenment Really Is

[Dodo]

12 minutes ago, Elzhi said:

@Dodoster "Extra -lighted??" What the fuck?? You really don't listen, do you? All these things you're talking about are sensory sensations. Fullness, emptiness, pleasure pain, anxiety, fear. these words are relative. They have no place in the nondual paradigm. Your body knows these things and will survive regardless but these labels are meaningless in and of themselves.

Im sorry if you never felt what i am talking about, because if.you did, you wouldnt be saying this. There are infinite infinities in infinity. Believing you have the ultimate and only truth is disturbing my sentience 

Ps: i am already aware they are experiences. I am not referimg to the labels but to actual experience, which is real. And if its an experience that doesnt make it meaningless. Thats the entire meaning. Its a song. Every note matters, but you'd prefer if the melody is nice.

You cant say you would choose to be painfully tortured rather than be massaged by beautiful naked ladies with a happy finish.

Or would you? Weird.

Edited October 10, 2016 by Dodoster

[Elzhi]

@Dodoster I have the ULTIMATE and ONLY truth?? Am I not the same person who said you can verify everything I've said for yourself? At what point did I gain ownership over this truth which is accessible to everyone? At what point did I elevate myself above any other being? 

Good for you, you've evolved into a full-fledged new-age hippy. Please continue to pontificate about becoming enlightened through bullshit sensory experiences. Keep deluding yourself with fairy tales and magic fairy dust instead of seeking truth through empirical logic. I'll clap for you now. Bravo, bravo sir.

[Dodo]

1 minute ago, Elzhi said:

@Dodoster I have the ULTIMATE and ONLY truth?? Am I not the same person who said you can verify everything I've said for yourself? At what point did I gain ownership over this truth which is accessible to everyone? At what point did I elevate myself above any other being? 

Good for you, you've evolved into a full-fledged new-age hippy. Please continue to pontificate about becoming enlightened through bullshit sensory experiences. Keep deluding yourself with fairy tales and magic fairy dust instead of seeking truth through empirical logic. I'll clap for you now. Bravo, bravo sir.

Just to make you aware, that i made an edit to my post, the Ps part.

Now this...

Empirical, i am doing that. Not taking anything out of my experience for true. I am following my own experience. Why must you judge? You think you have it all figured out, dont you.

I am not seeking enlightenment through this, at least not your enlightenment. I dont want to turn into a judgemental forum ghost ? 

Thats why i later wrote extralightenment. Because i believe that knowing the truth and being happy is better than simply knowing some truth that makes you cranky and defensive

[Elzhi]

@Dodoster lol yes I'm now the judgemental forum ghost. My "enlightenment" is obviously no good. What the fuck do I know? It's not like I clearly outlined how destroy your ego which is the definition of "enlightenment". It's not like I've explained to you multiple times that in the nondualistic paradigm there's no distinction between happiness and unhappiness. Tell ya what, you like being high so much? You like floating around and all that cute shit? You like that cosmic shit? Why don't we shoot you and your fairy friends into outer space so you can be with one the clouds? 

[Dodo]

4 minutes ago, Elzhi said:

@Dodoster lol yes I'm now the judgemental forum ghost. My "enlightenment" is obviously no good. What the fuck do I know? It's not like I clearly outlined how destroy your ego which is the definition of "enlightenment". It's not like I've explained to you multiple times that in the nondualistic paradigm there's no distinction between happiness and unhappiness. Tell ya what, you like being high so much? You like floating around and all that cute shit? You like that cosmic shit? Why don't we shoot you and your fairy friends into outer space so you can be with one the clouds? 

Right on, o enlightened one, you seem a bit jealous about those still able to feel happiness? Maybe one day you will get out of this depression.

Go on, commit mass murder, be the next hitler. Dont forget to also kill all the children who are constantly playing and having fun. Because they are trully in the wrong here.

Life is definitely not about happiness. I bow to you wise one.

Edited October 10, 2016 by Dodoster

[Elzhi]

@Dodoster I'm now convinced that you're a lazy shit and you've literally read nothing in this thread. I'm NOT Enlightened nor am I angry. Just really amused and perplexed at how full of shit you are. Clearly you're a lost cause.

NEXT!

[Dodo]

13 minutes ago, Elzhi said:

@Dodoster I'm now convinced that you're a lazy shit and you've literally read nothing in this thread. I'm NOT Enlightened nor am I angry. Just really amused and perplexed at how full of shit you are. Clearly you're a lost cause.

NEXT!

Ok if you're not enlightened why are you eben talking.

I might need to post my initial question in another thread. It might surprise you, but i wasnt asking only you, but anyone who knows. If you don't,  there might be someone else who does.

Nice talk

PS: The True Goal of Life: http://youtu.be/NTh56DJ2_LQ

Is Rupert Spira a new age hippy or are your views somehow wrong? There is no other option im afraid ? 

Edited October 10, 2016 by Dodoster

[Deep]

23 hours ago, Elzhi said:

ARE YOU JOKING? Everything that you just wrote is bullshit. Snap out of it. Why the fuck would you need to stop stealing, practicing nonviolence. and accepting gifts? You don't even need to meditate. All you need to do is to start questioning everything about yourself and your life. The answers are right in your face, every day all the time. You don't need a fucking teacher or method. You can know this through your own experience

It sounds like you need to take a break from all of this. Either you're not very open minded or you're trolling very hard. You can't become enlightened by  questioning. The only thing that does is keep your ego thinking even more. The reason I said all that stuff is because when one succeeds in meditation an energy starts to rise from the base of their spine called the Kundalini energy. This energy slowly starts to move up your spine until it reaches your brain and that's when you experience Infinite consciousness. It's not a joke, many ancient cultures knew about this shit. If you don't want to listen to anyone, why the fuck are you here? 

Edited October 10, 2016 by Deep
wording

[Elzhi]

@Deep You and @Dodoster are a good example of the endless delusion in the new-age hippy circle jerk. You guys like masturbating to that new age shit and still aren't enlightened and want to tell me that YOUR method is the correct one or your version of enlightenment is more true. That makes a lot of sense. Nobody has anything you don't already have. It might do you some good to question why you believe in all this nonsense. Question everything. Don't believe me. Don't believe the gurus. Just question everything.

[ajasatya]

hello, @Elzhi .

i'm sorry for whatever you're going through in your life. and i'm sorry for everything you've been through.

we can't go very far only with intellectual pride and preciosity. where is your heart?

[Dodo]

9 minutes ago, Elzhi said:

@Deep You and @Dodoster are a good example of the endless delusion in the new-age hippy circle jerk. You guys like masturbating to that new age shit and still aren't enlightened and want to tell me that YOUR method is the correct one or your version of enlightenment is more true. That makes a lot of sense. Nobody has anything you don't already have. It might do you some good to question why you believe in all this nonsense. Question everything. Don't believe me. Don't believe the gurus. Just question everything.

Whatever helps you sleep at night man. Im already doing the questioning. Thats exactly what the gurus are saying, or are you blind

[Elzhi]

@iago iriarte arhatha Uhhh...I don't know what the fuck you're talking about but you new-age hippy zombies are actually creeping me the fuck out. Everything I've written is FACTUAL and LOGICAL. The only reason I write in an agressive tone is so you WAKE THE FUCK UP. EVERYONE IS FULL OF SHIT, ME INCLUDED. (As paradoxical as that sounds) We're not in lala fairy land. Don't listen to Tolle, or Leo, or Jed Mckenna, or Spira, Krishnamurti, or anyone. A teacher can only point you in the general direction. They can't GIVE you enlightenment. You wanna keep jacking off to kundalini and chakras, be my guest.

[ajasatya]

@Elzhi thank you. i really need your guidance. i shall include you in my list of spiritual teachers so you can be the only one there.

peace, brother. it's easier to see when we're calm, but you feel special because you want to shake things up. how can we be special if we aim for separation and do not value listening properly?

Edited October 10, 2016 by iago iriarte arhatha

[WaveInTheOcean]

"EVERYONE IS FULL OF SHIT"

Everyone can't be full of shit:> For there to be someone who is full of shit there needs to be someone who isn't. See, my friend. That is logic.

 

 

Edited October 10, 2016 by WaveInTheOcean

[Elzhi]

@WaveInTheOcean Language is an artificial, fictional system the same is logic, yet i must use these things to point you in the direction. I can't give you enlightment. Only you can find out for yourself

[WaveInTheOcean]

There's nothing to find out.

[Kserkkj]

This has just become a huge mess, everybody has a point depending how it's interpreted and there're just a multitude of interpretations, so yeah, describing enlightenment can vary for everyone, It can inspire you, delude you and stray you, or elicit just about any thought/ emotion out there. That's why there're so many teachers and styles of teaching. I wouldn't say it's counter-productive to learn from spiritual teachers, they have their point that may bring epiphanies to some. Also regarding "You don't want to be enlightened", is completely dependent on the perspective "You" is interpreted. Of course the ego will resist to the end in order to serve it's own purpose- sustenance.@Elzhi

[WaveInTheOcean]

"Think about the idea of systematically destroying everything you hold to be true."

Then think about, after that, actually experiencing absolute Truth. Not believing anything conceptually or intellectually, but directly seeing Truth. Become one with Truth. I'm not talking about "knowing truth", but about direct experience.

You haven't experienced Truth. You have only conceptually/intellectually grasped it. You post reflect that you, sure, have gotten some insights that are relatively more true than most ordinary people have - like your soundbyte analogy etc. But you haven't experienced absolute Truth.

"I realized that to be "ego-less" i.e. "enlightened" ... "

Go investigate who the "I" is that has be "ego-less" in order to become enlightened.

Enlightenment is not an ego-less state. It's just a self-realization/Truth state (of the ego itself)

Look. Life is dualistic. On and off. Reality seems dualistic:

on: Being seeing itself as ego.
off: Ego seeing itself as Being.

In both states ego remains. It's just what perspective ego has.

Enlightened people are just people who have experienced both the 'on' and the 'off'-state. 99,999% people have only experienced the 'on'-state.
Enlightened people have naturally not only experienced the 'on'-state but also seen the 'off'-state, and thus, by having directly experienced both states, one can see that both states are arbitrary and equally relatively true/non-true and that the on-state can't exist without the off-state. So thus by seeing this, one can directly see how the absolute Truth is a merging of the 'on' and 'off', a collapse of the illusionary reality/life into God/Absolute Truth/Non-Dualism. Enlightened people have directly experienced this. It's not something you can intellectualy, conceptually or logically grasp. Because intellect, concepts and logic all depend on that we believe dualism is the TRUTH (dualism = feeling of being a seperated self). 

My explanation here is just an analogy. You can only become it.

EDIT: Beliefs, pain, memory, time, dimensions only exist in the 'on'-state. In the off-state these are gone, because Being is absolutely infinite and can't be constrained to relative, finite concepts such as time, dimensions, pain, memories, beliefs.

Therefore, yes, you need to have a "will" to shake your beliefs in order to go from the on to the off-state. A "will" to be completely 'open'/empty. A will to empty your cup(=mind). An accept of not-knowing. Total surrender of all you hold dear, including the belief of being a seperated self/body-mind.

Or just take psychedelics - 5-MeO should do the trick. Note: In the transition from the "on" to "off"-state you might experience complete terror/hell, no matter if you make the transition with or without 5-MeO.

Edited October 10, 2016 by WaveInTheOcean

[Nahm]

Elzhi,

You could be happier and feel better. That's really the overall point here. Give meditation a try. Stick with it. There is something in you that lead you to Leo's site and motivated you to make comments. Be honest with yourself about that. It's ok man. Only in hindsight will you see who you were when you wrote such things, and you will be pleased to know the difference that has occurred within yourself. 

[Elzhi]

@Phil honestly, shut the fuck up.

@WaveInTheOcean My initial wording was wrong. Enlightenment is to be disidentified with the ego, not "ego-less". Aside from that, it's obvious that you haven't actually read everything on this thread. I NEVER CLAIMED TO BE ENLIGHTENED. You're literally just repeating everything that I've already said in this thread. Good job. Now we can continue posturing and acting like gurus.